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5th precept questions
Hey guys I just starting practicing buddhism fairly recently and I have a couple of questions about the 5th precept.
First, I'm curious about how I've seen the precept worded on some websites. I'm not quoting any one site, but I've the 5th precept written as something like "avoid intoxicants which cause a lack of mindfulness and make you more likely to break the other precepts." So my question is: Is moderate consumption of alcohol acceptable as long as I remain mindful and careful that I don't break the other precepts? Also, does alcohol consumption itself cause negative karma?
Secondly, I have ADHD and take adderall for it. Taking adderall helps me in so many areas of my life and it's a valid medical treatment so I'm wondering whether adderall falls under the 5th precept. I don't consider adderall an "intoxicant" by any means but it definitely alters brain function so I'd appreciate opinions on how it relates to my practice of buddhism.
And please, no ignorant comments about adhd or its medication.
Thanks in advance for the help.
First, I'm curious about how I've seen the precept worded on some websites. I'm not quoting any one site, but I've the 5th precept written as something like "avoid intoxicants which cause a lack of mindfulness and make you more likely to break the other precepts." So my question is: Is moderate consumption of alcohol acceptable as long as I remain mindful and careful that I don't break the other precepts? Also, does alcohol consumption itself cause negative karma?
Secondly, I have ADHD and take adderall for it. Taking adderall helps me in so many areas of my life and it's a valid medical treatment so I'm wondering whether adderall falls under the 5th precept. I don't consider adderall an "intoxicant" by any means but it definitely alters brain function so I'd appreciate opinions on how it relates to my practice of buddhism.
And please, no ignorant comments about adhd or its medication.
Thanks in advance for the help.
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Comments
I've never heard a reliable person describe a true medication as an intoxicant, even if it has that effect.
This does demonstrate, however, how interpretation comes into play.
No one should denigrate you because of having ADHD. I was a school principal and worked with many kids with this medical condition. However, I was not aware that ADHD drugs and alcohol "mix".
Remember, these are just instructions on how to become clear, rather than commandments that a wrathful deity will punish you for breaking. If you wish to drink in moderation, go for it... just be observant of your mind before, during and after. When and if you shed it as an action, it will happen without confusion, without longing.
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The end result on the brain is the same If I smoke pot for pain vs if I do it to get high, so what is the difference? Is it intent? If so, then is it right intent to want to be rid of pain, is it right intent to get high to get rid of pain, is it right intent to get high to get rid of pain that wasn't diagnosed?
I guess this all points to the fact that there is no steadfast rule, but only your right view and right intention (is this following your intuition?).
Prescription medications you have the support of a physician and also its not taken as you need but according to a daily regimen. Alcohol would probably be fine if you took it as a prescription one glass of wine or beer daily.
On more than one occasion I have smoked marijuana and thought I had insights only to realize that it was just ego. That being said, I have been able to successfully meditate while stoned. I don't think I can become enlightened while stoned or while I continue to use pot, but it is interesting to practice in another state of mind. Just like trying to meditate when angry, depressed, or just physically ill. I will shed this when my practice is advanced enough.
Alcoholics' bodies have learned to function with that new factor. Is this a form of attachment?
Intent is everything. Period!
Namaste
@bodha8 My point is that aren't people trying to escape the pain of life with recreational drugs? What is the difference between that escape and taking pain pills or medication to relieve the suffering? The intent is the same, avoid painful situations.
I don't care if the doctor wrote you a little slip of paper or not, many drugs they prescribe are *certainly* intoxicants. In fact, by the strict definition of the word, *any* drug is an intoxicant, since all are toxic to some degree or other. But I'm splitting hairs too. However, many drugs definitely alter your mental status, and so would fall under the same heading as recreational drugs (many of which are prescription drugs, abused) and alcohol.
The individual human response to such chemical compounds is so variable however, I don't think it's up to anyone to say that the 5th precept is an outright ban on taking anything that might in any way alter your mental status. I can drink a small glass of wine or a beer (but no more) and have absolutely no adverse effects whatsoever. Some people can take half a sip of a beer and be blotto. It's all individual.
Just like Buddhism, come to think of it. There are no "thou shalt nots" in Buddhism, as far as I'm aware. Just use your good judgement.
@Mountains - it seems the hairs you're splitting are in the wrong direction. Perhaps a focus on the heedlessness would be more helpful, because almost every food (even sunlight) cause shifting chemicals in the brain that could be intoxicating. However, purposly causing the mind to be heedless is something one can overcome with practice. Maybe the precept could be read as "Not intentionally making it harder to be awake."
:clap:
NOBODY.
Is that a precept you want to your child to live by?
The precept always puts "that cause heedlessness" or "lack of mindfulness" and one reason is because the rules were first laid down in a time when drinking the water of even your own local community could be dangerous and they knew it, although they didn't know why. They certainly knew drinking the untreated water on their travels could cause massive illness. If you travel today, you still need to keep that in mind. So, people back then often drink weak wine or something else brewed. But getting drunk was as much a problem then as now. A monk who got drunk and acted foolish made everyone look bad.
As for your medicine, there's a reason the term "recreational drugs" is used to denote the difference between medicine and just going on a joyride.