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Time

taiyakitaiyaki Veteran
edited February 2011 in General Banter
Vertical time is the present moment, the now. It's what surfers call in the zone or rather anyone whose just totally immersed in an act would call in the zone. I catch myself going...huh 6 hours went by whoa.

Horizontal time is past, present, future. It's our normal time we have. Oh, it's 6 I need to eat at 8. I'm going to watch my favorite show. Horizontal time helps with planning, etc.

Our relation to time causes many problems. Sometimes we have too much time and we get bored. We go crazy. We kill time. When we have little time we also go crazy.

Time is also a commodity. Time wasn't always like this. Actually it was a modern invention. With the industrial revolution came this ingenious idea to pay people by the hour. Prior to the IR, time was just meh we'll do it when we feel like it.

So now in the culture we live in time is money. Time is of the essence. Don't waste any time! Don't be lazy! Buy more things so you can use them in time.

We live in a culture that just assumes things and we totally believe that thats how it is. But where is time? Where in time do we exist? Where is and what is the present? Where does time come from? What is the source of time? Is time coming from us or inside of us? Is the present moment just the future rushing to become the past? What is the past? Where is the past?

I've learned that you can only think about the past and future right now. You can also in a way travel time by thinking of the past and future. We can change the and change our present by simply changing our relationship to the past.

So and so hurt me a year ago. I have a choice. to forgive and let go or to keep it within myself forever and forever. But this choice exists now. I think most people forget that we can choose to move on right now. Actually we can only do it right now. When tomorrow comes that is tomorrows present. and in that present is right now. Life is just a constant now.

The past is very important because you are the accumulation of the past. But the past is just the past. If you're a practical person, you will realize that you can only shape the future by working right now.

I think about the future all the time. Day dream about it. Should I do this or not. I map out my future all the time. Every single time that I actually experience the moment it never lines up completely with my thinking. The moment is always a surprise to me.

Our body moves 1/16th the speed of the mind.
Our minds race. Thinking about tomorrow. The future. The past. Thinking thinking thinking thinking thinking thinking.
This is what really causes the stress in our lives. Horizontal time is practical but we overdo it. Planning things is great if only we stopped there. We worry and stress out.

Wo how can we reduce stress and anxiety about the future? Try to be in vertical time. Try to be present. Stop everything you are doing and just look at things. People watch. Watch the birds. Listen to the clock. Listen to some music. Watch your breath. Ground yourself in your body. Feel what it is like to be in a body. Since the body moves slower do it. If you need to think use a pen and paper. Write things down. That way you don't have to constantly go insane by thinking about the same thing over and over again. Just be here now. Do something for the joy of doing it. Just do something based on process rather than an end result. Sit in silence. Eat in silence. We all know how to touch that timeless zone. We've gone there with art. We've gone there with amazing experiences. Like watching an awesome movie. It's okay to relax people. Just be present for a change.

In the bible the sabbath was a day you worshiped god. On this day you didn't work because that would be disrespectful to god. I think the function of this is great. A day where we don't work. It might be worth while to set up a day where you just don't do anything. A day where you just appreciate what's in front of you. Working is great. We all have to earn a living but we all have to learn to rest and everyone is a bit different so we all own it to our bodies and mind to find out how to rest. But all true rest has a common meeting ground, just being present.

With love.

Comments

  • Time is subjective, I generally pay no attention to it. I still tell what "time" it is by looking at the position of the sun/moon. Someones comes up to me and says

    "Do you have the time?"

    I'll generally stop what I am doing, look up, and say something along the lines of "Its after noon"
  • edited February 2011
    or in my case, usually its the middle of the night!!
  • Speaking of time, how much does it take to finish reading this wall of text? It hurts my eyes. :p
  • taiyaki seems to be copy pasting long documents from his/her computer, how about some simpler statements?
  • Time is never time at all. You can never ever leave, without leaving a piece of youth.
  • Here's a simple statement. You think and you make time. You don't think then where is time?
    Before thinking there is no time. Time is thinking. No thinking equals no time. Just be here now and relax.
  • edited February 2011
    I like this: :coffee:

    The only reason we feel, experience, think of, or whatever..., time is because we're a teensy bit of Infinite Mind currently stuck in these biological forms. We are "time-aware" since biology is ultimately based on chemical reactions and chemical reactions occur in time.
  • taiyaki- I think that in your OP you made a very good case for the examination of the emptiness of time through thinking. I think that thinking and reading can be a big help in coming to the realization of the emptiness of time. Thats what I think.
  • taiyaki- I think that in your OP you made a very good case for the examination of the emptiness of time through thinking. I think that thinking and reading can be a big help in coming to the realization of the emptiness of time. Thats what I think.
    Yes, but it useless as information. We have to apply it to our lives and experience it all. This is how we acquire wisdom.
  • We acquire wisdom through study, contemplation, meditation. Lots of thinking involved. Or you could simply post "be here now", and let the chips fall where they may.
  • Lol oh Ram Dass!
  • Past is history, future hasn't happened yet.

    Live now.
  • There is time. In deep or expanded concentration, time seems to cease. But when insight occurs, when the mind is clear enough to observe the constant arising & passing of phenomena (say simply the arising & disappearing of each in breath & out breath), the disappearence or 'using up' of time will become clear.

