USA bombing Doctors Without Borders Hospital in Afghanistan and western media bias
buddha111
New
Recently there is news about USA bombing Doctors Without Borders Hospital in Afghanistan.Afghanistan. After seeing this kind of news make me question on the intention of america on starting war in the middle and how 'successful' is america war on terror.The america involvement of war in middle east have cause millions of death and their invasion on Iraq were criticised by many . The principal stated justifications for this policy of "regime change" were that Iraq's continuing production of weapons of mass destruction.However still today there is no account or evidence for 'weapon of mass destruction'.Look at all the nations that USA are trying to help by starting war.What state are those counties in?Also,the reason for ISIS and rise of Taliban is partially due to the intervention of USA. 'Some suggests that USA main purpose it is due to oil and other says to benefit the USA weapon or Arms industry.So,what do you guys think on USA war on terror?
Secondly,if this was Russia behind the bombing, western media would suggest sanction Russia but since this is USA , it's just collateral damage moreover Americans are going to investigate their own war crimes.It funny that they are so quick in attacking China and Russia but when it comes to their own crime,they would find excuses like war on terrorism and for peace. So when the USA criticizes Russia about its bombing killing civilians in Syria and then go one better and manage to bomb a medical facility killing civilians and Doctors in Afghanistan. The comment put out after the bombing was 'it 'may have resulted in collateral damage to a nearby medical facility'' that's how they dismiss the killing of innocent people.So,any people find the western media anything bias?
Thirdly,It funny that when some other countries break international law,UN are quick to judge them but when USA break the international law,they are being justified for doing that.that. Isn't it hypocrite?They keep saying that what they doing are for peace and they are the world police and they keep justified what they doing is to hunt down 'terrorists',yet they are the one who are terrorists and cause so many dead and suffering to the people living in the middle east.They force democracy to nations and see what is the results?How successful have it been after the Arab Spring?They think that by using violent,there would be less terrorists but by using violence it only results in more violent.There will be more hatred and the cycle never stops.That why still today,there is still lot of terrorists.So,do you think that USA is hypocritical ?
Lastly,it make me wonder how trust able is the noble prize committee and the UN nation is?I believe that is always political agency in it just like how they reward Obama,EU and Henry Kissinger.It funny how they could award someone who has kill lot of people a noble'peace' prize.So,how do you feel about the noble prize committee and the UN nation?
I sorry if I sound too political or feel like I am just rambling.I just want to write out what I have thought about.As a Buddhist and pacifist,I strongly oppose violence and I would like to listen to how other view this issues. 
Comments
One perspective.
A US led coalition, of which one member of that coalition seeming bombed the wrong target, does not mean that the US bombed the wrong target. Which member and from what source of intelligence they chose to bomb that location, appears to still be under investigation.
Like a murder mystery, the most common suspect almost always turns out to be who ever had the most to gain from such a bombing fiasco or it was just another stupid accident that goes along with every war.
The US military business machine has plenty of points to be easily slammed for without resorting to this kind of slanted story telling.
The first casualty of war so they say... is...the "truth" .....
US need money and oil, and protecct their currency
They started a war in Iraq and makes total caos in middle east far away from home, and the US goverment tells us it is "war against terrorist"
who are the terrorist, where do they live?
THey are everywhere, so US can attack and do what they want, because its war against terror.
If they kill 50 in a hospital, oops, this is not terror? Killing hundred thousends in Iraq? still not terrorist? Nope
Obama should not recive the peace prize, this was a mistake, the leader of the comitee said it was a big mistake in his new book. They hoped the peace prize could bring a good and postive effect for his period as a president, but that was to ambitous.
People know what is going on, but what can they do?
Now we have Syria, Russia and China on one side and Nato and the rebels on the other...If Russia do one small mistake things can get pretty bad.
