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I don't know but from what I've read, the DS practitioners do seem the likeliest suspects for these murders and their history prior to that is one of sectarianism and aggressiveness. They were arguably causing schism in the Sangha (which is a very grave offense in Buddhism) and blatantly disregarding the head of Gelugpa's instructions.
Now, I'm not well-versed in the actual doctrinal arguments but let's not sit around being offended by HHDL's stance on the issue, when DS practitioners have behaved quite ruthlessly and immorally themselves.
In Tibet, spiritual rulership equals political power. Dorje Shugden defies that because he originated from opponents of the so called fifth Dalai Lama.
In fact, a candidate for the position of the fourth Dalai Lama, who was opponent to the fifth, was murdered. After that the fifth banned the search for his reincarnation. It didn't work out so well because eventually people started saying he was a dharma protector, the so called Dorje Shugden.
The fifth, very smart, stated that after some exorcisms Dorje Shugden, who was in previous life an enemy and whose remains he ordered to be throw in the river, was now on his side, as a Dharma Protector (smart move). The problem is, as he is said to protect the teachings from degenerating and has an oracle, anybody who opposes the Dalai Lama can simply spread Shugden and say that his oracle told them this Dalai Lama is corrupting the teachings.
Tulkus are the way Tibetans mantain rulership in a Theocratic society. It is pretty obvious they didn't have open elections. They just stated this person is the reincarnated lama what not and he is now also entitled to Enthronement (yeah, tulkus get enthroned). Not by coincidence, the western tulkus that were nominated by Penor Rinpoche were a millionaire actor and a new age charismatic leader who just happened to be giving him money to support 70 something monks.
I'm not a fan of the tulku system either and I agree with you there but your five minute research into the history leaves some serious gaps.
Like I said, believe whatever you want but you should be aware that this practice has always targeted other Buddhists for hostility, primarily Nyingmapa's. Many people I know, both teachers and prominent practitioners are currently "targeted" as enemies by those who promote this practice.
and blatantly disregarding the head of Gelugpa's instructions.
Dude, the Dalai Lama is not the head of the Gelug school, or any other school...The leader of the Gelug is a senior monk that is appointed to do so. He is not chosen based on reincarnation.
I don't know but from what I've read, the DS practitioners do seem the likeliest suspects for these murders and their history prior to that is one of sectarianism and aggressiveness.
The Dalai Lama was a DS practitioner, and so was his master. And so were previous Dalai Lamas.
Dude, the Dalai Lama is not the head of the Gelug school, or any other school...The leader of the Gelug is a senior monk that is appointed to do so. He is not chosen based on reincarnation.
The Dalai Lama was a DS practitioner, and so was his master. And so were previous Dalai Lamas.
The Dalai Lama holds and transmits ALL lineages of Tibetan Buddhism. The Ganden Tripa is the official head of the Gelug lineage.
This is one of the primary reasons why the DS people oppose him so strongly.
They believe that the an authentic Dalai Lama is "pure" Gelugpa.
The funny things is that the guy that started the thread was probably a Shugden practitioner that went silent and somehow I, who don't even believe in such things, ended up taking his side. That is weird. I guess I will stop now :^P
The funny things is that the guy that started the thread was probably a Shugden practitioner that went silent and somehow I, who don't even believe in such things, ended up taking his side. That is weird. I guess I will stop now :^P
I'm sure he is. Nobody would use the sources he was unless they were or they somehow happened to stumble upon the website.
Its a complicated and kind of fascinating issue. Its also a very unfortunate one.
Dude, the Dalai Lama is not the head of the Gelug school, or any other school...The leader of the Gelug is a senior monk that is appointed to do so. He is not chosen based on reincarnation.
While there is the Gelug Tripa, the Dalai Lama is the ranking Tibetan Buddhist in general and considers a high amount of sway in the Gelug tradition, to the point where he is something of a leader. So, unless you can show evidence of the Gelug Tripa contradicting HHDL on this, your point is irrelevant.
The Dalai Lama was a DS practitioner, and so was his master. And so were previous Dalai Lamas.
