Pipe smoking for meditation and contemplation

dreameruk

Hello everybody.

I've been lurking for a couple of weeks but thought it time I said hi and posted on the forum.

So what are your thoughts on pipe smoking for meditation and contemplation?

A lot of great thinkers over the years have used the pipe to quieten the mind.

To name but a few..
Mark Twain
Albert Einstein
Theodor Geisel (Dr Seuss)
Alan Watts
Alexander Graham Bell
J.R.R Tolkien

“I believe that pipe smoking contributes to a somewhat calm and objective judgement in all human affairs.”
-Albert Einstein, 1950

“A pipe is to the troubled soul what caresses of a mother are for her suffering child.”
-Indian Proverb

I've read a post on here about smoking but I feel pipe smoking is a different thing all together. I understand that it my over time cause harm to the body but so does eating junk food. I feel life is about getting a balance between what is good for you and what is enjoyable (sometimes they can be two very different things).

Thank you for taking the time to read the post and I hope to hear from you all soon.

Ben

federica

Tobbacco is a toxin. or at least what's in it, is.
Now, many Buddhists smoke, and many don't. Many think that smoking is covered by the 5th precept, others don't. The choice is yours.
But contemplation, while inhaling something that is ultimately poisonous to your system, just doesn't seem to be a very logical thing to do.
Do you?

I know of people who smoked pipes who had their tongues removed due to cancerous growths.
If you believe that smoking a pipe is conducive to your mental and physical well-being, then do what you feel you want to do.

But all those wonderful quotes are just musings.

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/479680

Yacababy

I must agree with Fede. While pipe smoking may be calming and conductive of thought I believe it causes more suffering than good down the road. It may also cause the suffering of others when a smoker lies in a hospital bed (not trying to be negative) and their loved ones have to watch their decline in health.
Naturally I choose to live and let live, so to speak. But for me smoking is a no no ^_^ good topic
Jen

zombiegirl

i don't know about meditation, but i know that smoking provides a very convenient pause when i'm writing. i quit smoking cigarettes about a year ago, but i have started buying non-tobacco/non-nicotine cigarettes for writing purposes. i don't know what it is about it, but it seems to be helpful for me during my editing process after hours of writing. if i had never smoked, i think i might feel differently, but as is... it's just a habit i've formed that i can't seem to let go of.

FyreShaman

I smoked one for a number of years, in the days when it was thought less harmful than cigarettes. That bit was true, with respect to the lungs. However, mouth cancer and throat cancer are a high risk - Google some pics and stopping becomes pretty easy.

There is a long history of smoking tobacco in shamanic practice, but I'm assuming it entailed inhalation to have an effect on the mind.

Focusing on the breath is, of course, much easier with a bronchial wheeze, but I wouldn't recomemnd it.

GuyC

Hi Ben,

I used to smoke a pipe...nothing good came of it.

I feel life is about getting a balance between what is good for you and what is enjoyable (sometimes they can be two very different things).

There are plenty of pleasurable things in life but I have found that with many of them the drawbacks are greater than the pleasure. I recommend trying to discover some forms of pleasure which ARE good for you (big hint: meditation).

Metta,

Guy

aMatt

You might notice that people use smoking as a chance to meditate. Some people cling to pipes, some to beads, some to music, some to inscense, some to cushions... if any of these objects are needed, they are like training wheels. They might keep us upright when learning, but our movement is seriously limited by our attachment to them.

For instance, what if you are in a place where you can't smoke a pipe? Abandon mindfulness?

Use them or don't, but they are unnecessary. The basic mind is the same without ritual objects.

With warmth,

Matt

compassionate_warrior

Pipe smoking can cause mouth and throat cancer.

hermitwin

If you are aware of the consequences & still wanna do it,
do it.
Just like junk food, man.

Zayl

I do the same with my hookah. The entire process of packing and setting up the pipe takes time and must be done with care. Then the act of smoking, possibly passing the hose to a few friends as well as carefully managing the heat is very calming. A lot of people think its a little too much work for just smoking, but it is about the overall experience and it encourages being mindful while smoking, as making any mistakes will have a negative impact on the smoke.

dharmaphile

Yes, pipe smoking is an aid to contemplation, without a doubt.
If you don't fancy the throat, tongue and mouth growths, you could smoke hash in your pipe and just put up with the paranoiah!

Zayl

Haha, smoking pure hash from a pipe would be counter-productive in the meditation department methinks. Although I never got paranoid when I used to do that.

mithril

not an option.

