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@ThailandTom I'm sure if you searched around you'll find plenty of Buddhist groups, Buddhist studies, Buddhist schools etc. I'm sure they'll be more than glad to discuss the 4nt and 8fp with you.
Yea well in my town I have already searched and there is one meditation centre and it is an average sized town as well, not that small at all. There are monestaries that are dotted around and I know they take in lay people for a few days if it is needed.
By the way I thought South korea's main religion was Buddhism? It was mentioned above to be full of Christian people. I only know of one person from there so I cannot really comment.
I found Thai lay Buddhism to be much like Chinese lay Buddhism--just a regular part of life, like going for groceries. But sometimes it seemed more visible "away from the shrine." (I should add that my friends were wealthy, city-Thais; I don't know how country folk may differ). My Chinese friends growing up would only be "visibly Buddhist" in the sense of having small shrines in the house or business, going to temple for certain things, and of course partaking in festivals.
One of my Thai friends, on the other hand, would go off to a corner, sit, and meditate for power before kicking my *** in gung-fu contests (something we kids seemed to partake of incessantly). I was never sure if it was for show or for real, but he certainly seemed serious about it and as a child I was utterly intrigued. Maybe those ***-kickings are part of what led me down the Buddhist path, in fact
Tom, the situation in South Korea surprised me to, and I sort of stumbled up it when I suddenly realized that almost all of the South Korean students in my school in Virginia were Christian. According to Wikipedia, in South Korea, no religion (46%), Buddhism (23%), Protestantism (18%), Catholicism (11%), other religions (2%).
Tom, the situation in South Korea surprised me to, and I sort of stumbled up it when I suddenly realized that almost all of the South Korean students in my school in Virginia were Christian. According to Wikipedia, in South Korea, no religion (46%), Buddhism (23%), Protestantism (18%), Catholicism (11%), other religions (2%).
I have never been but I know someone who lives not too far south from Seoul like I said. She told me that the main religion there is Buddhism but she knows little about it. Aside from that, how was S Korea? She depicts Seoul as being so grey and dull, concrete dullness.
Tom, the situation in South Korea surprised me to, and I sort of stumbled up it when I suddenly realized that almost all of the South Korean students in my school in Virginia were Christian. According to Wikipedia, in South Korea, no religion (46%), Buddhism (23%), Protestantism (18%), Catholicism (11%), other religions (2%).
Do you have numbers pre and post korean war? I would be interested to see those.
Never been there, never wanted to, even though I found our South Korean families very nice. Not sure why, but my school's population boundary in Virginia had a high % of Korean...we never counted out South Koreans as separate from Asians, but my guess would be 10% or slightly more Korean students.
@Sile, unfortunately even people who would like a lot more control over their kids education are barred by laws regarding compulsory education
As for the monastery at 18, it's not entirely true, there is a boy here who will be going to monastery at age 9, but he was discovered to be a lama, so I'm sure his case is different than someone just opting to do so. However, from what our teacher says, they have children as young as 2 in their monastery in Tibet. I didn't ask, but it seemed to me it was more so that the families ask the monks to take care of the children than it was that the monks/lamas sought them all out. He (teacher) is completing an orphanage there to help with the children who need care.
I'm fortunate to live in Wisconsin, where we have almost total freedom in educating our kids; Michigan is on notch freer yet, I believe. California, while I adore it for many other things, is scary when it comes to education.
A fascinating read is Any Choying Drolma's bio. She left an abusive home life specifically to seek a more peaceful life in a nunnery, and speaks fondly of her chosen path. She's founded a school for young nuns, in turn. Bad and good stuff can be found anywhere - it's not the where that matters, but the bad and good stuff.
Doesn't one have to be 18 to enter a monastery now in Tibet?
Not all Tibetan monasteries are in Tibet. But in TIbet, even though the law is that no one under 18 can be admitted, in rural areas where there still are no public schools, the Chinese have had to ignore their own laws, and kids still go to the monasteries.