Honestly, you're just being a contrarian now. You know what I mean. I would normally explain further, but I'm not going to waste my time with something so obvious.
Among the many lineage holders of the Gelug are the successive incarnations of the Dalai Lama (also known as Gyalwa Rinpoche), the succession of the Panchen Lama, the Chagkya Dorje Chang, Ngachen Könchok Gyaltsen, Kyishö Tulku Tenzin Thrinly, Jamyang Shepa, Phurchok Jampa Rinpoche, Jamyang Dewe Dorje, Takphu Rinpoche, Khachen Yeshe Gyaltsen, and many others.
The Dalai Lama is the ranking lineage holder and is arguably holds the most sway over the Gelug lineage despite the fact that the Ganden Tripa is the official head of the lineage. I guess that's partly what you're taking issue with, and I guess I misspoke. But in a lineage-based tradition, being the ranking lineage holder is no small matter.
It is perhaps more fruitful to ask the question why it was at this particular time that Tulku Dragpa Gyaltsen is believed to have fulfilled the promise he had made long ago in a previous life and became a Dharma protector.
Why was the Gelugpa tradition at that moment perceived by some Tibetans to be in danger as to require another guardian exclusive to its tradition?
Why did the historical circumstances come together for this to occur when the Gelugpas supposedly celebrated their greatest victory?
What was the tension between the Fifth Dalai Lama and the Gelugpa tradition that he felt such animosity towards its monks of whom he was one?
One possible interpretation is that the Fifth Dalai Lama represented less the purely religious Gelugpas, since he seems to have largely preferred to practice according to his own visions based on a Nyingma version of Tibetan Buddhism, and represented more the Gelug tradition as a political-administrative power base.
This is not the example Je Tsong Khapa had shown his followers. He had resisted political involvement and rejected direct association with the Chinese emperor.
See, for example, Tibetan Nation, p. 103. But a fair ruler of a country has to represent all religious traditions which reduced the Gelugpas to the role a majority political party plays in support of its leader. Dorje Shugden does not need to be looked at as a political rival to the institution of Dalai Lama, as he oddly was again recently, but simply as a guardian of one particular religious tradition whose concern is purely religious in the sense of protecting the Dharma from declining into mere political or worldly involvement.
According to this interpretation, Dorje Shugden had to arise at the time when the Ganden Phodrang government was established since with it arose the greatest danger for Gelugpas: to lose their religious tradition to mere political and social involvement.
Today that danger is even greater because since the advent of modernity religion is defined almost exclusively in sociological terms and whatever religious knowledge does not fit the social parameters of the moment becomes eclipsed. The loss of the inner core of meaning is what a Buddhist protector is believed to guard against since he or she is entrusted with the continuity of a wisdom tradition.
And Dorje Shugden being a protector entrusted to certain teachings doesn't mean he's sectarian. It's just his "specialisation". There are Shakya practitioners of Dorje Shugden, so he's not a sectarian protector. He's a Dharma Protector.
It is perhaps more fruitful to ask the question why it was at this particular time that Tulku Dragpa Gyaltsen is believed to have fulfilled the promise he had made long ago in a previous life and became a Dharma protector.
Why was the Gelugpa tradition at that moment perceived by some Tibetans to be in danger as to require another guardian exclusive to its tradition?
Why did the historical circumstances come together for this to occur when the Gelugpas supposedly celebrated their greatest victory?
What was the tension between the Fifth Dalai Lama and the Gelugpa tradition that he felt such animosity towards its monks of whom he was one?
One possible interpretation is that the Fifth Dalai Lama represented less the purely religious Gelugpas, since he seems to have largely preferred to practice according to his own visions based on a Nyingma version of Tibetan Buddhism, and represented more the Gelug tradition as a political-administrative power base.
This is not the example Je Tsong Khapa had shown his followers. He had resisted political involvement and rejected direct association with the Chinese emperor.
