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Are Gay People Evolved Humans?
comicallyinsane
Veteran
I didn't know where to put this so I figured here might be good. This is a theory I came up with the other day. I have a friend who is a lesbian and she told me she still has a small attraction for guys. I told her that this is just nature and she agreed.
Then I am watching Star Trek the next day and watching an episode where there is this race of people with no sex. Well the two ideas started coming together.
Now some people say that gay people do it as a choice. Some scientists say there is a genetic difference. I don't know myself. I was thinking that maybe gay people are the next step. The problem is that society is very closed minded which make some of these people look like freaks. I think maybe they are the first step to humans reproducing asexually. But evolution is very slow. It's hard to say if there is more gay people now than in the past because of a lot of them kept quiet because of societys' reaction.
What do you all think?
Then I am watching Star Trek the next day and watching an episode where there is this race of people with no sex. Well the two ideas started coming together.
Now some people say that gay people do it as a choice. Some scientists say there is a genetic difference. I don't know myself. I was thinking that maybe gay people are the next step. The problem is that society is very closed minded which make some of these people look like freaks. I think maybe they are the first step to humans reproducing asexually. But evolution is very slow. It's hard to say if there is more gay people now than in the past because of a lot of them kept quiet because of societys' reaction.
What do you all think?
0
Comments
I wouldn't really say that homosexuality 'evolved' in any real sense, though I would say that it is likely there is a genetic aspect. What I would say is that homosexuality was/is not a species-promoting trait (in the sense of procreation). However, now that we have established ourselves in such high numbers as a species, this along with other genetic traits have recently had the opportunity to flourish, as it does not threaten the survival of the species, at large, anymore. Considering the overpopulation issues we are facing, it might even be turn out to be a bit of a genetic form of population control. I would imagine that this trait (of being attracted to the same sex) has existed for some time, but has remained suppressed, or unexpressed more so than today.
Anyway, I don't know whether that answers the question in any way, but I thought it might be at least a bit of food for thought.
_/\_
metta
How about those species who are born neuter, or bisexual? Do you consider that homosexuality too?
Actually n1n2's post kinda spells my view on that - but I believe that it's actually possible for all of us, including heterosexuals, to have become homosexuals in a certain point of our life. I'm not making stereotypes here - but an astonishing number of lesbians, among to street lore, comes from all-girls schools, although this might not be true in turn for all-guys schools. Either girls have a higher tendency to turn lesbian around puberty, or lesbians just like to go to all-girls school. Personally I subscribe to the former, but this is a really touchy viewpoint.
More "evolved"? Seems to me that the goal of evolution is to have more of your own copies around.
Anyway, this is kinda personal, but I feel that perhaps being lesbian is alot more natural than being gay (note that I have no discrimination against the latter as I do not for the former) - is this a personal thing, a guy thing, or what?
If you are happy all the time, have you not attained something the rest of us are still searching for?
-bf
But, when I asked Jer this - it wasn't meant with any judgement or criticism. We sent many messages back and forth regarding it and to me, it was just finding out something else about someone I've met. Not an opportunity to judge or tolerate.
I've asked Yoda how she found a man that would put up with her - and she didn't get too offended.
I think it's all in the way that we interact with people. And truly, someone who is homosexual may find it very difficult to respond as to their orientation because of crap they've had to deal with in the past. Maybe... possibly... if you ask them with the compassion that we show all people - it might give them the opportunity to relay feelings that they normally have to repress in a repressive society.
I've heard comments like this about people who have disfiguring human conditions. It's the people that act afraid of them and say, "Ooooh!, gross!" that is truly offensive. If someone asks them about their condition in a truly compassionate way - the people don't have a hard time talking about it. In fact, they like having the opportunity to discuss it with someone who truly seems to care.
Caring is the key in all of our human conditions.
-bf
Would it make us more evolved if we removed the sexes? Or would it be a mistake of nature?
All animals evolve in nature - but there is some reason for this cause of change. What are you suggesting as a cause of change what why should it be considered being "more evolved"?
