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The Dark World of the Human Slave Trade in both Islamic countries and worldwide.
zidangus
Veteran
I was reading in the news yesterday, about a possible sighting in India of a child that was abducted while she was on holiday with her parents about 5 years ago maybe more, its a famous story in the UK, as originally the parents were blamed.
Anyway in the article there was a link to this other article, which I then read. Well it was certainly an eye opener for me, which made me look a little deeper into this story. The article is below
http://frontpagemag.com/2011/06/10/the-dark-world-of-the-arab-child-slave-trade/
Anyway I cannot believe that this kind of treatment of human beings continues to go on and worse still no western government puts pressure on the countries involved to stop it. Whats even more frightening is that the practice is somehow legitimised by some muslims because they believe it agrees with islamic law, with islamic scholars citing that Muhammad had slaves, therefore it is the right of all muslims to have slaves. How can people believe this is allright in this day and age, why does the voice of the liberal muslims who I presume is against any form of slavery never gets heard, and why do our governments continue to do business with the regimes which support this practice. I cannot believe our politicians especially those working in the foreign office do not know that these things go on, yet they are willing to turn a blind eye to it, in order to keep their cosy relations with the countries who practice it. Really sometimes when I read about stories like this, it makes me feel embarrassed to be a human being.
Again the link to the article is below, it was a real eye opener to me, about just how widespread this seems to be in certain parts of the world.
http://frontpagemag.com/2011/06/10/the-dark-world-of-the-arab-child-slave-trade/
Anyway in the article there was a link to this other article, which I then read. Well it was certainly an eye opener for me, which made me look a little deeper into this story. The article is below
http://frontpagemag.com/2011/06/10/the-dark-world-of-the-arab-child-slave-trade/
Anyway I cannot believe that this kind of treatment of human beings continues to go on and worse still no western government puts pressure on the countries involved to stop it. Whats even more frightening is that the practice is somehow legitimised by some muslims because they believe it agrees with islamic law, with islamic scholars citing that Muhammad had slaves, therefore it is the right of all muslims to have slaves. How can people believe this is allright in this day and age, why does the voice of the liberal muslims who I presume is against any form of slavery never gets heard, and why do our governments continue to do business with the regimes which support this practice. I cannot believe our politicians especially those working in the foreign office do not know that these things go on, yet they are willing to turn a blind eye to it, in order to keep their cosy relations with the countries who practice it. Really sometimes when I read about stories like this, it makes me feel embarrassed to be a human being.
Again the link to the article is below, it was a real eye opener to me, about just how widespread this seems to be in certain parts of the world.
http://frontpagemag.com/2011/06/10/the-dark-world-of-the-arab-child-slave-trade/
0
Comments
However, as primarily this has more to do with slavery in the Arab world, rather than anything specifically Islamic (though, agreed, mention is made of Islamic attitudes) I'm moving this from "Buddhism & World Religions" to "Current Events".
Thailand is a 95%+ Buddhist country, and the child sex trade flourishes.
Why is it okay to kidnap "infidel women" or women that are not muslim ?
Why is it okay to turn them into slaves. Kidnapping itself is a crime. Just because they are "infidel women" or not a muslim does not make them any less human ?
There are *lots* of things that "civilized" nations turn a blind eye to, and even encourage. It's the world we live in.
These were the points I was getting at, I am happy for anyone to believe what they want, However, when their beliefs begin to cause suffering to innocent children and adults, I think you should abandon those beliefs, and this applies to Muslims or any other religion which thinks this way. So I am not anti Islam I am just against any teaching or belief which condones and encourages abuse and immense suffering, such as slavery.
Religions are old institutions too and they wouldn’t have made it in their societies, had they fundamentally rejected the way it was organized.
I’m all for human rights of course and against abuse and slave trade.
But our world is not quite perfect yet. That’s not an isolated problem of the Arab world unfortunately. I can make a list if you want.
I think noting islam is involved in slave ownership is an important peice. Some people use dogma to underpin selfishness and cruel behavior... and noting that is a good basis for rejecting dogma.
The goal, in my opinion, is not to feel bad feelings for religion, but to be wary of the slippery nature of viral thoughts and avoid them in our own relationship with our world.
