Excess

hopingforchange

Does anyone have any guidance for meditation for someone dealing exessiveness? In my personal inventory recently I have come to grips with the underlying cause of many problems in my life, selfishness, covetousness, rage, clinging. During this investigation, when I lose mindfulness and lose the present moment I often find myself in "overly excessive" situations (six months sober recovering alcoholic), over eating, talking too much, over training, constantly lost in thought. I have been aware for quite awhile that I was hurting people and have recently tryed to start each day new, winding down most days with lots of hope, but past the "warm fuzzy" feeling I got after my first series of epiphanies. I was wondering if anyone had any advice to keep in mind in an effort to keep my self "in line" (intentions, actions, speech). I feel that I could go on for days about what I am looking for but find that if I try to get to specific that I often miss out on things I could have learned.

Invincible_summer

hopingforchange said:

Does anyone have any guidance for meditation for someone dealing exessiveness? In my personal inventory recently I have come to grips with the underlying cause of many problems in my life, selfishness, covetousness, rage, clinging. During this investigation, when I lose mindfulness and lose the present moment I often find myself in "overly excessive" situations (six months sober recovering alcoholic), over eating, talking too much, over training, constantly lost in thought...

It sounds like you know (at least part of) what you need to do already.

I don't know if there's a specific meditation to do for "excessiveness," but I do know that - in my experience - a regular meditation practice helps with becoming more comfortable with the uncomfortable emotions that arise. With enough practice, you can even catch the emotions just as they start to come up (off the cushion), preventing anything from really happening.

But it takes practice.

hopingforchange

I am already starting to catch them, sometimes it just gets to be overwhelming. I am doing alot better, the last several months I have been focusing on reaching out in an effort to help others and "ignore" myself. It seems to be more so that I catch it and then intentionally "punish" myself by continuing to act unskillfully. It is more so something that I am interested in discussing, than something I need dire help with. This is kind of an effort in communicating for me in a positive way with like minded people. In an effort to keep what I have learned and am learning in multiple facets of my life.

blu3ree

Don't ignore yourself just don't spoil yourself. When emotions come up view them as rising and ceasing then when the wave has rolled over respond.

chela

I think practicing the Eight Fold Path will help. But it means lots of practicing.

I wonder if @Tosh would have more insight and practical advice here?

Jeffrey

Touch in with your heart, what you wish for. If your actions are running contrary to with the way you want to live and your values then at least you will see where you are getting caught. So I recommend being clear on what you value and what you are about.

riverflow

hopingforchange said:

It seems to be more so that I catch it and then intentionally "punish" myself by continuing to act unskillfully.

It is good to assess yourself and note where you feel improvement is needed. This is an excellent start for anyone and everyone. But there is no need to punish yourself or chide yourself. I say this, yet there are times I catch myself doing the same thing. Observe what you think are shortcomings, drop them and begin again. Self-punishment (in any form) only stirs things up and you can get stuck on what you've done instead of simply progressing forward.

What is true in meditation is true in everyday life: When meditating, and the mind wanders about, it does no good to force yourself to concentrate, thinking 'Stop it! You should be meditating, not chasing thoughts!' Well, that's just another thought, isn't it? Instead, note that you are thinking, drop it, then return to the breath. Likewise, when you feel you have fallen short in one of your goals, make a note of that shortcoming, drop it, and return to walking the path. You'll get there with more surety that way than by scolding yourself.

That meditation and everyday life both work well in the same way is not a coincidence!

Tosh

chela said:

I think practicing the Eight Fold Path will help. But it means lots of practicing.

I wonder if @Tosh would have more insight and practical advice here?

I'm touched you find my experience worthy of mention, but I don't think my answer would be helpful to you because I use A.A.'s 12 Steps, which essentially covers the eightfold path.

I basically use the last three steps as my daily program:

10. Continued to take personal inventory, and when we were wrong, promptly admitted it.

11. Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God as we understood Him, praying only for knowledge of His will for us and the power to carry that out.

12. Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.

These last three steps covers:

1. Mindfulness (Step 10)
2. Meditation (Step 11)
3. Practising compassion and living an ethical life (Step 12)

These last three will cover the eightfold path for me.