Creation is the process of nature. Being asexual or unable to reproduce in a sexual manner kind of goes against being able to further the evolutionary process, doesn't it?
-bf
As to answer to the question what is causing this possible evolution I don't know. Do you have any thoughts on it?
there has always been the argument about nature versus nurture (is it genetic or is it environmental?) I feel it is a combination (personally more genetic-I feel), as I think you act according to how you feel you wish to act.
I tend to associate my "inner being" as bi-sexual (although I have NEVER had a same-sex partner sexual encounter of any sort, so I suppose I mean psychologically I'm Bi-sexual ie. think like both sexes in a sexual way, but I don't feel physically sexually inclined towards bisexuality) does this make sense?? And therefore I'm no further advanced or evolved than anyone else (except perhaps buddhaFoot:crazy: )
ComicallyInsane, it seems very interesting that you should come up with this theory, because my wife said something very similar a few years ago-she feels that there is a level of difference biochemically perhaps that modifies or is perceived to be evolutionary, in Homo/lesbian/bisexuality, I doubt it-but what would I know?:crazy:
Personally, I would like to draw your attention to this article on human sexuality-especially the "Kinsey scale" of sexuality.
I hope i haven't let the cat out of the bag.....:werr: :winkc:
cheers,
Xray;)
People have wisdom teeth pulled because we no longer need them. Says who? What if humanity once again finds themselves in the position for needing another set of teeth later in life because they've worn down their initial set of adult teeth - then who would say wisdom teeth aren't needed.
I don't believe it's an evolution. I just think "it is". And that's all it really amounts to me. If it is something that brings someone happiness and they find peace within their lives - I'm cool with it. To me, homo/hetero-sexuality is neither here nor there.
But - you could be right. Evolution is very slow and who knows that it has in store for us all.
-bf
Yo comically, and BF,
There is a story about Japanese electronics engineering-the story goes, that they design the product with the usual amount of parts and then progressively remove them until it stops working-this is how they make their products 15 to 20% cheaper.
Tis is only a rumour-however.
although that pollution control crap on your engine could improve price out of sight!
This sounds like my other thread.
I think the same way-years ago I thought whoa! homosexuality/lesbianism/bisexuality:eekblue: now who really gives a hoot? I think that no one REALLY cares about another's sexual orientation anywhere as much as we used to.
I must have missed that one CI
A bit of a tangent here, but I just read a study by a physical anthropologist that documented peoples in Africa who actually have fully functional wisdom teeth simply because their skulls and mouths are shaped differently and have plenty of room to accommodate and use an extra few teeth. They don't have them removed because they actually erupt from the gums and don't get stuck down there to rot and cause problems.
And back to evolution, is it being suggested that we are moving from Homo sapiens to, say, Homo homo?
Sorry...
Many of my friends with AIDS used to say that acquired immune defficiency was a holographic symbol of the poisoning of the ecosystem. Others saw it as an evolutionary attempt to wipe out a destructive species.
'Evolution' is used as a blunt instrument to try and explain some aspects of ourselves that remain unexplained. I find it far more worrying that we observe little or no evolutionary change in Homo Sapiens since the genocide of Neanderthal Man.
It seems that the best scientists of today still cannot explain well enough why has there been the sexes in evolutionary history. Specialization? Xenu? Nobody knows for sure.
Social Darwinism has been a by-product of this evolutionary fanaticism in the past century. Obviously it sucks. It seems that evolution ought to best to left to she who truly understand it - Nature.
Well I guess I got out-of-point with the previous few paragraphs anyway, but I seem to find it slightly discriminative for even some atheists to feel homosexuality uncomfortable. Sometimes it even feels like it's "forbidden" to side with the homosexuals because thus then you will be branded as one yourself. To me, it seems that at times, the problem seems to be that some people still view homosexuals as being incapable of true love themselves - only interested in sexual relationships - and such stereotypes seem to generalize the entire homosexual population. :rockon: They seem to treat it as a "right" that only heterosexuals may have. Human rights, people!!!
There's the type of Buddhafoot comment that I miss! So glad to see you back!