The DL himself has said that "only 10% are suited" to the monastic life and the advanced curriculum.
Tom, the situation in South Korea surprised me to, and I sort of stumbled up it when I suddenly realized that almost all of the South Korean students in my school in Virginia were Christian. According to Wikipedia, in South Korea, no religion (46%), Buddhism (23%), Protestantism (18%), Catholicism (11%), other religions (2%).
Do you have numbers pre and post korean war? I would be interested to see those.
Before and after WWII and the Japanese occupation Korea was almost entirely Buddhist. The Japanese forced their own rules onto the temples, though, including allowing monks to marry. After Japan left, this resulted in a lot of infighting amongst the temples and monks over what rules to follow now. So the people started to lose confidence in the temples.
Then after the stalemate of the Korean war, the dictatorial government of South Korea was led by a Christian and insisted on entremely close ties to the evangelical Christianity and all things American while the temples had a hard time rebuilding and adjusting. Buddhism was criticized as old fashioned, the religion of your parents and grandparents, loaded with superstitious beliefs and not keeping with the modern world.
As Buddhism has the ability to absorb and co-exist with many local religions and beliefs, the line tends to blur somewhat over time. In many Asian Oriental communities, Taosim has merged right alongside, (Shinto in Japan) after all in the Realms, the occupy The heaven of the 33. So they are mentioned in the Dharma after all.
So, many of the Buddhas are worshipped as gods, they are prayed to for good health, wealth and other favours, just like the Taoist deities.
Of course there is the minority who rises above faith based practices and explore the Dharma, I would say yes, 10% rings true, as is I believe with most other religions. These are the people who goes for Dharma talks, read up and support the monastic community.
Thailand unfortunately, Buddhism there has melded with Hindusim and local beliefs to a great extent. Most of the city based monks are amulet sellers and give very wet blessings. Or adopt an infant ghost to help your business grow. Some of them are mere conscripts. Fortunately the forest monks are commendable.
The local populace often looks for a quick fix for their ailments, so TB and Theravada monks with their blessings have a feel good feature. TB also is very much ritual based, with fire and smoke pujas (Hindu practices) as well.
Alas Pure Land monks only gives advice, yes, change your lifestyle, dont kill, be vegetarian, do some chanting and meditation etc etc. Unbeknownst to many this is the real deal! They dont chant for you or give blessings, do it yourself for your own merit. Thats the reason Pure Land is not setting up centers at every corner, not attractive enough.
If you go to a TB center and get blessings twice a day, how helpful is that apart from the psychological uplift? For some that may be enough...
Thailand unfortunately, Buddhism there has melded with Hindusim and local beliefs to a great extent. Most of the city based monks are amulet sellers and give very wet blessings. Or adopt an infant ghost to help your business grow. Some of them are mere conscripts. Fortunately the forest monks are commendable.
Tom, the situation in South Korea surprised me to, and I sort of stumbled up it when I suddenly realized that almost all of the South Korean students in my school in Virginia were Christian. According to Wikipedia, in South Korea, no religion (46%), Buddhism (23%), Protestantism (18%), Catholicism (11%), other religions (2%).
Do you have numbers pre and post korean war? I would be interested to see those.
Before and after WWII and the Japanese occupation Korea was almost entirely Buddhist. The Japanese forced their own rules onto the temples, though, including allowing monks to marry. After Japan left, this resulted in a lot of infighting amongst the temples and monks over what rules to follow now. So the people started to lose confidence in the temples.
Then after the stalemate of the Korean war, the dictatorial government of South Korea was led by a Christian and insisted on entremely close ties to the evangelical Christianity and all things American while the temples had a hard time rebuilding and adjusting. Buddhism was criticized as old fashioned, the religion of your parents and grandparents, loaded with superstitious beliefs and not keeping with the modern world.
Thanks, this will explain the deep hatred my friend has for Japanese people lol.
