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Mental Retardation & Genuineness

I was at the bookstore the other day with my girlfriend of 4 years and we were sitting down looking for a true crime book worth reading, as we were browsing a guy looked of about the age of 25 turned down the isle and started looking at the books at the start of the isle, I glanced over because nobody had by in awhile, however when I glanced, I had to look at him again, and I got this immediate feeling of somebody so genuine, innocent, thoughtful, caring, just a good human being... I turned to the books and kept browsing while this thought was still on my mind, he eventually got close to us during his browsing moving down the isle and asked my girlfriend her name, I knew right away he obviously had a huge problem as far as his cognitive skills were concerned, everything he uttered was slow and basic, but by looking at him I wouldn't have necessarily guessed he had a problem. He continued to ask my girlfriend basic questions such as "do you go to school?", "how old are you?" "do you like reading?", "what genre?", things of this nature, the whole conversation with him dragged on for over 2 hours, and though I wanted to leave, I just felt so bad for this guy, but at the same time I was thinking, maybe he should feel bad for me, this was the kind of person that no bad thoughts come to his mind, has no sense of worry, no conception of money, no lying, no stealing, no anger, has no desire of sex, no vengeful thoughts, no stress of life, this person just goes along with life just enjoying it and is always happy, I couldn't bare to just cut this guy off and say hey look we gotta go, so I just let him talk to her for 2 hours while listening, apparently it made him happy talking to her, he would ask me questions too... But mainly her because she has that kind of outgoing talk to anybody personality, where I don't really have that and I guess he sensed that.

I sure this is a normal thing, I know it is actually, this was just the first time I conversed with someone that was mentally retarded and thought I would share the experience as I personally think it is interesting.

Comments

  • ZeroZero Veteran
    I'm sorry, I find the term you use to describe this person quite offensive - the analysis presented is questionable in my mind also - I'm sure it wasn't your intention.
    DaltheJigsaw
  • I work with people with developmental disabilities and I have found the majority to be very genuine. If you ask a question, be prepared for the unvarnished truth.
    JeffreyWisdom23
  • I have an autistic step brother who is very direct. He makes a great effort to participate somehow, but if you are making him uncomfortable he will tell you directly "go away yous". He is very endearing though, just he gets nervous at times.
    Wisdom23
  • Zero said:

    I'm sorry, I find the term you use to describe this person quite offensive - the analysis presented is questionable in my mind also - I'm sure it wasn't your intention.

    I apologize that you find it offensive, but that's what it's called, if people want to throw the word "retarded" around as an insult, they can do that, but that is not at all what I was doing.
    DaltheJigsawInvincible_summer
  • Jeffrey said:

    I have an autistic step brother who is very direct. He makes a great effort to participate somehow, but if you are making him uncomfortable he will tell you directly "go away yous". He is very endearing though, just he gets nervous at times.

    My cousin has autism, but what I encountered with this guy was way different than my cousin, you can have an extremely advanced conversation with my cousin, but only if he is really interested in it, he is always in his own little world and you can't make him do anything.
  • Your cousin is probably aspergers if he can have advanced discussions. My step brother does things like point out his backstreet boys t-shirt and asks you to see the christmas decorations (he loves holidays). His life is pretty much watching Disney and other cartoons over and over and over again. He will also understand something if it happened in a video he watches.
  • Jeffrey said:

    Your cousin is probably aspergers if he can have advanced discussions. My step brother does things like point out his backstreet boys t-shirt and asks you to see the christmas decorations (he loves holidays). His life is pretty much watching Disney and other cartoons over and over and over again. He will also understand something if it happened in a video he watches.

    Maybe, I grew up with him and his life pretty much consists of that too, watching cartoons, will get extremely fixated on one thing and wont let it go, if he wants something he wont stop talking about it until he gets it, yet he is capable of advanced ideas and such which I have heard from many people is different from most people that have autism.
  • BunksBunks Australia Veteran
    I had a similar experience in the local swimming pool recently @JosephW. I was there with my daughter and I saw a young guy (about 15 maybe) chatting to an attractive young girl in the water. I must admit my initial reaction was that he was trying to chat her up!

    Anyway, as I was leaving I was trying to pick up my daughter's floaties, back pack, swimming noodle etc. and he came over and offered to help. I could tell he was a little different but thought it was sweet he offered. He ended up carrying things out to my car and putting them into the back for me. He then stood and smiled and waved at us as we drove away.

    Very sweet young man......
    DaltheJigsaw
  • Bunks said:

    I had a similar experience in the local swimming pool recently @JosephW. I was there with my daughter and I saw a young guy (about 15 maybe) chatting to an attractive young girl in the water. I must admit my initial reaction was that he was trying to chat her up!

    Anyway, as I was leaving I was trying to pick up my daughter's floaties, back pack, swimming noodle etc. and he came over and offered to help. I could tell he was a little different but thought it was sweet he offered. He ended up carrying things out to my car and putting them into the back for me. He then stood and smiled and waved at us as we drove away.

    Very sweet young man......

