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Sabre, it's not only not easy. It's horrible. And Buddha's prescription is horrible, if understood as oblivion, and the only thing to recommend it is that it's slightly less horrible than continuing in Samsara, which we now tend to think of as benign, being in a calm pocket of it.
"Death I don't mind. Every moment we are dying. Everything is impermanent. Who is dying? There is nobody dying. It is just a process. This is [merely a] law of nature....Everything in nature is arising and vanishing. There is nothing to be afraid of. In death also, smiling you can go. Every moment we are dying. Once you are acquainted with this, then it is simple."
Whoso delights in corporeality, or feeling, or perception, or mental formations, or consciousness, he delights in suffering; and whoso delights in suffering, will not be freed from suffering. Thus I say.
hp. 146-48
How can you find delight and mirth Where there is burning without end? In deepest darkness you are wrapped! Why do you not seek for the light? I.ook at this puppet here, well rigged, A heap of many sores, piled up, Diseased, and full of greediness, Unstable, and impermanent! Devoured by old age is this frame, A prey to sickness, weak and frail; To pieces breaks this putrid body, All life must truly end in death.
S. XXII. 30
Hence the annihilation, cessation and overcoming of corporeality, feeling, perception, mental formations, and consciousness: this is the extinction of suffering, the end of disease, the overcoming of old age and death.
i think its important to realize that things are not inherently suffering.
for instance i am drinking a pop right now. not really suffering. actually its enjoyable. with correct view, one can affirm life rather than negate it.
also a bodhisattva is put in an interesting position. no longer is there a difference between self and other. so if the world is suffering, the bodhisattva personally feels the suffering.
thus compassion arises. the suffering is empty, thus not grasped at. but the suffering is used to cultivate infinite compassion.
Is this what the Buddha taught though? He doesn't sound very life affirming to me. It sounds more like 'get out, quick, the sky is about to fall on you'.
This, truly, is Peace, this is the Highest, namely the end of all Karma formations, the forsaking of every substratum of rebirth, the fading away of craving. detachment, extinction, Nibbaana.
Is this a Mahayana sutra? Limitless jewels, gods realms and titans?
Do you see how different in tone this is from the Pali Canon, which tells us our life is aflame, we are fortunate to get a human birth, and we should practice for cessation before our bones fill yet another grave? Depressing though. But I want to lift my head to face reality.
haha i don't know. its been a couple years since i've come to buddhism. life has progressively gotten better. so imho what the buddha spoke about was to a certain audience with a certain disease.
the whole buddhist message is pretty life affirming. there is suffering and suffering has a cause. mess with the causes and you don't have suffering.
As we take away the perceptions of a self, the idea of cessation becomes less frightening. If we also detach from joy and happiness, disenchantment kicks in and the idea of cessation even becomes attractive. We are scared and think cessation is horrible because of wrong views. But we are already emptiness, so we may think there is nothing to fear (= fear of extinction), but actually there is nothing to fear (= extinction is a wrong view).
@PrairieGhost, The Buddha advised meditation on death. If you feel strong enough, pick it up when the mind is clear and joyful. Maybe with some guidance of a monk on a retreat.
Sabre, I don't think you share the view of extinction as oblivion. I know what cessation of self view is, or rather I remember it and know it isn't annihilation, because I've been through this before. I lost it after going on a drinking binge out of habit energy, but now I've given up drink.
I do remember that at that time, I was secure in a feeling of deathlessness, and much wiser than I am now, even though I could not prevent myself getting drunk, knowing I'd have to go through this all again. The habit energy from having been a heavy, habitual drinker, is very, very strong, though nibbana is stronger. Actually, I've done it four or five times, I lost count. Each time I came to this same fear of oblivion, and each time overcame it.
Sabre, I don't think you share the view of extinction as oblivion. I know what cessation of self view is, or rather I remember it and know it isn't annihilation, because I've been through this before. I lost it after going on a drinking binge out of habit energy, but now I've given up drink.
Good. Whatever nirvana will be like, there will probably be no beer!
Comments
If we see things this way.
-Munindra
A. III. 134
All formations are `transient' (anicca); all formations are `subject to suffering' (dukkha); all things are `without a self' (anattaa).
Whoso delights in corporeality, or feeling, or perception, or mental formations, or consciousness, he delights in suffering; and whoso delights in suffering, will not be freed from suffering. Thus I say.
hp. 146-48
How can you find delight and mirth
Where there is burning without end?
In deepest darkness you are wrapped!
Why do you not seek for the light?
I.ook at this puppet here, well rigged,
A heap of many sores, piled up,
Diseased, and full of greediness,
Unstable, and impermanent!
Devoured by old age is this frame,
A prey to sickness, weak and frail;
To pieces breaks this putrid body,
All life must truly end in death.
S. XXII. 30
Hence the annihilation, cessation and overcoming of corporeality, feeling, perception, mental formations, and consciousness: this is the extinction of suffering, the end of disease, the overcoming of old age and death.
for instance i am drinking a pop right now. not really suffering. actually its enjoyable. with correct view, one can affirm life rather than negate it.
also a bodhisattva is put in an interesting position. no longer is there a difference between self and other. so if the world is suffering, the bodhisattva personally feels the suffering.
thus compassion arises. the suffering is empty, thus not grasped at. but the suffering is used to cultivate infinite compassion.
this is worth checking out. he goes into dualistic buddhism and non dualistic buddhism.
the vision of both.
its something i've been studying. enjoy.
This, truly, is Peace, this is the Highest, namely the end of all Karma formations, the forsaking of every substratum of rebirth, the fading away of craving. detachment, extinction, Nibbaana.
Do you see how different in tone this is from the Pali Canon, which tells us our life is aflame, we are fortunate to get a human birth, and we should practice for cessation before our bones fill yet another grave? Depressing though. But I want to lift my head to face reality.
its been a couple years since i've come to buddhism.
life has progressively gotten better.
so imho what the buddha spoke about was to a certain audience with a certain disease.
the whole buddhist message is pretty life affirming. there is suffering and suffering has a cause. mess with the causes and you don't have suffering.
to many people this is great news.
Thanks again for all your help.
it can come in the form of frightening monster looking buddha.
or the peaceful calm looking buddha.
or a magical rainbow buddha.
infinite skillful means for infinite sentient beings.
@PrairieGhost,
The Buddha advised meditation on death. If you feel strong enough, pick it up when the mind is clear and joyful. Maybe with some guidance of a monk on a retreat.
Lotsa metta,
Sabre