Tom, the situation in South Korea surprised me to, and I sort of stumbled up it when I suddenly realized that almost all of the South Korean students in my school in Virginia were Christian. According to Wikipedia, in South Korea, no religion (46%), Buddhism (23%), Protestantism (18%), Catholicism (11%), other religions (2%).
Do you have numbers pre and post korean war? I would be interested to see those.
Before and after WWII and the Japanese occupation Korea was almost entirely Buddhist. The Japanese forced their own rules onto the temples, though, including allowing monks to marry. After Japan left, this resulted in a lot of infighting amongst the temples and monks over what rules to follow now. So the people started to lose confidence in the temples.
Then after the stalemate of the Korean war, the dictatorial government of South Korea was led by a Christian and insisted on entremely close ties to the evangelical Christianity and all things American while the temples had a hard time rebuilding and adjusting. Buddhism was criticized as old fashioned, the religion of your parents and grandparents, loaded with superstitious beliefs and not keeping with the modern world.
Thanks, this will explain the deep hatred my friend has for Japanese people lol.
Poor Korea has throughout thousands of years of history been invaded first by China, then Japan repeatedly. If you read the signs in front of the temples, it's a long list of "burnt to the ground by...rebuilt in....burnt to the ground again by...burnt again by..."
Japan in particular would carry off all the artists when they invaded, and a lot of what is now claimed to be Japanese art was actually done by or learned from Koreans forced to work for Japan in the past. No, most Koreans don't much like the Japanese or Chinese. Koreans are a unique population and an amazing people to get to know.
Buddhist is just a name. Before Buddha, there are no Buddhists. Eventually, it is not important whether the majority is a Buddhist or not. Perhaps, it would be better that they are human.
Buddhist is just a name. Before Buddha, there are no Buddhists. Eventually, it is not important whether the majority is a Buddhist or not. Perhaps, it would be better that they are human.
Except, weren't there many Buddhas before Siddhartha?
Buddhist is just a name. Before Buddha, there are no Buddhists. Eventually, it is not important whether the majority is a Buddhist or not. Perhaps, it would be better that they are human.
Except, weren't there many Buddhas before Siddhartha?
Yep I remember reading several times that there were Buddhas before him, after him and there will be more in the future. When Siddhartha was doing his thing, there was no such thing as Buddhism.
This might be changing the direction of the OP and maybe a whole new discussion, but it is something to consider when talking about Buddhism. There seems to be a push towards a more secular buddhist practice. I found this quote on a website I follow:
Stephen Schettini has two websites dedicated to practicing Buddhism without Buddhism. A former Tibetan Buddhist monk, he has come to realize that the ‘religion’ of Buddhism is unnecessary.
“Years of meditation, studying and reflection have led me to believe that the Buddha Siddhattha Gotama was what I can only call a humanist and skeptic of the first order. He had no time for the religion of his day or the eternally inconclusive debate as to whether or not there is a creator God. His question wasn’t why are we here, but here we are — now what? . . . I no longer belong to any tradition; my understanding of what the Buddha taught led me away from Buddhist institutions. As paradoxical as that seems, it’s a common theme of our times — not just for me, and not just for Buddhists, either . . .”
This might be changing the direction of the OP and maybe a whole new discussion, but it is something to consider when talking about Buddhism. There seems to be a push towards a more secular buddhist practice. I found this quote on a website I follow:
Stephen Schettini has two websites dedicated to practicing Buddhism without Buddhism. A former Tibetan Buddhist monk, he has come to realize that the ‘religion’ of Buddhism is unnecessary.
“Years of meditation, studying and reflection have led me to believe that the Buddha Siddhattha Gotama was what I can only call a humanist and skeptic of the first order. He had no time for the religion of his day or the eternally inconclusive debate as to whether or not there is a creator God. His question wasn’t why are we here, but here we are — now what? . . . I no longer belong to any tradition; my understanding of what the Buddha taught led me away from Buddhist institutions. As paradoxical as that seems, it’s a common theme of our times — not just for me, and not just for Buddhists, either . . .”
