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Today We Fight Back [campaign]

LincLinc Site ownerDetroit Moderator
in NewBuddhist.com
NewBuddhist is supporting the anti-surveillance campaign organized by Fight For The Future. That's why we have the banner running at the bottom of the site today. It's primarily focused on US-centric legislative issues. Thanks to our international friends for enduring us. ;)
federicaDaltheJigsawcvalueCinorjerDaiva

Comments

  • anatamananataman Who needs a title? Where am I? Veteran
    What have you got to hide @Lincoln?

    Mettha
  • LincLinc Site owner Detroit Moderator
    https://chronicle.com/article/Why-Privacy-Matters-Even-if/127461/
  • JasonJason God Emperor Arrakis Moderator
    edited February 2014
    I totally support the spirit of this campaign and I just sent an email to my representatives urging them to vote for the USA Freedom Act and against the FISA Improvements Act, although I'm not sure how much good it'll actually do.

    For one, it's not like they follow the laws that are already in place. They break them all the time. And with secret organizations with little to no real oversight, who'd even know if they were breaking them? The few in Congress who even know some of what's going on re: the NSA's mass surveillance program and don't feel quite right about it (e.g. Wyden) legally can't, and usually don't, say anything. It's up to whistelblowers like Snowden to leak the info, but the White House is going after whistleblowers quite aggressively. And so are a lot of people in the media, sadly, calling Snowden, for example, a traitor and accusing Glenn Greenwald, who first broke the story, of doing it for personal gain and/or a grudge against the US government.

    I honestly doubt the government is going to stop these kinds of activities because of a few internet petitions, a flurry of phone calls and emails, or even a new law. They'll likely just tighten down on their operations so less leaks happen in the future. But it's a start, I guess.
  • BhikkhuJayasaraBhikkhuJayasara Bhikkhu Veteran
    edited February 2014
    Privacy is a basic human right. However right now we only have an illusion of privacy. The powers that be know everything about you down to what chips you like, thanks to RFID chips in food packaging, clothing, and who knows what else.

    About 9 years ago i made the determination to understand that from here on in no matter what I do, no matter how private and secure i think my actions are, the government knows about it. This has proven to be a wise decision since its only getting worse. Privacy, like many things such as safety, is an illusion
  • genkakugenkaku Northampton, Mass. U.S.A. Veteran
    Privacy is a basic human right.
    @Jayantha -- Irrespective of NSA's intrusions (which I dislike primarily because they bolster a fear that nourishes an authoritarian state), isn't it interesting that at the same time privacy might be alleged as "a basic human right," still, as human beings, we DEMAND company?
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    Irrespective of whether they're illusions or not, we have a right to privacy. The law tells us that this is so.
    It's one thing to be indiscreet about one's own personal details, but there's a world of difference between our letting the cat out of the bag, and others using subterfuge and underhand methods to see what's in our bag in the first place.
    Newspapers here are occasioanlly prosecuted for publishing details about peoples' private lives.
    There is quite a difference between what interests the public, and something being 'in the pubkic interest'.
    That's the dividing line, and these organisations want to cross it.That's simply unacceptable.
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    Lincoln said:

    NewBuddhist is supporting the anti-surveillance campaign organized by Fight For The Future. That's why we have the banner running at the bottom of the site today. It's primarily focused on US-centric legislative issues. Thanks to our international friends for enduring us. ;)

    'Enduring' this is no hardship. I've signed it too.

  • TheswingisyellowTheswingisyellow Trying to be open to existence Samsara Veteran
    edited February 2014
    If your not a Terrorist (however that may be defined) what do you have to worry about?
    They are only trying to protect the Heimatland..... errrr I mean Homeland
    Hamsaka
  • JeffreyJeffrey Veteran
    I had a ton of malware toolbars at one time. When I first saw the banner I groaned and thought that the problem happened again.