Buddha111, welcome to New Buddhist. You are continuing a tradition of introductory posts by brand new members that step right off into deep intensity. Your phrasing seems to indicate that you are agitated and emotional about this issue. It would seem that Buddhism has much to offer you. I hope you'll stay.
One: The said member actually joined in April of last year. This seems to be their first contribution.
Two: I second your welcoming sentiment.
Three: Believing anything written in a newspaper as de facto truth, is an unwise and risky action. You really think the powers that be will release the facts anyway? What on earth makes anyone believe this is a mystery? Of course those responsible and involved in military action know EXACTLY what happened. When we can program a satellite up in space to take pictures of people actually walking around on a street, do you really believe this was an accidental strike? Targets can be pinpointed to within centimetres. look at snipers: They can annihilate a target a mile away....
Four: Never, ever believe ANYTHING the Daily Mail reports.... it had been downgraded in the UK from being a newspaper of some quality, favoured by the middle/upper-class Mumsies, to a shining example of what the Gutter Press looks and sounds like. I sadly now put it on a par with The Sun....
Hi ,Steve_B.Thanks for your welcome.I admit I may sound a little agitated and emotional due to my phrasing.When you start to meditate upon and care for those innocent people that have died,those who have lose their parent or children and the amount of suffering that those innocent people had to gone through because of one nation's selfish interest,it hard not to feel angry.Actually,I feel more sad and sympathy.Sad for those who lose their lives and sympathy those people in the government that has no love and compassion for their actions that will result in the loss of many innocent lives.
Hello vinlyn,currently,it hard to actually find the exact and accurate figure for the amount of people that have died.I think I may have overstated it but it doesn't change the fact that many people have die in the war.
The noble peace prize is a prestigious and honourable award awarded for people that help to done the most or the best work for fraternity between nations, for the abolition or reduction of standing armies and for the holding and promotion of peace congresses.However,they have awarded to organisation or people that is controversial to the noble prize objective,example Obama,EU and Henry Kissinger. This greatly contradicts the award objective and actually take away the credible of the noble peace prize.It is now know as a joke award that actually award people who murder people.If by their standard,perhaps Stalin and Hitler could be awarded this award.Yes they could award anybody they want but once they start to move away from the award objective and award people that doesn't deserve it,we,as the public could criticise them and we will lose our trust in them.It sad that this peace prize is mostly political-drive and does not award those who is working hard to make the world a better and more peaceful place and is awarding people that should not even get the award.
Hi how ,it pretty unlikely that they have bomb the wrong target.They can program a satellite up in space to take pictures of people actually walking around on a street but they cannot see properly who they are attacking?Well they can investigate is what they 'say'.They may simply try to cover up or lied through their way or find one scapegoat and blame them.Never trust what the government is saying.The media will probably distract with other news report or briefly dismiss it and move on and soon the audience will forget about it.Also,why when the Russia is bombing Syria,they immediately suspect them of bombing non-ISIS area and the citizens whereas USA has killed lot of innocent people with their drones and then go one better and manage to bomb a medical facility killing civilians and Doctors in Afghanistan.Then they tried to cover up and dismiss the killing of innocent people by saying collateral damage.Double standard,isn't it?
Hi Namada,if the leader of the committee really say that,it greatly show that their decision is one based on political decision and not by what the nominees have done to bring peace.It actually too late.Nobody can really trust in them any more when Obama who have a kill list can actually get the peace award.
Hi federica,i actually have one discussion thread before this thread.
Actually,when I am posting the link with Daily Mail,I actually hesitated because I really doubt the quality of the Daily Mail reports.However,since many different news website have actually report this,I think it will not different much from other website that have already reported the news.I totally agree with you about not believing in any newspaper.I must said ,not to believe in any media because all of them have their own agency and biases in it.Instead,try to read between two opposing sources like CNN and RT and then we could see the two sources and see for any contradiction and why there is controversial.Relying only on one sources for media is very risking.
