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Tonglen
redapple
Veteran
in Meditation
Hi guys,
Does anyone practice Tonglen here? If so, how often do you do it? Please can you share your experiences of it?
Thanks!!
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Comments
https://www.lionsroar.com/how-to-practice-tonglen/
I do it occasionally. My experience is it should be experienced, if you feel it may be of benefit. My personal experience is that of a calming effect.
I’ve only just tried it for the first time, it gave an interesting sensation of a kind of ‘knocking or tapping’ on the inbreath which became gradually more intense. Quite unusual.
It is part of the traditional of Tibetan Buddhism, and my Tibetan Lama teaches it.
The benefit of Tonglen is that is helps diminish our attachments and aversions and increase our tendency to feel compassion. It doesn't actually "do" anything (one student asked if visualizing taking in the suffering of others would actually BE taking it in, and our teacher laughed and say "no, no".) By visualizing the taking in of the suffering of others, we both increase our compassion for others while also relaxing in the face of the idea of suffering. And by giving out our own well-being, we are training ourselves to let go of our attachments.
How often do I do it? Not often anymore. Tonglen is of most benefit when we are feeling besieged, but in order to do it skillfully, we need to have practiced the visualizations.
Thanks @FoibleFull very useful explanation.
Visualization in Tantra has an emotive and overwhelming component if done well BUT if overwhelmed or thinking it more than a generated skilfull means ... well ...
For example I regularly allow demons to feast on my negative qualities (they like that shit) HOWEVER if I believed myself beseiged by Mahakala and pals I would have to ground myself in the funny farm and grow Boddhisatvas that eat demons ...
Snap fingers, all mind projections gone ...
https://www.lionsroar.com/dharma-dictionary-yidam/
Yes I have a bit but not often.
Interestingly reverses the taking in good breathing out pain practice that can also be done, but this mode of practice has its benefit in releasing out the good and allowing that to spread. I don't do it for others or compassion or such it is more like a general overall spreading of good and a transformation of bad.
Tonglen can be added to our repertoire of breath awareness ...
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/changepower/201703/12-quick-mini-meditations-calm-your-mind-and-body
I've yet to properly practice Tonglen, I'm looking forward to it, but I take my sweet time like with pretty much everything. I did just write a prayer though in the spirit of Tonglen. A very personal one and it had a deep emotional effect on me as well (similarly, when I wrote some poems, I sometimes teared up over them, I preferred it that way). I feel like some things are starting to make sense to me emotionally as well, not just intellectually. Like vegetarianism for example or what I've read about the Bodhisattva path. Without mistaking emotional impacts for actual progress on letting go of some attachments, I am glad I'm somehow getting in synch with aspects of Tonglen.
@RobinH
Emotions can be tamed to a degree or eventually totally if committed. For example I was reading my 'Yoga in a nutshell' book this morning AND
some pranayama makes a good intro to calming emotional imbalance.
https://www.artofliving.org/in-en/yoga/pranayama/what-is-pranayama-types-techniques
Could be helpful?
Thank you. Could be when I get there. I'm not really driven to do that just yet. Perhaps if I properly practice and I find that these emotions make progressing difficult.
Good that you are trying out this form of meditation, RobinH. Others above have talked about its benefits, it is quite unique and I think whether you stay with it depends on whether you connect with it. You may find that in your journey with meditations different things suit you at different stages, so if you find one type stops ‘feeling right’ after a while or becomes stressful, then it may become time to explore something new.
That you can tear up over prayers and poems suggests that you are likely sensitive and in good touch with your emotions, both beautiful qualities. How do you feel about acquiring more equanimity (the Buddhist term would be upeksha) through your Buddhist practice? Do you think this would be a good thing, or would you see it as a loss? For me, equanimity came naturally with more longer term Buddhist reading and practice, although I have been more into other areas lately.
Are you into Tibetan Buddhism?