See, for example, Tibetan Nation, p. 103. But a fair ruler of a country has to represent all religious traditions which reduced the Gelugpas to the role a majority political party plays in support of its leader. Dorje Shugden does not need to be looked at as a political rival to the institution of Dalai Lama, as he oddly was again recently, but simply as a guardian of one particular religious tradition whose concern is purely religious in the sense of protecting the Dharma from declining into mere political or worldly involvement.
According to this interpretation, Dorje Shugden had to arise at the time when the Ganden Phodrang government was established since with it arose the greatest danger for Gelugpas: to lose their religious tradition to mere political and social involvement.
Today that danger is even greater because since the advent of modernity religion is defined almost exclusively in sociological terms and whatever religious knowledge does not fit the social parameters of the moment becomes eclipsed. The loss of the inner core of meaning is what a Buddhist protector is believed to guard against since he or she is entrusted with the continuity of a wisdom tradition.
And Dorje Shugden being a protector entrusted to certain teachings doesn't mean he's sectarian. It's just his "specialisation". There are Shakya practitioners of Dorje Shugden, so he's not a sectarian protector. He's a Dharma Protector.
And thank you Nameless River who ended up taking my side. But really, I personally support His HOliness and support Dorje Shugden practitioners. I just wish to understand more and believe that Dorje Shugden practitioners should not be treated like outcasts.
It is very difficult if you have received the commitment and practice from your Guru, and then the spiritual head "bans" it. Many monks have suffered and I knew that they are for real because I have friends visiting Gaden and Drepung in Mundgod, India who told me what happened to the monks there. It is real and it's not just media propaganda.
And thank you Nameless River who ended up taking my side. But really, I personally support His HOliness and support Dorje Shugden practitioners. I just wish to understand more and believe that Dorje Shugden practitioners should not be treated like outcasts.
It is very difficult if you have received the commitment and practice from your Guru, and then the spiritual head "bans" it. Many monks have suffered and I knew that they are for real because I have friends visiting Gaden and Drepung in Mundgod, India who told me what happened to the monks there. It is real and it's not just media propaganda.
If you want to be taken seriously you are going to have to post better sources for your information than this.
I'm sorry but the society is not a valid source of info on this issue, or any issue for that matter. I have read some of their brochures and they are outrageous.
I am new here at the newbuddhist forum so I hope to learn more and perhaps seniors like you who are "old friend on the site" can help to share more resources on where I can find more info about the current situation that are "better sources".
But then again, like what Nameless River said, academics or authority in Tibetan History could also have agenda.
I do not agree with the Western Shugden Society and what they say (I find that some of the accusation in The Great Deception is attacking His Holiness), but I do think what I quoted was quite a good point - to think about the questions that were posed.
I am new here at the newbuddhist forum so I hope to learn more and perhaps seniors like you who are "old friend on the site" can help to share more resources on where I can find more info about the current situation that are "better sources".
But then again, like what Nameless River said, academics or authority in Tibetan History could also have agenda.
I do not agree with the Western Shugden Society and what they say (I find that some of the accusation in The Great Deception is attacking His Holiness), but I do think what I quoted was quite a good point - to think about the questions that were posed.
The questions etc are fine to ask but the DSS is just plain weird.
For better info you will have to talk to people who can read Tibetan and have access to historical documents that give a clear and accurate picture of the history of the situation.
The unfortunate thing is that these documents arent available in english and the NKT and DSS are capitalizing on this via the internet.
Its unfortunate.
Nothing like that at all, Torin. The Dalai Lama is not the Buddhist pope. He is, however, the head of the Gelugpa school, and as such he has the right to tell his students what practices are OK to do and which aren't. The reason he banned the Dorje Shugden practice is because it is intended to suppress other schools of Buddhism, which is not beneficial to anyone. It's really not very complex, despite the smokescreens put up by the Dorje Shugden people.
Palzang
Dear Palzang
Btw, The Dalai Lama is NOT the head of the Gelugpa school. The head of the Gelugpa school is the Gaden Throneholder also known as HH The Gaden Tripa.
