Drowning

ThailandTom

Last night I was experiencing a strong sense of Dukkha, a lot of us know that 'Dukkha' can translate into a variety of English words and I was feeling a lot of them. Boredom, unsatisfactory states, anguish and a few other things. I looked at this and it is as if in my mind I am drowning and trying to grasp frantically at things as I drown, obviously things that cannot be grasped. I told myself 'what is the worst that can happen' and 'tomorrow is another day' and today is another day and I feel totally different, better. So, what phrases do you have or use that would help people who find themselves drowning?

karasti

I frequently tell myself that it won't kill me. I might be uncomfortable. I might really, really dislike it. I might sweat and stress. But X number of hours from now, it'll be over and I'll still be alive. I have to do this every single time I do any sort of public speaking type thing, even if it means simply leading a boy scout meeting. Also, often times at night my thought run away with me. What was a simple dr appointment during the day turns into "omg, what if so and so has cancer!?" and then I remind myself that come morning, things will go back to normal and I'll be able to think of it just as another appointment. Why things always look worse at night, I don't know, but for me that is very true. I just have to remember that the sun will come up and things actually will look brighter.

Nirvana

I call it hormones. So sorry if I'm not being helpful.

How do people survive to 25?????

Nevermind

This too shall pass.

robot

I had friend when I was a teenager who used say,
"good breaks, bad breaks, sometimes you have to sweat it out".

ThailandTom

karasti said:

I frequently tell myself that it won't kill me. I might be uncomfortable. I might really, really dislike it. I might sweat and stress. But X number of hours from now, it'll be over and I'll still be alive. I have to do this every single time I do any sort of public speaking type thing, even if it means simply leading a boy scout meeting. Also, often times at night my thought run away with me. What was a simple dr appointment during the day turns into "omg, what if so and so has cancer!?" and then I remind myself that come morning, things will go back to normal and I'll be able to think of it just as another appointment. Why things always look worse at night, I don't know, but for me that is very true. I just have to remember that the sun will come up and things actually will look brighter.

@karasti I can really relate to this, with me as well it is always at night, well not always but the vast majority of the time it is anyway. I did have hypochondria from 12-18 so I know about the cancer thing, that plagued me for years. Buddhism for me, a lot of it is controlling the mind and not letting the mind control me.

When my mum came to visit there was a saying that came popular between us that I started, 'deal with it'. It was because he wasn't accustom to the heat and stuff, and we eventually came to joke about this saying it did work for her.

Nevermind

That which does not kill me makes me stronger – Nietzsche

Of course that only works for over-men. :-/

pegembara

Tosh

If I'm feeling really bad, I do the A.A. Immediate Action Drill:

1. I ask a God I don't believe in to remove the defect (the negative feeling).

2. I phone someone/talk to someone about it (I've a bunch of phone numbers of people from A.A. on my phone) or even speak with Mrs Tosh. (I have no qualms about phoning someone and saying, "Hi mate, I'm having a bit of a tough time right now, so I thought I'd give you a call...". And when people phone me saying something similar, it makes me feel good that I can be of help to someone.)

3. I'll make amends if I've harmed anyone.

4. I'll turn my mind to someone I can help. This takes my focus off ME, which is the main cause of all my problems.

Instructions taken from page 84 of the Big Book.

Things I don't do, even if it feels like my arse is going to fall off:

1. Drink
2. Drug

For lesser negative mental afflictions, you know, that low level anxiety, I try to really feel the discomfort; put my concentration into it; be present. It tends to disappear because it cuts off the thinking that fuels it.

I also remind myself that whatever it is negative that I'm feeling/experiencing is impermanent (anxiousness mostly) and will pass. Impermanence has a good side also.

ThailandTom

When things get like this I tend to push people away, last night for example I wanted to be left alone in silence and so pretty much led there in silence trying to sleep, ignoring my partner. These little traits are selfish and stupid, these need to be addressed. Unlike you Tosh, I cannot muster up the will to talk to anybody who I know, it is not that I am afraid or feel ashamed, just that I cannot be bothered and see no point at the time. I kind of try to ride it out and like today for example, I woke up to a different day. I hope I can take a leaves from your book though Tosh, there is still enough time to do so.

Tosh

I isolated for many years, Tom. Yes, I could communicate on the internet, but I didn't want to do face-to-face, or telephone.

In my experience I also wasn't able to not isolate overnight; it was a slow process that I really didn't focus on. I just started going to A.A. and early on I volunteered to make the coffee. I liked that. It meant I just had 30 second chats with other A.A. members - nothing heavy - and then I could say, "Sorry, gotta go, I'm on the coffee!". And after the meeting, rather than feeling like I was forced to talk, I got busy with cleaning up and someone would help me and we'd chat as we got the coffee stuff cleared away.