Sabre

I used to smoke hookah too, indeed it can calm you. But it's no meditation and it is not good for your health (no middle way thing ) So now it is just standing there, doing nothing.

Zayl

Well hey at the very least Hookahs can make a nice decorative piece, even if you don't smoke out of them.

Sabre

And they are great for gathering dust, means you don't have to vacuum that often anymore.

PeacefulAssemblyChur

OK, I smoked for most of my life. I “quit” many times. I'm definitely done now. I still get urges. I liked smoking … I don't recommend it.
I also don't want to hassle people who do.
Anywho, I'm surprised no one has mention this:

One smoker says to master, “I would like to smoke while I meditate. Do you think I should?” Master says, “No, I don't think you should.”
Having heard this, a second smoker says to master, “I would like to meditate while I smoke. Do you think I should?” Master says, “Yes, I think you should.”

hermitwin

As the air become more polluted, we are all smoking
whether we like it or not.

StaticToybox

Health issues aside I can definitely say that smoking can foster contemplation. Usually when I smoke I'm doing absolutely nothing else, so it's just me, my cancer stick, and my thoughts.

StaticToybox

As the air become more polluted, we are all smoking
whether we like it or not.

It amazes me how some people will complain about a person smoking in an outdoor area, but think nothing of the semi truck passing by belching thick clouds of noxious fumes into the air.

dreameruk

Thank you all for taking the time to read and reply to the post.
I agree with both sides of the argument but there is something to be said for being on your own with a pipe, maybe with soft music in the background.
Like Zayl said it's not just the smoking that's important, it's the preparation and care taking before, during and after smoking.

Well I hope you all have a wonderful weekend and thanks again for your feedback.

Ben

Theswingisyellow

Tobacco is addictive and causes all sorts of health problems. Better to just use your current situation (whatever that may be at that time)to be mindful. If per chance you do become addicted to nicotine, it is a very hard drug to drop, should you decide down the line you don't want to smoke anymore. I wish you the best.
Todd

mithril

It amazes me how some people will complain about a person smoking in an outdoor area, but think nothing of the semi truck passing by belching thick clouds of noxious fumes into the air.

The truck is moving. The person is either moving very slowly or not at all.

For example in restaurants - if a truck moves by, the fumes last for a few seconds; or else gets chased away by someone annoyed by the sound. If a smoker sits at the next table, a cigarette lasts for most of the meal, and usually has a great chance of getting 'reincarnated' into the next cigarette when the first one's out; no one, since its an environment where people are usually trying to be extra polite, will go chase away someone for smoking.

Otherwise, please don't do THAT. The "nah killing 100 people with a stick is nothing, the atomic bombs killed thousands anyway". Evils are not to be compared among each other Not that i don't agree on that the pollution sucks.

Jeffrey

I don't think tobacco can ruin meditation. It is very bad for longs. A pipe is much better than cigarettes but its still bad for the mouth. I like it too particularly because of warm caring memories on my father smoking a pipe. That could aid meditation.

ric03

I think the health risks are relative to how you smoke the pipe. When they were common, many people used to chug away like a steam train burning the mouth and tonuge. Pipe smoking has changed, and largely become a hobby where people will relax at the end of a day ("sipping" different blends--much like someone who likes a glass of wine) rather than puffing all day on one. I think nowadays many (myself included) smoke very slowly, just enough to keep it lit (which is the best way to draw flavour out of the smoke and keep it cool).

According to reports, it is the 8-10+ pipes a day smokers who are really at risk. Smoking moderatley, the risks are only about 3% higher than none smokers for mouth cancer and 1% higher for lung cancer. It also said in the SG report that pipe smokers live on average 3 years longer than none smokers. Go figure!

Personally, I love a pipe. Keeping the briar or meer well maintained and my favourite tobaccos in nice jars. Tasting lovely natural tobacco in a good pipe; there are so many delicious flavours. It's a really satisfying pastime and teaches you discipline and patience. It sure comes close to meditation simply for relaxing you and when the two are combined you are looking at serious downtime

BloodyCactus

I enjoy a pipe, only about twice a month do I have one tho. I don't use it for meditation etc. Current favourite tobacco is McClelland Holiday Spirit. A nice strong cup of tea and a pipe out on the back deck while my wife works on her second novel.

vinlyn

Hello everybody.

I've been lurking for a couple of weeks but thought it time I said hi and posted on the forum.

So what are your thoughts on pipe smoking for meditation and contemplation?

A lot of great thinkers over the years have used the pipe to quieten the mind.