Overall,I posted this so that people would have the understanding of this incident and really think about the action of USA and not to just blindly listen to the lies and propaganda of the western media.One of the eight precepts is right view and I believe that having a better understanding and not blindly listening to lies and propaganda allow us to see clearly and actually develop a greater insight to what happen and then we could then conclude on the incident with the right mindset and attitude.
Right View in the Eightfold path is one which concerns not only discernment and evaluation of one's own perceptions of any given situation, but processing that 'view' in order to cultivate the 4 sublime states and reside in Calm contemplation.
As the kalama Sutta advises, "believe nothing until you yourself have tested it for yourself...."
We will NEVER know the full truth.
The full truth is kept from the masses for their own protection.
How warped, misguided or true that is, I cannot vouch.
But there are things that even though are of interest to the public, are NOT in the public interest, to be informed of.
Getting angry and emotional about certain news reports is futile.
Getting angry about the collateral damage here, is unproductive, when you consider how many conflicts there are, or have been on this earth, since man knew how to fashion weapons.
There are always innocent bystanders who will appear in the firing line.
There always have been, there always will be.
Cultivate the 4 Sublime States, and work to fix the disparities in your own 'back yard'.
"Be the change you want to see in the world."
We may not be able to affect what happens a thousand miles away, but we can hug our neighbour and be kind.
Kindness, is always possible.
And it's important we be kind to ourselves, first.
federica,it is an insightful post and I believe that I have gained a lot through this discussion.You got to change yourself before you can change the world.However,i must also concluded that we might actually can change what happens a thousand miles away.It was during the Vietnam War when there is horrific photos and videos of the Vietnam War that have been taken by journalists that let the people of united State understand the horror of war and start to rethink about the reason for going to war.Because of knowing the horror of war that they start protesting and the government start feeling the pressure from their citizens that they stop the war.If there is no protest,the war will not end and many more will die. Actually I am not angry due to this news report but sad and angry by the all point of the war and its objective.It normal when you are deeply contemplating about the whole things that have happen.Instead of being angry,I accept it as being a normal reaction.
I believe in updating oneself with current affair such as global warming and the crisis in Syria.With that say,I must thank all of you for willing to discuss this political and global issue which is hardly discuss here.(Actually I was hesitating on posting this discussion).Hope you could find insights and learn something from this discussion.
@buddha111
Not the whole story but still worthy of a note.
It is often easier to look at problems that are perceived to be outside of ourselves than those that are actually within our purview to change.
The big business of pharma or weapon production is little more than what anybody does when money is valued over of their other values.
I don't need to search out boggy men in the US government and big business to point out what my own mirror already does, so much more effectively.
There is a lot of room to criticize the US and it's handling of foreign policy and military matters in the world (I'm an American, and I believe that completely). However, it needs to be based on fact, and it's one area we don't get a lot of honesty so pretty hard to know the facts on which to base our perspective.
Sometimes, the problem is that we are after particular people and intelligence gathering (which still relies on humans who make plenty of errors) misidentifies a building. It's not like Google Maps is accurate enough in Syria to easily identify every building if so-called terrorists are reported hiding there.
To my knowledge, the US has stated and accepted responsibility for the bombing of the hospital. Very sad
I am in NO way condoning collateral damage or nor saying the deaths of those people don't matter. But I don't think you can fairly compare that with what al-Assad has done to the Syrian people. A significant portion of his country's people are displaced and suffering. He killed over 8,000 of his own people in 6 months.
Also, please be sure to remember in your thoughts that it's easy to lump a country as a whole together. There are A LOT of Americans who did not approve of the Iraq war, and do not approve of what happens in the name of our country around the world. We (our government) absolutely turn around and do some of the same things we condemn our enemies over. That doesn't mean all Americans approve of it, or don't know what is going on. We just feel rather helpless to provide a solution beyond voting because we have no control over our defense budget or the military decisions made on our behalf.