Absolutely no real argument from me. I'm all for a secular Buddhism as I've mentioned at various times in this forum. I always called it "cultural Buddhism" but the term secular Buddhism works for me as well. :-) Probably a more accurate term, anyway.
As Buddhism has the ability to absorb and co-exist with many local religions and beliefs, the line tends to blur somewhat over time. In many Asian Oriental communities, Taosim has merged right alongside, (Shinto in Japan) after all in the Realms, the occupy The heaven of the 33. So they are mentioned in the Dharma after all.
So, many of the Buddhas are worshipped as gods, they are prayed to for good health, wealth and other favours, just like the Taoist deities.
Of course there is the minority who rises above faith based practices and explore the Dharma, I would say yes, 10% rings true, as is I believe with most other religions. These are the people who goes for Dharma talks, read up and support the monastic community.
Thailand unfortunately, Buddhism there has melded with Hindusim and local beliefs to a great extent. Most of the city based monks are amulet sellers and give very wet blessings. Or adopt an infant ghost to help your business grow. Some of them are mere conscripts. Fortunately the forest monks are commendable.
The local populace often looks for a quick fix for their ailments, so TB and Theravada monks with their blessings have a feel good feature. TB also is very much ritual based, with fire and smoke pujas (Hindu practices) as well.
Alas Pure Land monks only gives advice, yes, change your lifestyle, dont kill, be vegetarian, do some chanting and meditation etc etc. Unbeknownst to many this is the real deal! They dont chant for you or give blessings, do it yourself for your own merit. Thats the reason Pure Land is not setting up centers at every corner, not attractive enough.
If you go to a TB center and get blessings twice a day, how helpful is that apart from the psychological uplift? For some that may be enough...
Someone asked my lamas teacher for a blessing he said: "bless yourself, you have buddha nature". There is also the idea of mandalas and adhistana in TB, but blessing for adhistana is a bad translation much like Dukkha is a bad translation. My teacher says adhistana is like opening to the teaching/teachers. So it is opening your heart for the dharma to instruct. And that happens in all the teachings/lineages. From that point of view adhistana is necessary part of the refuge because we are opening to the Buddhist mandala. As for rituals their purpose is to energize your practice, to get some inspiration. The pujas are practices of regret towards unskillful actions which self-evident is a benefitial practice to develope merit and cultivate a sound ethical mind.
Buddhist is just a name. Before Buddha, there are no Buddhists. Eventually, it is not important whether the majority is a Buddhist or not. Perhaps, it would be better that they are human.
Except, weren't there many Buddhas before Siddhartha?
That's a belief of the mahayana, and not a belief of the Theravada, at least to my knowledge.
^ I have not read any books on Mahayana, so I must have read it in Theravada books.
I am pretty sure that theravada believes the highest learning possible is arahant. Only one Buddha appears per world, because the definition of a Buddha. Once another practitioner executes Buddha's teaching they are deemed arahant. You see it's a matter of defintion.
Buddhist is just a name. Before Buddha, there are no Buddhists. Eventually, it is not important whether the majority is a Buddhist or not. Perhaps, it would be better that they are human.
Even during the Buddha's lifetime, there were no Buddhists. There were only followers of the Dharma.
Buddhist is just a name. Before Buddha, there are no Buddhists. Eventually, it is not important whether the majority is a Buddhist or not. Perhaps, it would be better that they are human.
Even during the Buddha's lifetime, there were no Buddhists. There were only followers of the Dharma.
There were many teachers of many different religions and ways to spiritualty, yet the Buddha as most of us know went through several of these and found that they did not overcome the fundamental issue that life is suffering.
I have read from the Dalai Lama that even the arahant are subject to their past and present karma and thus are subsequently reborn sooner or later.. Can anybody else give any info on this?
Comments
By the way I thought South korea's main religion was Buddhism? It was mentioned above to be full of Christian people. I only know of one person from there so I cannot really comment.