    Now I breath a sigh of relief. It seems a good cause.
  • robotrobot Veteran
    I'm a Snowden supporter and I signed the petition.
    Doesn't the Internet run on spying by corporations? I think my Internet experience is tuned based on the way i use it, more and more.
    My ipad likely knows more about me than I do.
    Are we here at NB protected from data collection by companies, while we are here? Or does our activity here have no value to companies?
    howBunks
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    robot said:



    Are we here at NB protected from data collection by companies, while we are here?

    Tbh? I have no idea. But I bet you're a lot safer here than on, say, facebook....
    Or does our activity here have no value to companies?
    I'm hard-pressed to think what they could use, tbh....

  • vinlynvinlyn Colorado...for now Veteran
    robot said:

    I'm a Snowden supporter and I signed the petition.
    Doesn't the Internet run on spying by corporations? I think my Internet experience is tuned based on the way i use it, more and more.
    My ipad likely knows more about me than I do.
    ...

    While I am not a Snowden supporter, and wouldn't say that the internet "runs on spying by corporations", it's certainly true that corporations spy heavily on us...and that bothers me far more than what the government does.

    If I look up Phoenix on the web, then I get lots of ads about hotels in Phoenix. Clearly no coincidence. If I look up a product on Amazon, suddenly I get lots of ads for that and similar products. Again, no coincidence.

    Overall it's a concern.

  • JeffreyJeffrey Veteran
    For awhile I had a mental delusion that the internet was an organism like the Tree thing of the movie Avatar. That was a fun idea.
    anataman
  • DharmaMcBumDharmaMcBum Spacebus Wheelman York, UK Veteran
    To be fair @Jeffrey, that would be far better than the truth. I like the tree thing. Much better than it being run by greedy grasping people...
    Jeffrey
  • NirvanaNirvana aka BUBBA   `     `   South Carolina, USA Veteran
    edited February 2014
    Already private companies are doing more or less the same thing as the NSA [sic]. All you need is a person's first and last name and you can find out their marital status, address, children's names, and so forth. Just pay a few dollars and you can find out a lot. And the address is even conveniently linked to a GPS map so that an ne'er-do-well can pinpoint just where you hang your hat.

    This fact scares me more than anything. I trust the government, whereas I do not trust John Public's goodwill for an instant.

    How can anyone halt or dampen that techno-usurpology?
    anataman
  • ChazChaz The Remarkable Chaz Anywhere, Everywhere & Nowhere Veteran
    I don't suppose there's any way to hide that footer?
  • betaboybetaboy Veteran
    I am all for it, but I have the same concerns as Chaz - it is frustrating to have the footer there all the time.
  • robotrobot Veteran
    I can minimize it on the iPad.
  • BunksBunks Australia Veteran
    I get the impression the banner is only there for today so sit tight...... ;)
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    @Chaz, @betaboy, @robot....If you had read Lincoln's first post, you would have quickly spotted the dead give-away word 'today'.

    If @Lincoln had wanted you to know it was running for any different period of time, he would have said so.
    Man of few words, is our Lincoln. But they're all to the point.
    I'm sure the banner is gone for you now, as it is for everyone....
  • robotrobot Veteran
    Yes federica, I did get that part of Lincoln's post. And I did not lose any sleep over the banner because I could minimize it. Let's see if we can break a hundred posts on this subject.
  • ChazChaz The Remarkable Chaz Anywhere, Everywhere & Nowhere Veteran
    federica said:

    @Chaz, @betaboy, @robot....If you had read Lincoln's first post, you would have quickly spotted the dead give-away word 'today'.

    He did not say ONLY today.

    You do have a way about you, Fede.....
    betaboy
  • Frozen_ParatrooperFrozen_Paratrooper Veteran
    A worthy drive. Though I'm worried that the lawless security apparatuses will continue apace in spying no matter what happens. It is why I'm a small-L libertarian and skeptical of any growth in the size of the state. The IRS and their years of harassment of political enemies, the spying at all levels, and micro regulation of everything from lemonade stands to bake sales makes one depressed.
  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
    Chaz said:

    federica said:

    @Chaz, @betaboy, @robot....If you had read Lincoln's first post, you would have quickly spotted the dead give-away word 'today'.