Thank you. Interesting question. I can be rather melancholic. But I'm the kind of person who tries to be in touch with his emotions as much as possible, I use them for introspection, for creativity, etc. So I feel just as positively about crying than about laughing for example. And I've struggled with depression for most of my life, so I'm not exactly sure how the kind of equanimity you're referring to would be different from things I've experienced in the past. If you mean a lack of passion, a reduced drive to fuel and satisfy desires, a general mood of ambiguity by it... well, the artist in me would certainly see it as a loss and my wife could get worried over such. But I'm not too eager to get there just yet. These are my baby steps into Buddhism. I'm at around week 1 of not eating meat, after almost 39 years. Half my life I didn't bother myself about the ethics of how I watch my movies and stuff. I almost never meditate and I've yet to visit a sangha for the very first time. Think of me as a tourist who's looking for a rental for an unspecified time, people who move to a new country experience some sort of a low after a first few months or years of high and I'm not yet anywhere near that experience with Buddhism and spirituality of any sort and people I encountered in the past who came across as strict "you either do it like this or there's no point doing it at all", "meditation is not supposed to make you feel good, don't become a buddhist to be happier, drop all the new age bs" etc only made me defiant. In most things I'm an autodidact with lots of procastination. But que sera, sera. And yes, Tibetan Buddhism and Mahayana seems to appeal to me most (I don't think I'd start with Zen, but I did get a zen circle tattoo many years ago, before I even knew about its deep connection to religion, I simply liked its possible interpretations as a symbol).
Oh dear, that sounds like you encountered some of the ‘strict brigade’. NewBuddhist is very much the other direction (the strict people gather at Dharma Wheel). I’d even say if meditation doesn’t feel at least neutral, then you’re doing something wrong.
For me, the early stages of Buddhism were about purification and watching things drop away. I don’t play computer games anymore, I watch vastly less television, I read a lot less fiction, I drink very little alcohol these days, among other changes which seemed to happen by themselves. So I won’t say Buddhism won’t change your life but you will likely be happier for it.
As far as a direction is concerned, you can’t really go wrong, each tradition has good teachers and less good ones. But even from a poor teacher much can be learned, in the end learning to tune in to your own inner compass is the most important skill.
To be frank, my own inner compass is just nudging me to find a way to share the love I have with others. I think we people have a great capacity to love but most of our lives we struggle to share it. I now found someone like that, but even though my life-long dream was to become a father there's a very real possibility that will never happen. Because we're not in a position to provide for a child financially and by the time we might get there, we might miss our window. And our lack of property owned + my depression diagnosis would likely disqualify us from adoption. We did lose an unborn child recently and I'm still processing it. I can't keep using my creative projects as escapism (I can dig myself into such for years) because I have a life to live and no money to spend on production. So, while I am searching for easier projects that would allow me to relax and still create, I am also trying to make sure that when I die I'll have no love left in me unclaimed and unshared. And the thought that all kinds of people and beings out there might benefit from it somehow, that my unborn child could be among them and I can still make a difference for them. That's why I'm here now. And if I stray away for a while, it's probably what will bring me back too. Everything else I'll have to learn from others.
That sounds like a difficult position to be in, life has not made your path easy, it seems 🙏
For your consideration:
“In Italy, for thirty years under the Borgias, they had warfare, terror, murder and bloodshed, but they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci, and the Renaissance.
In Switzerland they had brotherly love, they had five hundred years of democracy and peace, and what did they produce? The cuckoo clock.”
— Orson Welles, The Third Man
But in a way I am serious. Suffering does become the fuel for enlightenment, in some cases, for those who find the path. It motivates the search for enlightenment, because once life has become unbearable people go to look for the way out.
The Buddha’s life illustrates this perfectly. When he was born, the royal astrologers of the king his father predicted he would be either a world conquering monarch or a beggar, and so the king asked how to ensure he would be the monarch. One among the astrologers said, give him the finest of everything, but don’t let him see how people suffer. So the king constructed palaces where Siddhartha Gautama was to be kept engaged and diverted by the finest things, the prettiest dancing girls and companions.
Then one day he went to partake of a parade with his chariot, and he saw an old man, and later a diseased man, and a dead man, and an ascetic. These “four sights” were explained by the charioteer, and inspired him to leave his life as a prince, and set out as a wandering ascetic and search for enlightenment as the solution to suffering. It was the sight of how mankind suffers that motivated it, it was the shock of what came for all people eventually that drove him.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Buddha
Yes.As a formal cushion practice every now and again, and every day when I hear of or see others suffering, there’s a wish to take on their pain and a genuine hope they find peace of mind, free from all the mental and physical distress they’re carrying.
However, I do find it more difficult when I see those who have caused suffering now going through it themselves. The wish is still there, but the feeling behind it isn’t as strong. It doesn’t come with the same force
As someone learning to punch Nazis in the face (where legal) as a wrathful practice, Tonglen is ideal.
However I am not ideal either in practice or in ultimate compassion. So I start with minor Tonglen, such as the Bodhissatva vow.
Then I see all the grass.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhisattva_vow
I am gonna be here FOR EVER! (you lucky people)...