And of course speak out about the immoral behavior of owning slaves. Recall though that the US is less than 200 years abolished.
So sorry I will not try to hush up on topics like this, people are suffering and something needs to be done about it, being quite for the fear of upsetting people is not going to stop the abused and exploited in this world. More people should speak up for those who have no voice in this world, maybe then this world would be a better place.
Example
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article4258475.ece
I am stating that the reason why these people think its acceptable to have slaves, could be due to that Islam says its ok to have slaves, which is what I am highlighting and what I am saying is WRONG !.
I don't care what religion any person believes in, if their religion is openly saying that it is Ok to buy, sell, exploit and abuse people, by having slaves then your religious leaders and governments should be trying to change that attitude not participate in it. I just don't see any of that happening in Islamic countries, do you ? That I believe is wrong, and I believe our governments should be putting more pressure on these counties to stop these practices happening.
Sudan
Sudan has seen a resurgence of slavery since 1983, associated with the Second Sudanese Civil War.
In the Sudan, Christian and animist captives in the civil war are often enslaved, and female prisoners are often used sexually, with their Muslim captors claiming that Islamic law grants them permission.[32] According to CBS news, slaves have been sold for $50 apiece.[33] In 2001, CNN reported that the Bush administration was under pressure from Congress, including conservative Christians concerned about religious oppression and slavery, to address issues involved in the Sudanese conflict.[34] CNN has also quoted the U.S. State Department's allegations: "The [Sudanese] government's support of slavery and its continued military action which has resulted in numerous deaths are due in part to the victims' religious beliefs."
Jok Madut Jok, professor of History at Loyola Marymount University, states that the abduction of women and children of the south by north is slavery by any definition. The government of Sudan insists that the whole matter is no more than the traditional tribal feuding over resources.
It is estimated that as many as 200,000 people had been taken into slavery during the Second Sudanese Civil War.
read the rest of the article for more information about this topic
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_modern_Africa
Try posting on the same topic about a non-Islamic country, and I might believe you are being balanced.
It seems that some people are afraid to talk about this subject simply because it concentrates on one of the beliefs of a different religion, and therefore these people seem to have the opinion that to pass any judgment or criticism on this belief would be completely wrong and would be seen as 'Muslim bashing'.
Well quite frankly as I have said in my earlier posts, if a persons beliefs are causing immense pain and suffering to innocent men, women and children in this world then people have to stand up and say that its is plain and simply wrong !, regardless of if it upsets a persons beliefs. No one has the right to force their beliefs onto others, or to force others to do as they wish, and our governments should be making this point very clearly to these regimes which allow it.
Under your criteria of what we should and should not talk about, we would not be allowed to expose, highlight or criticize the peadophile priests in the catholic church, for fear of being accused of catholic bashing, or being told that it's happened countless times throughout history so just let things be, don't worry about it.
As I have stated in my previous posts, if people are not going to stand up and speak against these kind of things, then nothing will ever change, people will go on suffering, being exploited, being abused, while we in the west go on living our lives in our happy care free bubble. Some people might like to do this, thats fine its up to them, but for me I believe the only way to stop bad things like this from happening is to start voicing our disgust at this and begin to put pressure on the right people to take notice and do something about it, be it writing to your local politician or volunteering or any other way that can help.
At the end of the day, you can say that the topic of my thread is whatever you like, but the bottom line is I care more about bringing an end to this systematic abuse and exploitation of men, women and children in Islamic countries or anywhere else, than I do about upsetting the beliefs of the people who participate in the slave trade.
Again, expand your research and posting, and none of us will probably question you.
Tens of thousands of migrants are fleeing turmoil in North Africa, with many trying to reach Europe by boat, but the problem of slavery exists all over the world and India, Thailand and Malaysia are among the worst-affected countries."
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/05/18/us-slavery-idUSTRE74H63V20110518
Man can stop man's inhumanity. It has been stopped often.
The point is that in every region, slavery is sanctioned by either religion or traditional customs, and these two are sometimes very difficult to differentiate.
You can please some of the people.....
keep to topic, and quit bickering, or I'll sink or close.
And please don't respond to this interruption.
Therefore I think it is perfectly legitimate to concentrate on these points, without the need to include the whole area of slavery and human trafficking.