The Dalai Lama claims that Shugden practice is sectarian but there is no proof of it. And talking about Gaden Tripas. The 101st Gaden Tripa, at the end of his term, has recently LEFT Gaden Monastery because he would like to practice Dorje Shugden. He joins the ranks of HH Trijang Rinpoche (whose previous incarnation was the junior tutor to the Dalai Lama).
Ignorant twits like me may not know much but when highly attained beings such as Gaden Trisur and Trijang Rinpoche practice, i think there must be some good behind it.
Also, what's very weird is that the Dalai Lama has given permission for Trijang Rinpoche to practice Dorje Shugden. If it's a practice which harms Tibet, why would the Dalai Lama give him permission? By the way, there's a video of the Dalai Lama actually saying this so no misquotes possible.
It's a fascinating topic. There are more smokescreens than you think.
Dude, the Dalai Lama is not the head of the Gelug school, or any other school...The leader of the Gelug is a senior monk that is appointed to do so. He is not chosen based on reincarnation.
The Dalai Lama was a DS practitioner, and so was his master. And so were previous Dalai Lamas.
Nameless - you're absolutely right! thank you for being open - in the Buddhist sense of the word, which is not rejecting.
The funny things is that the guy that started the thread was probably a Shugden practitioner that went silent and somehow I, who don't even believe in such things, ended up taking his side. That is weird. I guess I will stop now :^P
Music Delighting the Ocean of Protector - An Account expressing the realizations of the wonderful three secrets of the emanted great Dharma King, Mighty Dorje Shugden, supreme protector of conquere Manjusri Tsongkhapa's Teachings
First of all, Trijang Rinpoche, Dalai Lama's tutor is an authoritative figure in Tibetan Buddhism and wrote this text. Yet, Dalai Lama said that his Guru and those who practised Dorje Shugden are wrong check out this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5HMCA-8pec
And, Dalai Lama himself was a Shugden practitioner and even wrote a prayer called MELODY OF THE UNCEASING VAJRA.
The questions etc are fine to ask but the DSS is just plain weird.
For better info you will have to talk to people who can read Tibetan and have access to historical documents that give a clear and accurate picture of the history of the situation.
The unfortunate thing is that these documents arent available in english and the NKT and DSS are capitalizing on this via the internet.
Its unfortunate.
Yes, I do agree with you, and I do have friends who knew monks in Gaden & Drepung in India, and they have mentioned that this text is true and has been used for Dorje Shugden practitioners.
What I am interested in is Dorje Shugden and not NKT nor WSS :cool:
Many Dorje Shugden practitioners are now being "exiled' in their own exiled commnunity. (find out more from this Youtube video entitled Dalai Lama and Dorje Shugden, Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n5sOm-uQH9Y
I strongly feel that instead of turning away people who practise Dorje Shugden, we should be kind to them. Invite them, teach them, slowly and give them logic and wisdom without fear, then in time they give up the practice assuming it is ‘wrong’. Wouldn’t that be a Buddhistic approach to all ‘wrong-doers’?
Dorje Shugden practitioners are not doing anything wrong. But hypothetically, if they are, wouldn’t it be a better and more true to the spirit of Buddhism to be accepting? So those reading this website who have views against Dorje Shugden should contemplate this.
Those who are practicing Dorje Shugden should forbear with extreme patience, fortitude and keep their commitments.
I think this whole discussion is going on a big detour. I'd like to bring it back to the original point made by pathseeker - a call to be even kinder to people who we may not agree with etc. Yes, that is the buddhist way - in our meditations, we are taught to visualise sending metta and compassion even to our enemies and spirits, but now people practising a different deity are being persecuted, attacked, have their houses burned, denied education and welfare aid from the government, ostracised etc...
This is being done supposedly in the name of the dalai lama - it is so primitive, like the same justifications that were given during the Christian Crusades or even by Muslim terrorists. These supporters of the dalai lama don't realise that by being so aggressive and militant in their supposed "upholding" of the ban, they are shooting themselves in the foot - they make the dalai lama look bad, and as the dalai lama is the spiritual leader of all tibetan buddhists, they also give a bad name to all of tibetan buddhism.