1. Right view
2. Right intention
3. Right speech
4. Right action
5. Right livelihood
6. Right effort
7. Right mindfulness
8. Right concentration

My particular take on practising the eightfold path is that we cannot really develop each one in turn using mere will power; like 'right speech'. I find will power only ever gets me so far. I mean with my drinking using will power could keep me sober for a few days, but it was like Japanese water torture, and I'd crack 'n' drink. I needed a method to show me how to adjust/accept my internal condition so that I didn't have to drink.

Using will power for anything only ever gets me so far, then fails me. So, with right speech (for example), I cannot say to myself "Right, from now on I'll use right speech!", because my will power to do this will fail me.

I need a method to achieve right view, intention, speech, action, effort, mindfulness and concentration. Right livelihood comes under living an ethical life. And the method I use is the 12 Steps.

My interest in Buddhism just enhances my A.A. program; it teaches me the theory behind the actions A.A. teaches. Why, for example, it's crucial to practise compassion if we wish to be happy. Why finding happiness in external objects (like money) is a dead end; that kind of thing.

But I like my program, because it keeps it simple for me; we call it a simple program for complicated people; and I have a tendency to overcomplicate everything, then get in a right old muddle. Then I'll take a step back and simplify it.

So I just try to be mindful when I remember, I have a fairly disciplined meditation routine - which I'll do whether I want to or not - and I practise compassion in a real 'hands on' approach (rather than just wishing compassion from a meditation mat). There's enough there to keep me busy learning for a lifetime.

I hope something in there was useful! I'd like to read some other takes on this though.

Tosh

hopingforchange said:

when I lose mindfulness and lose the present moment I often find myself in "overly excessive" situations (six months sober recovering alcoholic), over eating, talking too much, over training, constantly lost in thought. I have been aware for quite awhile that I was hurting people and have recently tryed to start each day new, winding down most days with lots of hope, but past the "warm fuzzy" feeling I got after my first series of epiphanies. I was wondering if anyone had any advice to keep in mind in an effort to keep my self "in line" (intentions, actions, speech). I feel that I could go on for days about what I am looking for but find that if I try to get to specific that I often miss out on things I could have learned.

I think you understand that the basic problem is not really alcohol, but the way we feel sober; and it's that feeling that drives us to do the stuff we do. For me, I just didn't feel comfortable in my own skin which could lead to me being bad tempered or just plain tetchy with family which regularly created hurt feelings and resentments.

And yes, food became really important; I could stuff myself so full that there was no room left for anxiety. Coffee was another one; 15 cups a day sometimes. Alcoholics are well known for our lack of balance. It's like if we can't do something perfectly, we don't bother at all, but if we find something we like, we'll kick the arse out of it big style.

I found my solution to the problem in A.A.; as an alcoholic it's good for me to be around other sober alcoholics and more importantly to try and help and show newcomers to A.A. a method we use to stay sober.

I think you can find the same tools in Buddhism, but it's a lot more complex and there's a lot of wheat to sort from the chaff.

There's a lot of "12 Step Buddhist" stuff about on the interweb, why not take a look at some of it? Of course, it helps if we go to meetings as well.

P.S. Apologies; I just read the post asking me about the 8fold path and answered that question without reading your original post. Mindfulness eh?

lobster

One simple technique applicable to all our efforts is pausing and operating at half normal speed. Surprisingly if you move and act at a slower speed it is easier to be aware when excess or other tendencies arise and you get more done as you become efficient rather than appearing fast. By pausing before indulging, the longer the better, the very intention is very often overtaken by the monkey mind moving on . . .

chela

Honestly, I think mindfulness is key to the Eight Fold Path, anyway. It's mindfulness in all crevices of your being. Anywhere you see "Right" (Right Thought, Right Speech, Right Concentration, etc), just replace it with "Mindful". If you're mindful across the board, then you're practicing all of the path. Mindfulness in your daily life is simply meditation in action. Focus on the present, slow your thoughts down, be aware and observe, and let there be space between thought and action/reaction (whether it is further thought, speech, or some other type of reaction). The space is where the "right" happens-- where you are able to appropriately address the thought without being in "survival instinct" or "habit" mode.

Edited: I just read lobster's post and realized that my post is a sort of echo.