I also will make the point AGAIN, about a major difference between the specific topic of my thread and the bigger picture of slavery and human trafficking, that is the majority of slavery and human trafficking in Europe and other nations particularly in the west, has NOTHING to do with religious beliefs, it is more MONEY orientated and run by organized crime and NOT PARTICIPATED IN OR UNDERHANDEDLY ENDORSED BY GOVERNMENT. Indeed the overwhelming majority of non Islamic governments are against slavery and have organizations in place to combat it.
An example in China shown below highlights how even the Chinese government clamp down on this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Chinese_slave_scandal
So to bring in the whole global question of human trafficking and slavery, somewhat misses my point about slavery and Islamic countries, which is why you seem to have missed my point entirely.
I mean does anyone have any examples of an Islamic government clamping down on human trafficking and slavery ? Does anyone have any information about an Islamic organization which combats human trafficking and slavery and had big results in the form of arrests and prosecutions ?
Here are some more articles which highlight my point.
http://gvnet.com/humantrafficking/SaudiArabia.htm
The Thai government is against human trafficking in the sex trade. Wink, wink. It has laws in place to combat it. Wink, wink.
Go to Wikipedia and look up "Prostitution in Thailand". Read particularly how, "Prostitution in Thailand is illegal, although in practice it is tolerated and partly regulated. Prostitution is practiced openly throughout the country. Local officials with commercial interests in prostitution often protect the practice." And, it is so illegal that, "A 2004 estimate by Dr. Nitet Tinnakul from Chulalongkorn University gives a total of 2.8 million sex workers, including 2 million women, 20,000 adult males and 800,000 minors under the age of 18. One estimate published in 2003 placed the trade at US$ 4.3 billion per year or about three percent of the Thai economy."
So much for a non-Islamic government that is against sex slavery and has organizations in place to combat it.
http://thecnnfreedomproject.blogs.cnn.com/2011/05/24/fighting-child-sex-slavery-in-thailand/
Yes, there are arrests in Thailand for underage prostituion, usually under the following situations:
1. An international organization or news organization is heating up the topic specifically regarding underage prostitution. Hence, "Round up the usual suspects".
2. Someone involved in the business doesn't pay their bribe money. Again, "Round up the usual suspects" until the point is made.
Don't be fooled by the superficiality of it all. If it wasn't superficial, would there be, "a total of 2.8 million sex workers, including 2 million women, 20,000 adult males and 800,000 minors under the age of 18"?
Anyway like I have said, at least the Thais are doing something, even if you think it is superficial, it is at least something. I am still waiting to see any evidence of similar arrests and punishment of human traffickers and people who participate in slavery from Islamic countries. Exactly what are Islamic countries doing to combat human trafficking and slavery ? If someone could show me some kind of article or anything to suggest Islamic countries are doing something meaningful to stop this, then I will gladly retract what I have said about Islamic governments.
I think we can agree that human exploitation, of whichever age group, ethnicity or gender, is heinous, deplorable and should be stopped, regardless of whom the active perpetrators are, and regardless of what Governments are choosing to do about it.
in order to raise the level of awareness, those who can, should be vocal and active in their opposition.
Tell me, @zidangus, are you a member of Amnesty International?
What have you actively done to raise international awareness (and thus, Government embarrassment) regarding this matter?
And what do you think you could do more of?
Instead of complaining - why not find a way to act and make a difference?
What would you do?
What would you have us do?
It's all very well complaining about it, but unless you actually raise your hand, step up to the plate and be a self-appointed representative of those unable to defend themselves, then this thread is just so much hot air, isn't it?
And it is this knowledge understanding and compassion which makes me and millions of others join charities and organizations that try to make a positive difference in this world, and stand up for those who cannot stand up for themselves.
This thread is not about complaining or blowing hot air as you eloquently put it, its about highlighting and making people aware of these topics, and if it makes people as it has made me, want to do something about it, then it is far far from hot air as you say. It might indeed motivate someone as it has with me to read up and do some background research on this topic, and also motivate people do find out what steps can be taken to help stop it. Surely highlighting the wrongs of this world is essential if they are ever going to be corrected.
I put my money where my mouth is, a long time ago.
The wheels grind exceeding slow - but they do grind, nonetheless.....