    He did not say ONLY today.

    You do have a way about you, Fede.....
    I know.
    it's what made me a Mod.

    ;)

    Chaz
  • lobsterlobster Veteran
    As someone who lives under heavy surveillance, I welcome more. When Google Glass and eventually body monitoring implants become the norm, no one except the Luddites will object to total surveillance.

    By then we will of course have open circuit TV rather than closed circuit TV. Peoples life stream will be available on the descendants of YouTube and so on.

    Scared for your little self? Of course you are but then nobody much cares. This is they way society is going. Transparency of government too. Want to watch your leaders, your military drones, the dirty little corners of police states?

    Transparency works two ways.

    Long live ceiling cat. ;)
  • DairyLamaDairyLama Veteran Veteran
    What was that thing Frank Zappa said: "These days there's too much secrecy and not enough privacy"? And that was ages ago!
  • footiamfootiam Veteran
    edited February 2014
    Lincoln said:

    NewBuddhist is supporting the anti-surveillance campaign organized by Fight For The Future. That's why we have the banner running at the bottom of the site today. It's primarily focused on US-centric legislative issues. Thanks to our international friends for enduring us. ;)

    I don't understand what you are fighting for. The future is already here.
  • Steve_BSteve_B Veteran
    For some reason, though I am in most respects quite far toward the left wing, I fail to get excited about the privacy and "spying" issue. I have read numerous permutations of the reasoning as discussed in the article linked above. I don't disagree with the points, but neither do I find them especially compelling. I really don't care if the government knows what I read, or what I buy. How can they possibly cause me any harm by knowing such boring things? On the other hand, such data when aggregated has enormous statistical power. So all in all, I don't feel terribly insecure knowing I'm watched, and I do feel perhaps slightly more secure knowing that we're all being watched.

    I don't say this to irritate our gracious hosts at this website, but rather to present a devil's advocate viewpoint (or whatever the Buddhist equivalent of "devil's" advocate is).
    Most of my associates and my wife's associates are near-rabid football fans, especially this year when the local team went to the Super Bowl. I couldn't care less about the sport, it just doesn't interest me. I don't begrudge them their huge TVs and elaborate parties, but it doesn't do anything for me. In the same way, I know people are passionate about this issue, and I just don't get it.
  • vinlynvinlyn Colorado...for now Veteran
    footiam said:

    Lincoln said:

    NewBuddhist is supporting the anti-surveillance campaign organized by Fight For The Future. That's why we have the banner running at the bottom of the site today. It's primarily focused on US-centric legislative issues. Thanks to our international friends for enduring us. ;)

    I don't understand what you are fighting for. The future is already here.
    Just because something "is", does not mean it always has to be so.

    Slavery was once as "is" in America. That changed.
    Rampant and legal racial discrimination was once an "is" in American. That changed.

    I'm kind of in the middle on the whole issue, but surveillance is too broad even for me.

  • lobsterlobster Veteran
    LOL,
    whistle blowers, disclosure websites such as wikileaks, access to spy satellites and peoples phones (not yet universally available) is part of making individual, corporate and state crime, accountable and observable. Privacy at the moment is secrecy for the powerful and disclosure of the vulnerable.

    It will change.

    Prisoner: Where am I?
    Number Two: In the cyber village.
    Prisoner: What do you want?
    Two: Information.
    Prisoner: Whose side are you on?
    Two: That would be telling.... We want information...information...information!
    Prisoner: You won't get it!
    Two: By hook or by crook, we will.
    Prisoner: Who are you?
    Two: The new Number Two.
    Prisoner: Who is Number One?
    Two: You are Number Six.
    Prisoner: I am not a number; I am on Facebook!
    Two: LOL
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opening_and_closing_sequences_of_The_Prisoner
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