To name but a few..
Mark Twain
Albert Einstein
Theodor Geisel (Dr Seuss)
Alan Watts
Alexander Graham Bell
J.R.R Tolkien

“I believe that pipe smoking contributes to a somewhat calm and objective judgement in all human affairs.”
-Albert Einstein, 1950

“A pipe is to the troubled soul what caresses of a mother are for her suffering child.”
-Indian Proverb

I've read a post on here about smoking but I feel pipe smoking is a different thing all together. I understand that it my over time cause harm to the body but so does eating junk food. I feel life is about getting a balance between what is good for you and what is enjoyable (sometimes they can be two very different things).

Thank you for taking the time to read the post and I hope to hear from you all soon.

Ben

I'm not going to tell you about all the lung (and other forms of) cancer, heart disease, and emphysema in my family (oops...guess I just did), but what I would like to address is your thinking on the matter.

The fact that Mark Twain, Albert Einstein, Dr. Suess, Alan Watts, Alexander Grahham Bell, and Tolkien smoked doesn't make it good or bad. After all, we could probably come up with a list of non-smokers who were great thinkers, too. You're clutching straws to justify your habit. That, in my view, is wrong thinking.

aura

The pipe is an ancient meditative spiritual tradition, not of Buddhism, but of Native America, and had much in common with mindfulness of breath meditation, metta meditation, and the meditative and social aspects of both tea ceremony and incense. A pipekeeper had much in common with a lama, and the spiritual tradition had much in common with the bread and wine spiritual traditions of Christianity. The ancient tradition was as far from tobacco addiction as Christian religious bread and wine ceremonial communion is from alcoholism.
Unfortunately, modern tobacco is typically loaded with toxic carcinogenic herbicides, pesticides, chemical fertilizers, genetic manipulation and genetic engineering all completely contrary to the ancient spiritual tradition.
Sometimes the ancient tradition is still recognized by people of past life Native American experience, even lifetimes later.

Mountains

Pipes may have a long tradition, but the fact is, there is not a single redeeming quality to tobacco. It is poison, period. It does *no* sort of good for *any* part of your body, and quite the opposite, is harmful in any amount to some degree. It's just not worth using it. Except of course that its continued use is job security for those of us who work in health care!

Jeffrey

Mountains, isn't that a bit extreme to say it has no redeeming quality? There are pros and cons. I can think of a list of things it has: gets you to appreciate the outdoors, feel peaceful when you smoke, fiddling with things (packing, lighting, different pipes, tobacco varieties, how to keep pipe lit), enjoyable smell and taste, interaction with antipsychotics, and memories of parents (one of my first 20 words was pipe).

I would also point out that pipes are a very good venue to enjoy nicotine. You can only smoke once per day per pipe you have. You do not inhale the smoke into the lungs. You cannot smoke when it is quite windy. You cannot smoke when it is too cold. All of those things mean that you smoke rarely and enjoy what you do smoke. Rather than getting into a pattern where you are unconsciously indulging.

IronRabbit

Tobacco is highly addictive whether one smokes cigars - cigarettes - pipe - chews - dips. In fact, scientists have found, for instance, that nicotine is as addictive as heroin, cocaine or amphetamines, and for most people more addictive than alcohol. So, despite the many ways in which one can enjoy and relish all the rituals of smoking - it is at once highly addictive and highly self destructive. Purely air dried - additive free - tobacco leaves processed are just as addictive as commercially processed - additive laden tobacco products. These are just facts - irrespective of the individual complexity of each indivudual's tendency toward addiction who uses tobacco. Some get hooked - some don't. Some smokers sicken and die - about 500,000 individuals annually - some live long stinky lives.

Tobacco can be characterized as a medicine - recreational herb - spiritual ally - or a poison.

Which of the following poisons is the most deadly?

1. Arsenic

2. Strychnine

3. Nicotine

If you guessed # 3, you are correct. The lethal dosage for a 150 pound adult is 60 mg. The lethal dosage for # 2 is 75 mg and the lethal dosage for # 1 is 200 mg. In other words, nicotine is three times as toxic as arsenic and one and one half times as toxic as strychnine.




"Oh, intercourse the penguin!"

robot

@jeffery All those qualities that you have listed will contribute to the habit almost as much as the nicotine addiction itself. It reminds me of the shooting up that I did as a teenager. All the needle freaks I new agreed that the process and the handling of the paraphernalia were almost as appealing as the drug itself. I saw people shoot alcohol or even water just to try to satisfy the craving. Pretty weird huh?

Dakini

It amazes me how some people will complain about a person smoking in an outdoor area, but think nothing of the semi truck passing by belching thick clouds of noxious fumes into the air.

