"flawlessness"
genkaku
Northampton, Mass. U.S.A. Veteran
Another (apologies) blog post:
A friend sent along the statements relating to the six-month withdrawal of a Zen teacher from his post as honcho for the Mountains and Rivers Order because he had "betrayed" his vows by camouflaging his relationship with a woman other than his long-time partner.
Although I have implicitly and explicitly beaten the drum, both within and without, for something akin to a "flawless life" when it came to spiritual efforts, the link my friend sent along left me tired out.
Flawlessness strikes me these days as a flawed notion, however hopeful and bright it may seem on the face of it. It may be inspiring as all get-out and may push a student in whatever field to excellence and a deeper understanding, but, well....
Things are indeed flawless.
Saying so is deeply flawed, a mote in the eye of the beholder ... and a misuse of energy that might be employed better in other ways ... lacing up unlaced shoes, for example.
The Buddha wasn't a Buddhist, and, nor, should sincere students get sidetracked or bamboozled.
I can hear the 'discussion' sabers being rattled in a variety of sheaths.
Sabers need to be carried.
Carrying stuff is not my best thing these days.
Comments
To me, the point of Right Action and the Third Precept in particular is not some moralistic imposition of perfection, but an essential part of the Path because without clarity of thought and feeling, meditation (and therefore enlightenment) becomes impossible. If I am burdened with feelings of guilt, lust, confusion, etc, then I am unlikely to be able to concentrate very well on mindfulness, because when I do I will be flooded by these feelings. I can imagine that your friend felt like he was doing his students a disservice in attempting to teach them clarity when he was suffering so much confusion himself.
My theoretical understanding says: Every thing occupies its own position and every moment is complete in itself.
That is worth repeating. These kinds of dilemmas make me tired, they just go in circles and that means nowhere. It highlights how little the average person understands the 'standards' we impose on ourselves and each other. "Flawlessness", like @Misecmisc1 is implicit in every thing, but it can't be 'lived' in a human life except by a few.
We can I suggest expect basic integrity, basic morality and ethical behaviour from so called 'teachers'. We can I would also suggest learn more from their hypocrisy than their zen platitudes.
Are we flawless? [put your hand down Mr Cushion, your stuffing is showing]
Expecting imperfect but wise teachers is part of our 'just so' realistic integrity as students. Do we expect sane teachers? Able bodied? Gender or class specific?
My teacher was twice almost assinated. Part of ruling class. Killed his own mother etc . . .yep the flawless Buddha was a rogue . . . and trouble magnet . . .
http://buddhas-lumbini.blogspot.co.uk/p/assassination-attempts.html
Onus on us.
....but being 'aimless' is not necessarily being 'flawless'....
A lazy, good-for-nothing indolent who refuses to get their back off the bed, because they can't be bothered, has no dreams, no plans and yet is perfectly content to spend his benefits in the pub, on the dogs or on cigarettes - is not 'flawless', even though he's 'aimless'.
That doesn't sound like somebody that is aimless, that sounds like somebody that is aiming to live off of the work of others.
That they've given up trying is just a ruse. If they gave up trying, they would surely be dead.
Without trying, you are the perfect example of you. I can't be a better you than you can.
The rock outside is perfect just as it is which is a good thing because I don't think the rocks can aim.
However, the point of "The only way to be flawless is to be aimless" is not to say we must stop aiming but to say it's ok to miss sometimes.
From an outside perspective, on a practical level, yes. On a psychological level, he's 'aimless'. I've met a few....
Nothing has to be filed on time each month or anything?
If his coin doesn't come in, does he care?
I'm willing to bet he aims on getting that money each and every time it's due.
If he is perfectly content to go to the bar, race track and smoke shop then it sounds like he's still just aiming to be happy even if he is misguided and or very selfish about it.
Besides all that though, do his flaws as you see them really fall on him or your expectations of him?
A quote I always liked and saw attributed to Gautama was: "It is not what others do and do not do that is my concern. It is what I do and do not do -- that is my concern."
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yeah, whatever,
You see it your way, I'll see it the way I've experienced.
No need to get defensive about the definition of aimlessness.
Sheesh
Sorry but I still don't understand what the thread is about.
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Ok...
Usually, as little as possible.
Make up a few job searches, phone calls, possible inteviews, get signed off - voila. Money in hand.
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No reason it shouldn't unless he doesn't play his part...
Well hang on.
Now you're twisting the intention or definition of aim/less.
You mean an ulterior motive. The aimless as defined by flawless is "nothing to strive for".
One is selfish, the other is altruistic.
Let's get our ducks in order here.