Actually your first few paragraphs had some input to the discussion. Your last one didn't. :ot:
Are twins freaks?
As for wisdom teeth, the reason, evolutionarily speaking, that we have such problems with them is because of our big brains, believe it or don't. If you want to have some fun sometime, find a picture of an ape skull from the side. Draw a grid over it and note where the cross lines meet. Then get a similar picture of a human skull and match the points on the human skull with the same points on the gorilla skull (OK, you need to know a little anatomy to do this, sorry). Then redraw the gridlines. What you see will be quite amazing. The lines over the brain case are greatly expanded, while the lines over the jaw area are greatly reduced, sort of like a fan that is broad at the top and narrow at the bottom. That is because the skull is a unit, and what affects one part of the skull affects the whole skull. By expanding the brain case to accommodate the big brain that makes us human, we have lost the big, powerful jaw that apes (and early man) used to crunch stuff that our puny jaws could never crack. And part of the decrease in size and robustness of the jaw is reflected in the plight of the poor wisdom teeth. The jaw simply doesn't have room for them anymore, so they become impacted or grow out at crazy angles, and we have to have them removed to prevent abcesses and so forth.
OK, that's your Anatomy 101 lesson for today. There will be a quiz on Monday.
Palzang
This illustrates what a namby-pamby diet we have today, in comparison with what they used to eat.
We simply do not need such huge jaws, since our diet is so much more refined and 'manageable'.
Just as Palzang illustrated with the Gorilla comparison.
-bf
(Translated, this means:
"Listen buster: keep your opinions to yourself, because even though we may not say much, we can sure swing a cudgel and whup yo' ass!")
Yup.
Those ladies didn't say much, but there again - did they need to? :grr:
Nagging has a universal language of it's own.
Good point, Freddie. Thank you for bringing that up.
-bf
Palzang
Palzang
Hello by the way! How are you?
Adiana:usflag:
I'm just noting how we deal with deviance from conditioned conceptual programing. Down to the level of photon pathway theory, there are unexplained deviations within naturally occuring systems. I am not saying anything about evolution, because I am not prepared to make that case, nor do I care to. That's way off topic as far as I'm concerned.
To me, my prctice is resting in a place from which I am of able of a compassionate respone to what is, rather than address why it is "this" or "that" way.
-metta
The whole point of this discussion has nothing to do with anyone's practice. This whole discussion IS about evolution.
Well I didn't actually, except for one episode of the anime.
There were aliens without libido, without stomachs and abdomens, whom humans tried to mate with because they wanted their superior genes for the purposes of "evolution". They reproduced via some telepathic system of sexuality, cross-breeding with humans to become "neutralised" as humans themselves, as their offspring grow increasingly alike to them and voila - the new human of the future.
Sounds pretty weird, huh?
And evolution = revolution = practice
Palzang
And who's your witnesses of the entire process.
What are you talking about? I think you just post things just to post them. I started this discussion to talk about an evolutionary theory I have, not to hear people talk about their feelings. This isn't the "hug each other and cry" thread.
One major difference between the human species and other animals is the way in which we avoid environmental pressure and find technological ways of countering it. This is why we have been able to survive in so many different ecospheres with minimal adaptation of physiology.
You yourself, Comic, live in a place which should be totally inimical to human existence. It is through technological advance that a city exists there at all. It has stopped the pressures that might have provoked evolutionary adaptation - or extinction.
In the light that consciousness is partial develing into questions such as possed addresses observations of impressions only. I post to question why does one give energy to such things.
Whensomeone gives the required energy one is fisting, release of that energy one is handing. The question as possed was answered by someone who sees it as the dog chasing it's tail philosophy. Then again, you already have pronounced you're continually looking for a fight. One is defined by what one does, not by how one feels inside.
If you want to have a look at the issue one must look back to the ancients. In early Roman and Greek times art with great phallus were very prevellent. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phallus
Bisexuality homsexuality was a very common practice, usually enacted on the lower by the privelleged. Often as pedophillia perform on slaves. It was acceptable to be known as a giver, not so much to be on the recieving end.
Continue with your "evolutionary" discussion, by all means.