Thanks for mentioning this, Toybox. I've always thought it odd that a lot of people take up the healthy activity of jogging, but many take routes that put them running along busy streets or freeways full of car/truck exhaust. And at their heightened heart rate, the joggers are pumping that stuff into their bodies at an intensified speed. (This shows up a lot in movies, I guess because many movies are filmed in NYC or LA, or other highly urban areas.)

OP, I have nothing to add about the health effects of pipe-smoking to what has already been posted. But I understand your desire to use pipe smoking for relaxation. Maybe that's just an attachment of your mind, though. I'll tell you, when I was a teen I was keen on pipe smoking. I had a cool pipe collection: unique pipes from different parts of the world. I loved the smell of pipe tobacco, very fragrant. But I never actually began smoking, because I read an article about the mouth and throat cancer, and it said women are particularly sucseptible (no clue as to why). So that was the end of that.

All I can recommend is to practice non-attachment to this idea. Visualize the disgusting cancerous growths in your mouth. Meditate on what your life would be like with part of your tongue cut out. I think it was Buddhism that invented "aversion therapy". Anyway, good luck.

Jeffrey

"long stinky lives"

its amazing how polarized people become. you aren't getting out of this one alive folks. you take exactly what you brought into this world with you.

animosity towards smokers is more dangerous than smoking. that animosity goes with you to your next rebirth.

Jeffrey

Nicotine is smoked which is why it is misleading to say it is more toxic than arsenic etc. But that is correct that it is toxic. One cigar soaked in water will kill a horse. However 97 to 99 percent of the drug is destroyed in the process of smoking it.

Back on topic: smoking a pipe doesn't have much to do with meditation other than cheering a person up which helps with the mindset for meditation. Lung cancer or mouth cancer or diabetes or heart attacks obviously do not help with meditation.

Jeffrey

Back on topic: smoking a pipe doesn't have much to do with meditation other than cheering a person up which helps with the mindset for meditation. Lung cancer or mouth cancer or diabetes or heart attacks obviously do not help with meditation.

As for myself, I am more addicted to temperate weather than I am to nicotine. I haven't smoked since the weather has turned colder where I am.

aura

Once upon a time tobacco was a wild herb that was burned strictly for religious ceremonial purposes, equivalent to the consecrated bread and wine of Christianity. Invaders murdered and conquered those people, abused and exploited the survivors, and sacrilegiously used, cultivated, monocultured, merchandized, and exported the humble wild herb, tremendously and deliberately increasing its nicotine content and its addictive properties, first through careful crossbreeding, then through chemical manipulation. They were, in short, chemists and drug pushers.
In return, the herb devastated the soil
In return, the herb devastates all who use it in anything but the ancient sacred religious manner.
I have not been Native American for 2 lifetimes and do not go anywhere near tobacco, although I respect both those few pipekeepers who still honor the ancient sacred religious tradition and those who meditate on the horizon, unconsciously attached to a way of life long gone from, and slightly lost in, the modern world.
Modern tobacco has tremendous karma attached to it.

IronRabbit

animosity towards smokers is more dangerous than smoking. that animosity goes with you to your next rebirth.

IronRabbit

Jeffrey

And here is another non sequitar

MindGate

There is some Shisha that you can buy that is natural and lacks nicotine. I don't think it'd be addictive, and if you don't inhale all that much, but rather just let it go in your mouth for the taste (its flavored), I don't see massive amounts of damage occurring to you. Well, as long as its only an occasional thing - like cake.

Mountains

Mountains, isn't that a bit extreme to say it has no redeeming quality?

Not in the least. Medically speaking there is *nothing* whatsoever good about tobacco in any form. Period. Now, if you derive emotional or physical *pleasure* from it, that's a different thing. But as far as the physiological effects it has on the cells in your body are concerned, it's pure poison, and there is **nothing** good you can say for it. On this I will not be moved.

But as I say, keep smoking - it's good job security for me!

Mountains

animosity towards smokers is more dangerous than smoking. that animosity goes with you to your next rebirth.

Animosity toward smokers? How do you figure that? I'm not against smokers. I'm against smoking. It's a totally different thing. I do everything in my earthly power to get people to stop using tobacco *because* I care about them. If I didn't care about them, why would I bother? It's bad for the people who do it, and it's bad (equally so in most cases) for those around them, especially children. I have no more animosity toward smokers than I do toward anyone who abuses and is addicted to any other drug. I don't really care if it's heroin, alcohol, methamphetamine, or tobacco, my aim is to help you get free of it if it's within my power to do so.