    The Buddha advised each person to ask themselves: "The days & nights are relentlessly passing; how well am I spending my time?"

    :)
  • okay - that was a really long read but if you want the answer to What is time?

    Time is an illusion
  • "The now" in most meditation is usually still a bit of past and future. You already know a thought is always something about past and future and it takes up a piece of time. But even without thoughts, there can be the very subtle expectancies, remorse etc. They are also reflections of past and future.

    You can make the now smaller and smaller. I don't know where it stops yet, haven't gone that deep. But for now I think you can not go indefinately deep into the moment.

    Therefore for now I don't think time itself is an illusion, but the importance we give it is the illusion. Time just passes, because things change. Change makes time, rather than time makes change. But what you do with your time it depends on the way you observe this moment.
  • @Sabre - Time is an illusion. The importance we give it, i.e. making it "real" is ignorance.
  • But things change, and change takes time. Something can not change without passing of time. So how then can time be an illusion? It's right in front of you.
  • What came first? Change or time?
  • What do you think?
  • Change for sure. Time is man made. Time is a concept. It's not a physical thing.

    your thoughts?
  • Then what do you guys think about the Kalachakra Tantra??

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kalachakra
  • Then what do you guys think about the Kalachakra Tantra??

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kalachakra
    From the wiki page

    "The Kalachakra Tantra is divided into five chapters[2], the first two of which are considered the "ground Kalachakra." The first chapter deals with what is called the "outer Kalachakra"—the physical world– and in particular the calculation system for the Kalachakra calendar, the birth and death of universes, our solar system and the workings of the elements.

    The second chapter deals with the "inner Kalachakra," and concerns processes of human gestation and birth, the classification of the functions within the human body and experience, and the vajra-kaya; the expression of human physical existence in terms of channels, winds, drops and so forth. Human experience is by some described in terms of four mind states: waking, dream, deep sleep, and a fourth state which is available through the energies of sexual orgasm. The potentials (drops) which give rise to these states are described, together with the processes that flow from them.

    The last three chapters describe the "other" or "alternative Kalachakra," and deal with the path and fruition. The third chapter deals with the preparation for the meditation practices of the system: the initiations of Kalachakra. The fourth chapter explains the actual meditation practices themselves, both the meditation on the mandala and its deities in the generation stage practices, and the perfection or completion stage practices of the Six Yogas. The fifth and final chapter describes the state of enlightenment (fruition) that results from the practice"

    Hence please do not get stuck on the English name of Tantra.

  • Time is useful. It allows us to function. It also gives us a sense of urgency to accomplish things. Without the sense of time/change we cannot perceive impermanence.

    The perception of time also causes stress ie. "My time is running out. I am late for an appointment."

    When there is no sense of time we are living in the now.
  • Without the sense of time/change we cannot perceive impermanence.
    Sorry Pegembara - but which one is it, in your opinion, that we need to perceive impermanence? Time or Change?

    Just want clarity on your post so that I may comment
  • Time is both duration and succession. It is the eternal and the break down of the eternal. Time only can exist with an organism that is aware. Time exists. It's just as empty as everything else.

    We think and we recreate yesterday. We think and we construct a tomorrow. We can only do these two actions in the present moment.

    Try to run away from now. Good luck yo!
  • DhammaDhatuDhammaDhatu Veteran
    edited February 2011
    The "present moment" passes away quite quickly. In reality, there is no such thing as "the present moment". To my knowledge, the Buddha never spoke of a "present moment".

    In the suttas, the Buddha said: "Whoever sees the present dhammas, direct & clear, just as they are, is unshakable, immovable, secure. They should accumulate such moments" (MN 131).

    Now, the ultimate aim of Buddhist practise is the see the arising & passing of these "present dhammas". The "present dhammas" are impermanent. When this is seen clearly, it will be seen there is no present moment because, what is regarded as the present moment, passes away constantly.

    The notion or experience of the "present moment", imo, is a relative truth. In ultimate truth, imo, there is no present moment.

    Kind regards

    :)
  • CloudCloud Veteran
    edited February 2011
    Time is clinging to the experience of change. When only the present moment exists, and there is no self to be found, time is a conventional usage of the world only.
  • Change for sure. Time is man made. Time is a concept. It's not a physical thing.

    your thoughts?
    Well, if you think change came before time, than you are saying one thing came before the other, so than there is time.
    :D
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    There is no present moment. But there is such a thing as being present in the moment.
  • seeker242seeker242 Zen Florida, USA Veteran
    edited February 2011
    I used to think that time was not that important and that it does not really exist, etc. But then I thought about how the passage of time is synonymous with dying and one day there will come a time to die. This makes the passage of time very important! :)
  • Yeah the more you think about time and death the more you want to practice harder. Life is short. Get on with it.
  • Actually, thinking about death is a practise that leads directly to the goal. This the Buddha taught. It is not necessary there be a separate practise.

  • Without the sense of time/change we cannot perceive impermanence.
    Sorry Pegembara - but which one is it, in your opinion, that we need to perceive impermanence? Time or Change?

    Just want clarity on your post so that I may comment
    Perception of change gives rise to perception of time. Time is change. No change, no time.


  • @pegembara, Exactly. :)
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