Whic is not what YOU meant when you said that 'the only way to be flawless is to be aimless."
This guy is aimless, but not in the sense YOU meant. Why twist things round?
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I don't really care to be brutally honest. I'm just stating it like it is, I have no opinion either way....I didn't say he had flaws. I said he was aimless.
well given that we've had a temporary diversion, I wouldn't worry, tbh...
Hollywood Buddhism and the longing to see stars.
it depends a bit on the intention he had when he concealed the relationship.
and even if it creates bad karma so what? he can make up for it and go forward. Which is not to say his action or intention was wise.
I agree, it has now totally lost me as well.... so, @ourself, how's yer belly off for pimples....?
OP, did the teacher in question volunteer to his "order" that he'd crossed a line? Or was he discovered in some other way? If he was honest and confessed to someone, he at least has that going for him.
I don't know why we're calling this "flawlessness". As if it's too much to expect for people to be basically honest, reasonably kind or pleasant (or at least--psychologically stable), knowledgeable in their field, and non-predatory or non-adulterous. Stephen Batchelor made an interesting comment, once; he said if lay people can manage it, why can't teachers/clergy, whom we assume to have a higher degree of spiritual dedication if not advancement? No one goes around hand-wringing that we're expecting too much of university professors when rules against sexual harassment of students are put in place. What if police officers used their power to take sexual advantage of the public? Would we say "Aw, they're only human, you know. Can't expect perfection" ?
Please.
But it may be time for religious institutions to face the fact that their representatives will make mistakes. They should have ombudsmen/women for teachers/clergy to go to when facing temptation, so they can have someone to talk it out with, and get some counseling, and a course of action could be decided upon. Perhaps there can be dedicated ethics courses in the training regime for people going into ministry jobs, in those traditions that don't present that as a dedicated course. Perhaps the time has come to replace finger-wagging with positive preventive measures on the side of the teachers/clergy who may someday find themselves struggling.
I think integrity and transparency are a positive thing Western Buddhism can contribute to Buddhism globally and to dharma practice in the sangha. We can view these struggles as growing pains, rather than as something entirely negative, and have hope that it's fixable. We can be constructive about it.
That's still what happens when I try to quote.
@Federica;
I had two last week but they cleared up.
@genkaku;
When a teacher slips it can be hard on everybody but it is how they react to the slip that counts in my books.
A teacher doesn't have to be perfect.
by Milarepa
For generosity, nothing to do,
Other than stop fixating on self.
For morality, nothing to do,
Other than stop being dishonest.
For patience, nothing to do,
Other than not fear what is ultimately true.
For effort, nothing to do,
Other than practice continuously.
For meditative stability, nothing to do,
Other than rest in presence.
For wisdom, nothing to do,
Other than know directly how things are.
@Dakini -- I apologize. I probably should have included a link to the announcement.
Thanks. Could you check your link? I just get a page that says the website can't find the doc I want.
@Dakini -- The same thing happened to me, though the following brought up the material: http://zmm.mro.org/ryushin-sensei-steps-down/
Something seems to be going on, but I can't tell what it is.
I've been listening to dharma talks from Zen Mountain Monastery for 3 or 4 years now. I find it to be a very disappointing turn of events. Being faithful to your spouse/partner is not a matter of being flawless. After two decades of marriage even an erstwhile layperson like myself can manage to not have extra marital affairs. Teachers shouldn't be expected to be perfect, but really?
Outstanding.
This is integrity. Not being perfect. Admitting it. Apologising and stepping down as an exemplar.
Much better example than the 'I can do better' disciples', 'I is open and free - man' and other perfect dharma do-do's . . .
People fail. Are frail. Get real. That is my plan . . .
This is the way dharma centers should work. A person in authority messes up. In relatively short order, he confesses and steps down. His superiors agree this is the right course of action. There is full disclosure to the sangha. Everyone is given an opportunity to process the news and express themselves. This is a healthy way to handle misconduct.
This is not a situation where misconduct continued for years, was swept under the rug, involved more and more people in the sangha, causing pain to those involved and to truth-tellers within the spiritual community who were not ok with what was going on, and caused major disruption and trauma to the sangha. The issues here were dealt with in a timely manner, and it appears that there was sincere reflection and remorse on the part of the errant teacher. Good work, Zen Mountain Center!
It's interesting to note that one bone of contention was that the teacher had lost his grounding in the Dharma, and had begun to incorporate elements of another tradition into his Dharma teachings. I hope he eventually finds his way, in whichever direction he chooses in the end, and that he's able to resolve his inner issues. Best wishes to a troubled soul.
Thank you for posting this, @genkaku . The dharma community at large can learn from this.