    Yeah, this man offered to help us find a crime book, he said he would try his best, he seemed really outgoing and asked if we could be his friends and was very polite.
    Bunks
  • karastikarasti Breathing Minnesota Moderator
    Mental retardation isn't really a term that is used to describe them anymore. Handicapped, developmentally delayed, etc is more appropriate these days. I didn't think you meant to offend anyone by any means, just a general FYI.

    My stepsister has Down's Syndrome. She is definitely an honest and genuine person, but she has pitfalls like the rest of us. She steals things, she gets in fights with roommates (she lives in an assisted living apartment place), she has lost her job because she hit people. She's actually pretty bright and she knows these things are wrong. She is almost 30 but operates more around the mentality of an 8 year old. So, understands right and wrong, and consequences but often doesn't have the ability to foresee and doesn't as easily learn from her consequences. But she's incredibly happy and loving and gives her smiles and love to everyone she meets. She participates in Special Olympics and it's SUCH an amazing event to volunteer with or even just to watch. I think everyone should go and see the courage displayed there.
    BunksToshInvincible_summer
  • ZeroZero Veteran
    edited March 2013
    JosephW said:


    ...this was the kind of person that no bad thoughts come to his mind, has no sense of worry, no conception of money, no lying, no stealing, no anger, has no desire of sex, no vengeful thoughts, no stress of life, this person just goes along with life just enjoying it and is always happy...

    I guess in the UK we're plagued by political correctness - I'm not aware of that label being used - this is the culture I'm habituated to - I wasn't offended by you - I myself find that term offensive.

    It's tough reconciling an overarching label like that - for me it harks back to a period where various conditions were packed into one big 'backward' box.

    It was the above that I found questionable - it sounds more like an assumption of what that person was experiencing based on an assessment of that person's outward ability (or lack of in this case) to interact in line with an expectation of an average interaction.
    Straight_Man
  • Psychology today
    http://www.psychologytoday.com/conditions/mental-retardation

    Wikipedia
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mental_retardation


    Apparently it is also called Intellectual disorder aswell, I guess either one could be taken offensively, but it's called what it's called.

  • vinlynvinlyn Colorado...for now Veteran
    JosephW said:

    Zero said:

    I'm sorry, I find the term you use to describe this person quite offensive - the analysis presented is questionable in my mind also - I'm sure it wasn't your intention.

    I apologize that you find it offensive, but that's what it's called, if people want to throw the word "retarded" around as an insult, they can do that, but that is not at all what I was doing.
    Isn't it funny that when it comes to political correctness, intent has no meaning, but when it comes to karma, intent is everything (to some people).

    I'd tend to give Joseph the benefit of the doubt here based on this:

    "The terms used for this condition are subject to a process called the euphemism treadmill. This means that whatever term is chosen for this condition, it eventually becomes perceived as an insult. The terms mental retardation and mentally retarded were invented in the middle of the 20th century to replace the previous set of terms, which were deemed to have become offensive. By the end of the 20th century, these terms themselves have come to be widely seen as disparaging and politically incorrect and in need of replacement.[1] The term intellectual disability or intellectually challenged is now preferred by most advocates in most English-speaking countries. The AAIDD have defined intellectual disability to mean the same thing as mental retardation.[2] Currently, the term mental retardation is used by the World Health Organization in the ICD-10 codes, which has a section titled "Mental Retardation" (codes F70–F79). In the future, the ICD-11 is expected to replace the term mental retardation with intellectual disability, and the DSM-5 is expected to replace it with intellectual developmental disorder.[3][4] Because of its specificity and lack of confusion with other conditions, mental retardation is still sometimes used in professional medical settings around the world, such as formal scientific research and health insurance paperwork." (wikipedia).