But with regards to ISIS and al-Assad and others, I guess I'm not really sure which direction we (or others in the world) should be going in how to deal with this. On the one hand, I don't believe that 2 wrongs make a right. I believe that some of the problems with ISIS were caused by our country's policies in the Middle East. But I don't know how to fix the problem, either, as it seems like violence is the only thing that these types of "bad guys" understand. It is a conflict, for sure. I practice tonglen every day for all the people who suffer. But remember that people don't do horrific things unless they suffer themselves, too.
Buddha-one, you write with an accent, so I want to make sure I understand you clearly.
Are you saying that the US bombed a medical facility because of oil?
Are you saying that the US should not investigate?
Are you saying that precise weapons cannot be used mistakenly due to human error?
Are you saying that unintentional mistakes and terrorism are the same thing?
Are you saying that thousands of years of conflict in the Middle East was "started by the US?"
Are you saying that countless thousands of innocent Syrian civilians were not killed by Assad's military?
Are you saying that Nobel laureates should be selected based on actions they will take subsequent to the award?
Are you saying the Western free press journalists who cover international conflict at extraordinary personal risk are liars and propagandists?
As an American I believe it is patriotic to point out areas where our country can improve. I personally hold views that are quite far left and anti-war. (My friends on the right generally don't agree that it is patriotic to suggest we could improve, or that diplomacy can obviate or reduce weaponry.) However, I am also willing to question the logic and objectivity of what I read. In this thread I seem to be noticing logic and objectivity being displaced by emotion and exaggeration. Do you notice it too?
I admire your spirit in presenting your conclusions in a foreign language. I certainly could not do that!
Just to put things in perpective. There are bigger threats to many more people including ourselves, things that each of us can do something about. And make demands of automakers to not cheat such as Volkswagen.
US foreign policy is to protect its self-interests. US government has to bend to lobbyists.
Dont be fooled for a moment that US is an angel. US supported Saddam Hussein, Shah of Iran, and many other dictators as long as they are allies.
Watch CNN and RT......truth must be something in-between........
According to MSF, 15 minutes after the attack began, they phoned the US command to inform them of the attack. But the attack continued for another 45 minutes. ~ BBC world service.
MSF also said they do not trust US army investigation and would like to see an international body conduct the investigations.
Command structures are not always very efficient.
Despite that we are so used to living in an immediate world, not everything still functions that way, most especially the US government. Most of the time, commands have to go through many levels and take time as people receive information and pass it along and make decisions. Look how long it took once we knew we were under attack in our own country to get planes in the air. Decisions like that definitely do not happen immediately, even if it seems like they should. Most certainly there is room for improvement, but not every single thing is an act of intention. It does not mean that the people dropping bombs from planes knew they were bombing a civilian hospital. I would find that highly unlikely.
Asking questions is good, but there is always a point where you have to ask yourself what good is coming of questions you cannot get answers to, or have no control over. Is there a reason to feed such anger in yourself over such things that you can do nothing about? That doesn't mean it isn't worth discussing, sometimes in doing so we do find answers and solutions. But much of the time we work ourselves into a frenzy, and what for? Wouldn't it make more sense to do so over an issue you can actually help control? If you keep reading and posting about things that make you upset and angry, what is really happening? Is something changing? Or are you just going about your day upset and angry, possibly overreacting to events and people in your own life because of your emotional state over something you cannot control? In my experience, it's better to find a way to direct that so you can help someone. Rather than just making yourself angry. It helps.
Are you saying that the US bombed a medical facility because of oil?
No,when did I say that they bombed a medical facility because of oil?Just like what Namada say,US need money and oil, and protect their currency.You could actually go and research on it in the internet.
Are you saying that the US should not investigate?
So,Are you saying the USA government should investigate?It is funny to ask a culprit to investigate his own crime.Does it make any logical sense?As quoted by Jason Cone, Doctors Without Borders,''The facts and circumstances of this attack must be investigated independently and impartially, particularly given the inconsistencies in the US and Afghan accounts of what happened over recent days. We cannot rely on only internal military investigations by the US, NATO, and Afghan forces.''Even the Doctors Without Borders cannot trust USA government.