Persecution complex is another story entirely

Dakini

Thanks to Aura for reminding us that tobacco is a sacrament, not to be used willy-nilly, which incurs great risk. Alchoholic beverages in many traditional societies are also a sacrament, used only on ceremonial occasions. When the sacred becomes profane, all kinds of problems ensue.

ric03

@Jeffrey
I agreee with you. Pipes are very relaxing and the risks of getting disease (if smoked in moderation of 1-2 bowls per evening) are far lower than the risks of heart disease through prolonged stress. People shouldn't comment on people's habits without knowing their personal lives. I suffered from stress, and had chronic indegestion (I often had to sleep in a chair). I tried medication, diet and exercise. Nothing helped. It vanished almost overnight when I started smoking a pipe.

Sitting down, shutting off all stress and relaxing for an hour or two without a worry in the world is well worth the minor risks in my eyes. It's true, if you smoke a pipe all day long (especially if you combine it with hard drinks) the risks are much higher, but they are barely any different to a none smoker if you smoke little.

Besides, you stand a greater risk of getting throat or mouth cancer through giving oral sex than you do from pipe smoking--I don't intend giving that up either :rolleyes:

aura

When the sacred becomes profane, all kinds of problems ensue.

Yes, exactly... happily!....those are the very best words to describe the phenomenon!
"When the sacred becomes profane..."
Thank you!

Epicurus

There's definitely something about smoking in general that "soothed my mind" and made contemplation easier....and I think it's basically because if you want, it can be a form of meditation. It draws your attention to the sensations....and that's always soothing when there is no pain.

robot

When the sacred becomes profane, all kinds of problems ensue.

Yes, exactly... happily!....those are the very best words to describe the phenomenon!
"When the sacred becomes profane..."
Thank you!

"It is necessary to distinguish language referring to absolute truth from language referring to relative truth. It is necessary to distinguish general statements from particular statements. It is necessary to distinguish the language of a complete teaching from the language of an incomplete teaching. The complete teaching deals with purity; the incomplete teaching deals with impurity. The incomplete teaching explains the defilement in impure things in order to eliminate the profane; the complete teaching explains the the defilement in pure things in order to eliminate the sacred." from Sayings of Pai-chang, Five Houses of Zen by Thomas Cleary

aura

"The incomplete teaching explains the defilement in impure things in order to eliminate the profane; the complete teaching explains the the defilement in pure things in order to eliminate the sacred." from Sayings of Pai-chang, Five Houses of Zen by Thomas Cleary

It isn't about defilement. It is about health.
The unfortunate history of tobacco may well be repeated with the current genetic modification of soybeans. Nearly all soy in the U.S. is genetically modified soy at this point in history.
Tofu, tvp, and soy based vegetarian practitioners beware!
http://responsibletechnology.org/article-gmo-soy-linked-to-sterility

vinlyn

"The incomplete teaching explains the defilement in impure things in order to eliminate the profane; the complete teaching explains the the defilement in pure things in order to eliminate the sacred." from Sayings of Pai-chang, Five Houses of Zen by Thomas Cleary

It isn't about defilement. It is about health.
The unfortunate history of tobacco may well be repeated with the current genetic modification of soybeans. Nearly all soy in the U.S. is genetically modified soy at this point in history.
Tofu, tvp, and soy based vegetarian practitioners beware!
http://responsibletechnology.org/article-gmo-soy-linked-to-sterility

I thought the general consensus of the scientific community was that genetic modification of things such as soy beans was not problematic.

MindGate

"The incomplete teaching explains the defilement in impure things in order to eliminate the profane; the complete teaching explains the the defilement in pure things in order to eliminate the sacred." from Sayings of Pai-chang, Five Houses of Zen by Thomas Cleary

It isn't about defilement. It is about health.
The unfortunate history of tobacco may well be repeated with the current genetic modification of soybeans. Nearly all soy in the U.S. is genetically modified soy at this point in history.
Tofu, tvp, and soy based vegetarian practitioners beware!
http://responsibletechnology.org/article-gmo-soy-linked-to-sterility

They fed the hamsters nothing but soy. A lot of anything can be bad for you. If you were to eat one thing only, problems would arise as well. :zombie: If you space out your consumption of different kinds of foods, there shouldn't be a problem. But then again, I'm no scientist, so what do I know?

Update: Ah! Oh my god! I just looked at the pictures. Hair in the mouth... oh my... ugh... that's messed up. *shiver* I will never eat tofu. Ever. Hair in the interior of the mouth. That's so... aaah... unnerving to me.