One of my Thai friends, on the other hand, would go off to a corner, sit, and meditate for power before kicking my *** in gung-fu contests (something we kids seemed to partake of incessantly). I was never sure if it was for show or for real, but he certainly seemed serious about it and as a child I was utterly intrigued. Maybe those ***-kickings are part of what led me down the Buddhist path, in fact
As for the monastery at 18, it's not entirely true, there is a boy here who will be going to monastery at age 9, but he was discovered to be a lama, so I'm sure his case is different than someone just opting to do so. However, from what our teacher says, they have children as young as 2 in their monastery in Tibet. I didn't ask, but it seemed to me it was more so that the families ask the monks to take care of the children than it was that the monks/lamas sought them all out. He (teacher) is completing an orphanage there to help with the children who need care.
A fascinating read is Any Choying Drolma's bio. She left an abusive home life specifically to seek a more peaceful life in a nunnery, and speaks fondly of her chosen path. She's founded a school for young nuns, in turn. Bad and good stuff can be found anywhere - it's not the where that matters, but the bad and good stuff.
The DL himself has said that "only 10% are suited" to the monastic life and the advanced curriculum.
Then after the stalemate of the Korean war, the dictatorial government of South Korea was led by a Christian and insisted on entremely close ties to the evangelical Christianity and all things American while the temples had a hard time rebuilding and adjusting. Buddhism was criticized as old fashioned, the religion of your parents and grandparents, loaded with superstitious beliefs and not keeping with the modern world.
In many Asian Oriental communities, Taosim has merged right alongside, (Shinto in Japan) after all in the Realms, the occupy The heaven of the 33. So they are mentioned in the Dharma after all.
So, many of the Buddhas are worshipped as gods, they are prayed to for good health, wealth and other favours, just like the Taoist deities.
Of course there is the minority who rises above faith based practices and explore the Dharma, I would say yes, 10% rings true, as is I believe with most other religions.
These are the people who goes for Dharma talks, read up and support the monastic community.
Thailand unfortunately, Buddhism there has melded with Hindusim and local beliefs to a great extent. Most of the city based monks are amulet sellers and give very wet blessings. Or adopt an infant ghost to help your business grow. Some of them are mere conscripts. Fortunately the forest monks are commendable.
The local populace often looks for a quick fix for their ailments, so TB and Theravada monks with their blessings have a feel good feature. TB also is very much ritual based, with fire and smoke pujas (Hindu practices) as well.
Alas Pure Land monks only gives advice, yes, change your lifestyle, dont kill, be vegetarian, do some chanting and meditation etc etc. Unbeknownst to many this is the real deal! They dont chant for you or give blessings, do it yourself for your own merit.
Thats the reason Pure Land is not setting up centers at every corner, not attractive enough.
If you go to a TB center and get blessings twice a day, how helpful is that apart from the psychological uplift? For some that may be enough...
Japan in particular would carry off all the artists when they invaded, and a lot of what is now claimed to be Japanese art was actually done by or learned from Koreans forced to work for Japan in the past. No, most Koreans don't much like the Japanese or Chinese. Koreans are a unique population and an amazing people to get to know.
Stephen Schettini has two websites dedicated to practicing Buddhism without Buddhism. A former Tibetan Buddhist monk, he has come to realize that the ‘religion’ of Buddhism is unnecessary.
“Years of meditation, studying and reflection have led me to believe that the Buddha Siddhattha Gotama was what I can only call a humanist and skeptic of the first order. He had no time for the religion of his day or the eternally inconclusive debate as to whether or not there is a creator God. His question wasn’t why are we here, but here we are — now what? . . . I no longer belong to any tradition; my understanding of what the Buddha taught led me away from Buddhist institutions. As paradoxical as that seems, it’s a common theme of our times — not just for me, and not just for Buddhists, either . . .”
http://wanderingdhamma.wordpress.com/research-interests/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_twenty-eight_Buddhas
I have read from the Dalai Lama that even the arahant are subject to their past and present karma and thus are subsequently reborn sooner or later.. Can anybody else give any info on this?