It's like I came out of my comfort zone a little at a time.

And I don't think I need explain why isolating isn't good for anyone; it means we're locked in our own heads with our own perspectives, thinking about ourselves. It's never been a healthy place for me. I've gotta keep coming out of my comfort zone. I don't want to go to work right now; my comfort zone is here in front of the computer, but I'm going to hit post and get ready.

Take care.

federica

"Who knows what is 'good'...?
Who knows what is 'bad'...?
It is what it is."

Zero

ThailandTom said:

So, what phrases do you have or use that would help people who find themselves drowning?

Learn to swim - know your limits.

riverflow

The writings of Seneca have gotten me through some moments last year:

'We let ourselves drift with every breeze; we are frightened at uncertainties, just as if they were certain.' ~ Seneca, Letters (XIII)

karasti

When you are feeling alright during the day, you might want to (if you didn't already) explain to your partner that sometimes you just feel that way, that it has nothing to do with her and that once you wake up things will feel better. I do that with my husband so that he is not left laying awake wondering what he did wrong when 99% of the time it was nothing to do with him.

One time we were on a drive back home from a shopping trip 2 hours away. Somehow during the day I got in a horrible mood. I didn't say a word on the way home, when he asked me questions my response was "yes" "no" or "whatever" This left him feeling really worried that I was angry with him and he didn't know why. The next day I explained to him that sometimes i just get in a mood, and that if I am upset with him I will make sure to talk to him about it. Otherwise, I'll be fine, but sometimes I just need to be left alone to deal with my bad mood and it's best if I don't interact with people and pick fights and stuff for no reason.

I've gotten better about this, thankfully, The shopping trip episode was about 18 months ago and I've not allowed it to happen again. I still get in bad moods on occasion but I'm better at warning those around me.

LOL the "Just deal with it." Is something I use with my teenager quite often. It works well! Sometimes, that is really all you can do.

chela

When things are going really badly in my life, my father always says, "Remember: it could be worse." It never made me feel warm and fuzzy, but it is true. And from what I have read, some prominent Buddhists have illuminated the fact that if we go out and help those less fortunate than ourselves, we gain a sense of compassion for others, plus contentment in our own lives. So if we compare our woes to those going through worse woes (or think about how our lives could actually be worse), we do gain a sense that things are not so bad, after all.

MaryAnne

If you can change things- change things. If there is no way at all to change things - then accept things.
It is what it is.

Nevermind

federica said:

"Who knows what is 'good'...?
Who knows what is 'bad'...?
It is what it is."

I know anchovies are bad. :werr:

Theswingisyellow

Whenever my mind is caught up in dukkha, I tend to edge closer to it. I sit with it. It is very hard sometimes to sit with anger or depression. When these things arise, initially I get caught up in them, but there comes a point (I am getting better at reconizing this point) where I see where I am at and what kind of state I am in. I stop myself and sit with that state. These negative mindstates have been my most power teachers. I get close to them, feel the burn and pain from them and can relax into that and let them be. By sitting with them one recognizes them for what they are-emotions. They are put into a proper context and their power and grip slowly recedes.
All the best,
Todd

Theswingisyellow

@Tosh-
"I'll turn my mind to someone I can help. This takes my focus off ME, which is the main cause of all my problems."
"For lesser negative mental afflictions, you know, that low level anxiety, I try to really feel the discomfort; put my concentration into it; be present. It tends to disappear because it cuts off the thinking that fuels it."

Awesome suggestions!! :thumbsup:

karasti

Naming the feeling takes away a lot of it's power over you. Sometimes I'm just all out of sorts and have to stop and ask myself what I am feeling. Then I try to look at why. By the time I get done with the process, the feelings have often passed. Or I done as someone else suggested and remind myself that it will pass, that it's temporary. Sometimes when I feel negative it's harder to do, but then I just tell myself "Remember how crazy happy you were the other day? Well it passed, clearly, since you are feeling full of anxiety now...but that will pass too."

The other day I was all crabby after deciding I would go out and do something when I had a lot going on at home. Instead of accepting the decision I made myself and enjoying my time out, I stewed about how crabby I was and ruined my time and my mom's. Part way through, I stopped and asked myself how I was feeling. Crabby? yes, but it was more than that. Anxious and stressed because I knew I had a lot to do at home and maybe I should have stayed home to do it instead. Then I realized I had already made the decision to leave the house, so I could either continue to be bitchy and ruin it and be even crabbier at the stress that awaited me at home, or I could choose to enjoy the time away before I had to return to the stressful stuff at home. In reality, I was crabby for hours over something that took a matter of about 45 minutes to deal with. What a waste of time.