Are you saying that precise weapons cannot be used mistakenly due to human error?
Human error?
No,when did I say that?It could due to human error but I don't believe they cannot see that it is a hospital and yet attack it.It is precisely because attacking hospitals in war zones is prohibited that the hospital expected to be protected.So are you saying that USA is justified from their action because it is a ''mistakes''?
Are you saying that unintentional mistakes and terrorism are the same thing?
By your statement,you have already make an assumption that you already think of USA bombing Doctors Without Borders Hospital as an unintentional mistakes.When have I group them together?So do you think that when the USA are conducting air raid and mindlessly bombing the ground,they don't know that many innocent citizens are being killed by the process?They know yet they continue.In the eyes of the innocent victim,aren't USA the terrorist?
Are you saying that thousands of years of conflict in the Middle East was "started by the US
When have I say that?Can you kindly point out which statement or paragraph that I have stated that make you come to that conclusion.By the way,America history isn't that long.United States of America isn't 1000 years old,so it illogical to make that statement.
Can you point out which sentences did I stated that say countless thousands of innocent Syrian civilians were not killed by Assad's military?Well,Assad isn't good either but have you thought of who are going to be in charge of the country after Assad is overthrown?Look at saddam hussein,after he is overthrown,how stable is the middle east?Do you think that USA help the rebel without any other political motives?Do you think that USA have not killed countless of innocent civilians that could compare to Assad?
When have I state that?Please show the statement which i make that claim.I say that it should be what they have done that qualify them for their awards.Is it wrong to award Nobel laureates by what they have done?Look at those that are being award in Physics and Chemistry,they have make some great scientific discovery which enable them to get a Nobel prize.
Are you saying the Western free press journalists who cover international conflict at extraordinary personal risk are liars and propagandists?
Again,when have I stated that?Those journalists risk their life to expose the truth but many of them is being threaten by the government and the new agency not to expose the news for their own safety.Look at Michael Hastings case.There are many cases journalists who risk their lives for the truth but have been silenced by the government.The answer for your question is that it is the government and the new agency that are liars and propagandists.
I greatly admired that you actually take time to read through my discussion but I felt that the questions posted,many of them are just assumption which totally is not stated in my statement.By using word like Are you saying and then asking question that I don't even stated in my statement is a bit frustrating.
Also,I also noticed that many people in this forum actually stand in the line of defend for the america government whereas on other forums,many try to argue whether is it a war crime and many criticise USA government and agree that it is a war crime.Perhaps in this forum,most of the people are in USA whereas for the other forum most of the members are from other countries.But it great to see different opinion on this topic.
Well,I think you exaggerate a bit when you say about 'going about your day upset and angry, possibly overreacting to events and people in your own life because of your emotional state over something you cannot control.'Personally,it does not affect my life and make me overreacting.There will be a point where you realise that there is nothing you can do and you just accept it.This is just one of the meditation I do by meditating about what is happening to the world.Also,I would do compassion meditation where I would actually care and pray for those innocent people that have been dead due to the war and actually sympathise those people responsible for these war.I think everyone assume that I become angry by questioning on questions but instead,I get a greater understanding of the situations and accept what have happen.
I think there are other forums where discussions like this are more appropriate. A good example are the political and current events parts forums on city-data.
To touch on issues such as this here in a Buddhist forum is, IMHO, going in a wrong direction. I would hope this forum is about Buddhism and not dividing people, but this thread is about dividing people.
In any event, I'm glad you all had this discussion...just like Auntie Fed talking about pickling everything in sight and food, it makes me feel more human, heh...
Which is why this topic has been moved form "Buddhism Today" to 'General Banter".
And sunk.
ISIS is backed by Saudi Arabia and King of Saudi visited to US president because they want to discuss that how to stop Russia from attacking ISIS. I doubt.