  • karastikarasti Breathing Minnesota Moderator
    I can only speak for my experiences, but the people and families I know with mentally disabled people strongly dislike being called "mentally retarded" even in a clinical sense. The US Census kept the word "Negro" on the census forms until now, too, but that doesn't mean it wasn't offensive to many. I'm not trying to shame Joseph, it's just something to be aware of. If you were to meet the young man's family and said "Oh I really enjoyed meeting your mentally retarded son" their reaction would likely not be favorable.
  • My parents were both school psychologists and referred to their clients as mentally retarded. This was back in the 80s of course. Yes it's good to be current on names so as not to offend anyone.
  • vinlynvinlyn Colorado...for now Veteran
    And for that matter, keep in mind that they are now dropping the term aspergers.
  • What do they call aspergers now?
  • JeffreyJeffrey Veteran
    edited March 2013
    Personally I feel proud that I discovered it was NOT assburgers :)
    vinlynBunksDaftChrisInvincible_summer
  • karastikarasti Breathing Minnesota Moderator
    lol They are, yes, but what does that have to do with anything? I disagree with their dropping of it, actually.
  • vinlynvinlyn Colorado...for now Veteran
    Karasti, my impression is that it's that "euphemism treadmill" mentioned above. At our school we found aspergers a perfect descriptor for a certain set of behaviors that would lead to a certain set of responses/treatments. And ironically, one day we were talking about a retired teacher and the difficulty she had maintaining positive working relationships. Someone said, "Duh! Isn't it clear she's aspergers?" And it was like a light bulb went on in all our heads about this lady. I think had we realized when she was still there, we could have better worked with her.
  • JosephWJosephW Veteran
    edited March 2013
    Changing what they refer to it as because it has become offensive over a period of time is asinine. Myself I have Epilepsy, I have friends with Epilepsy aswell, they get offended when they are referred to as Epileptics, not in the place of human beings, just when the subject arises, and for the life of me, even with me, having severe Epilepsy cannot grasp how it is offensive! Now I can totally understand how referring someone that has Mental Retardation is way more offensive than referring to an Epileptic as an Epileptic, as people use the word "retarded" as an everyday insult, so I apologize again, but I just was telling a story, and if people actually read it instead of being fogged by the correct term they would see I was saying very nice things about the man.
  • Straight_ManStraight_Man Gentle Man Veteran
    Well, cognitive disorders and Epileptic problems can come together. I tend to skip phrases sometimes while typing, or seem quite abrupt. I am also epileptic, @JosephW , and only about a Gram a day of Depakote generic keeps me from grand mal seizures at random. Other drugs did not work for me, they dulled my intellect too much. I am somewhat an atypical epileptic.

    What happens with the terms going out of favor is that they get abused, then the abusive usages become more commonly used, then the words become associated with their abusive usages. I am blunt-affective partly due to the Depakote and other meds, sorry if I have offended.

  • Well, cognitive disorders and Epileptic problems can come together. I tend to skip phrases sometimes while typing, or seem quite abrupt. I am also epileptic, @JosephW , and only about a Gram a day of Depakote generic keeps me from grand mal seizures at random. Other drugs did not work for me, they dulled my intellect too much. I am somewhat an atypical epileptic.

    What happens with the terms going out of favor is that they get abused, then the abusive usages become more commonly used, then the words become associated with their abusive usages. I am blunt-affective partly due to the Depakote and other meds, sorry if I have offended.

    I am known to be a little to blunt aswell, and apparently it is due to my 3,000 MG of Keppra a day. A common side effect, however no excuse.
    Straight_Man
  • Straight_ManStraight_Man Gentle Man Veteran
    True, I also offer no excuse and try to edit to be less blunt, but understanding helps. Agreed?
  • What good does sugar coating do anyways?
  • Straight_ManStraight_Man Gentle Man Veteran
    Well, it helps to know modern terms for younger folks, older terms for older folks, though sometimes telling who is which can be interesting....

    But sugar coating softens the blunt blows for the sensitive ones. If you use a term they accept, you are seen as sympathetic-- somewhat at least.
  • I just feel that it's about intention. I like communicating without having to worry about referring to a thesaurus to find an alternative word that means the same thing to soften the "blow".
  • Straight_ManStraight_Man Gentle Man Veteran
    Well, sometimes perceived insults BLOCK communication reception. Me too, really, I like being myself as to vocabulary when talking or typing.
  • JosephWJosephW Veteran
    edited March 2013
    touché, however if that would turn the person I am trying to talk to off, they are probably not that rational of a person to speak with anyways, but I find this to be a problem to me when speaking to people I know, not people I don't know... People that have known me for many years and we bump into this, I find a problem, other way around, understandable.
  • karastikarasti Breathing Minnesota Moderator
    Seriously? My son is on the autism spectrum. If you referred to him as retarded, no one would just ignore it and go on with conversation. It would stop the conversation dead the same as using derogatory words like the N word. When people around you are telling you something you say/do is hurtful in some sense, that doesn't make them all wrong. To me, insisting on calling a group of people retarded when you have been told that it is no longer acceptable to many, is what is irrational.

    The clinical term itself is of course harmless. But because many other people have taken the word to be harmful and insulting, that is the meaning it carries for many, many people now. You remind me very much of Randall in Clerks II wanting to take back the term "porch monkey." Some things change because they need to change. Refusing to accept that makes you irrational, not everyone else.

  • NirvanaNirvana aka BUBBA   `     `   South Carolina, USA Veteran
    edited March 2013
    If you referred to him as retarded
    The way I larnt it was first you prove the "If," before you go onto the "Then."


  • karasti said:

    Seriously? My son is on the autism spectrum. If you referred to him as retarded, no one would just ignore it and go on with conversation. It would stop the conversation dead the same as using derogatory words like the N word. When people around you are telling you something you say/do is hurtful in some sense, that doesn't make them all wrong. To me, insisting on calling a group of people retarded when you have been told that it is no longer acceptable to many, is what is irrational.

    The clinical term itself is of course harmless. But because many other people have taken the word to be harmful and insulting, that is the meaning it carries for many, many people now. You remind me very much of Randall in Clerks II wanting to take back the term "porch monkey." Some things change because they need to change. Refusing to accept that makes you irrational, not everyone else.

    Alright.
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