Meditaiton... what am I supposed to be experiencing?

prettyhowtown

I have been trying in vain to meditate without falling asleep. Today I used a chair to meditate, and this seemed to help. However, I entered what I believe to be a hypnagogic state. During this hypnagogic state, I had kind of an inner monologue in which I was attempting to analyze whether or not this monologue was "acceptable" during meditation, whether this stream of flowing thoughts was somehow a sign that I am not focused enough. I was also counting breaths and focusing on my breathing, so my mind was running on two or three tracks at a time.

What am I supposed to be experiencing when I meditate? My understanding is that the more I try to grasp, or reach a goal in my meditation, the less benefit I will receive... so am I letting go too much if I reach hypnagogia? Where does one draw the line, and how will I know that I have reached a truly meditative state? Please don't tell me that I will "just know." It is in my nature to question my own knowledge.

santhisouk

Just try to keep a single minded focus. If you can keep that with you throughout your entire meditation, along with being mindful of random thoughts, that is pretty much all you have to do. When you come out of your meditation you will know if you were doing a good job or not. Although it may not seem like much, but if you do this constantly and for a lengthy duration, your mind and body will become one, and you will notice that your life outside of meditation will seem differently better.

Regards
SS

NomaDBuddha

You can experience nothing ( no-thing, the japanese Mu, moooooooo!) and you can experience everything. Now you want to know when you reached a deep meditative state ? I suppose that ( you meditate in your room, or outside) there are moments during your meditation when something cracks ( or dunno...some short , loud , annoying noise) so loud that will scare you a little...well, when you sit and let the sound pass through you, like you were made out of thin air , then you'll have reached the state. ( that's my own opinion...).

person

In the beginning, nothing comes
In the middle, nothing stays
In the end, nothing leaves

Dazzle

Hi prettyhowtown,

Try this Buddhist meditation series on YouTube. The first one is an introduction




Kind wishes,

Dazzle

Jeffrey

Include everything. Include everything in your meditation. Let it be limitless and contain all things that are. Let things be as they are. They will appear with clarity naturally in their own sweet time. Let go of struggle to mature.

Jeffrey

"During this hypnagogic state, I had kind of an inner monologue in which I was attempting to analyze whether or not this monologue was "acceptable" during meditation, whether this stream of flowing thoughts was somehow a sign that I am not focused enough."

So you were analyzing and breathing during your meditation. And having a monologue. That is all that happened.

prettyhowtown

So you were analyzing and breathing during your meditation. And having a monologue. That is all that happened.

So I don't need to try and achieve some kind of blankness or anything like that? I felt really relaxed...

newtech

Hello prettyhowtown :

There are many meditations, but here we should talk in buddhist terms.

In buddhist terms, meditations that attain hypnagogic states are wrong

meditations, because is a meditation that lacks of mindfulness, energy and

clarity. its to clumsy, to much sloth and torpor.

It doesnt have to do with "to much letting go", its more possible that its related

to diet, excessive concentration, just being dedicated to wander,

or any other thing u might consider.

Jeffrey

"So I don't need to try and achieve some kind of blankness or anything like that? I felt really relaxed..."

You will be relaxed and more stable when you include everything. Blanking out can happen. But if you strain for blankness what can happen is that you have a dull mind. Less sensitive and aware. By letting your mind be as it is it will naturally balance out. The only input you need to give is to let your mind be vast. Return to a vast mind when you notice that your mind has wandered into a thought world. But don't scold yourself. Let yourself gently go. Noticing the thought world IS the meditation. The returning. The ability of the mind to come back from fantasy.

Do you notice how you were caught up in thinking what happened was a problem? By noticing that it is like you step back and realize that you were analyzing. Realize you had a monologue. Realize that you were counting.

The ability to come back and not get caught up. And then from that vastness there is a VAM where each question.... each straining.. is let go of to diffusion. And then from that diffusion VAM there is energy and clarity to distinguish things...which then are let go of again to vastness.

Thats what I understand though most of my meditation is just breathing feeling the environment. Feeling my butt on the ground and getting caught up in thinking. Then with a smile coming back. Sometimes 'the watcher' comes along. The monologue and the analysis. That too is just passing and can be included.

At moments you will become aware of even muscular tension and then feel that relaxing.

genkaku

prettyhowtown -- Once upon a time, I used to practice seated meditation (called zazen in Zen practice) with a friend of mine. We would meet once a week, sit for an hour or so and then go out to dinner. One evening, after sitting, I asked him, "Did you ever notice that whether it was a good sitting or a shitty sitting, still something good happens?" "Yes," he replied. And since neither of us could think of anything useful to add, we went out to dinner.

One of the reasons I favor counting the exhalations (one to ten and begin again) is precisely aimed at the difficulties you depict. It's not the only form of meditation and others may prefer something else, but I like it because 1. what could be more intimate than the breath ... it has nothing to do with religion or philosophy ... it has everything to do with an utterly personal and in-your-face life and 2. the counting, while false in one sense, offers a support system to what otherwise might be a confused and lazy time. It is sharp ... miles from anything like hypnosis. True, it lacks the sex appeal of other more ornate practices, but the payback is more reliable.

This is just my take.

prettyhowtown

I wouldn't say a hypnagogic state is similar to hypnosis. It's a light dream state, between sleep and wakefulness. Even in this state, I am aware of my body, of what it is "doing" which is sitting, sometimes involuntarily twitching, and breathing. To me, it seems that straining for deeper concentration is counter-intuitive. I suppose what I'm really asking is, over time will I naturally be able to sharpen my focus? Is this part of the evolution of my meditation practice? If it is not in any way beneficial to the evolution of my meditation practice, is there something I can do differently to help facilitate that evolution?

I thank everyone for your advice and support!

Sabre

Meditation is supposed to bring calm/peaceful awareness. All kinds of things can arise in that awareness, but if you stay non-judgmental and uninterested towards them, eventually they might stop appearing all together. Even thoughts will fade away, leaving just silence. If you give this silence more importance than the thoughts, the silence can remain.

There is nothing like "true meditative states", because all states are true, but you can know your meditation really takes off as soon as you can find the peace in it. This takes practice, but peace is one thing you can expect.

I'd like to point you once again to the video posted by Dazzle.

With metta,
Sabre