People will look upon tibetan buddhists and think, "wow this is what their religion is about? They defend their spiritual leader by attacking others?" and I wouldn't be surprised if that turned them off buddhism completely. After all, all we hear about in the news/media now is about this controversy - the politics surrounding all of Tibetan buddhism. Either it's about the free tibet cause or it's about the Dorje Shugden issue. So where is the real practice? You never hear about that because the people who are really practising sincerely are doing just that.... quietly doing their practice in the quiet peaceful, non-political spaces of their own monasteries. Unfortunately, the world doesn't get to see these beautiful and amazing Dharma practitioners. They see only the politics and that is the face they will see of Buddhism.
So yes, this is a plea and a call to all Buddhists that if you really want to reflect your gurus and your practices well, you should be even kinder, practice even harder, be even more patient and more tolerant - even to those you don't agree with. That way, you really show the world what practice is about. Two results can arise:
1) If you support the Dalai lama, then you will show a good reflection of the dalai lama and win people over to wanting to follow the dalai lama also;
2) if you are a Dorje Shugden practitioner, then you will show a good reflection of this protector and win people over to wanting to also do the practice.
Either way, kindness and sincerity wins the day, wherever you are or whatever you are doing/supporting. Goodness always prevails over evil, after all!!!
As Shugden practitioners, don't we wish to embody the essence of our beloved Dharmapala? As difficult as it is, often times we do feel the need get back at othes. However what makes me refrain from doing so is my Guru's words...that if we allow ourselves to be rude, we may get away with it due to the reasons we give ourselves. However, it may be detrimental as this attitude will be reinforced each time we are rude to others.
I strongly feel that instead of turning away people who practise Dorje Shugden, we should be kind to them. Invite them, teach them, slowly and give them logic and wisdom without fear, then in time they give up the practice assuming it is ‘wrong’. Wouldn’t that be a Buddhistic approach to all ‘wrong-doers’?
We can never go wrong by doing the right thing, applying the 6 paramitas. Please don't get me wrong that I am hung up on what's right and what's wrong. I'm not a judge in conducts as I am just one striving to apply the buddhist teachings for happiness of oneself and others.
Peace
I think this whole discussion is going on a big detour. I'd like to bring it back to the original point made by pathseeker - a call to be even kinder to people who we may not agree with etc. Yes, that is the buddhist way - in our meditations, we are taught to visualise sending metta and compassion even to our enemies and spirits, but now people practising a different deity are being persecuted, attacked, have their houses burned, denied education and welfare aid from the government, ostracised etc...
This is being done supposedly in the name of the dalai lama - it is so primitive, like the same justifications that were given during the Christian Crusades or even by Muslim terrorists. These supporters of the dalai lama don't realise that by being so aggressive and militant in their supposed "upholding" of the ban, they are shooting themselves in the foot - they make the dalai lama look bad, and as the dalai lama is the spiritual leader of all tibetan buddhists, they also give a bad name to all of tibetan buddhism.
People will look upon tibetan buddhists and think, "wow this is what their religion is about? They defend their spiritual leader by attacking others?" and I wouldn't be surprised if that turned them off buddhism completely. After all, all we hear about in the news/media now is about this controversy - the politics surrounding all of Tibetan buddhism. Either it's about the free tibet cause or it's about the Dorje Shugden issue. So where is the real practice?
Thank you the Red Niece. I totally agree with you. It's not about Shuden practitioners. As Buddhists, we even have to be kind towards spirits and offer them food during tsog, so needless to say, our Dharma brothers and sisters. Remember, these Shugden practitioners are BUDDHISTS and believe in the Buddha!
I have been thinking recently about how we can make the whole DS situation a little more uplifting and bring some balance and happiness back into the equation.
It was a little happy moment to discover on the dorjeshugden.com website earlier today that there are some very lovely articles which have just been posted up about great masters who were/are renowned DS practitioners. Great! Fits in quite well with what I have been thinking recently about how we need to stop just focusing on what the Dalai Lama is doing "badly" or "wrongly" all the time, and look at what other incredible Lamas all around the world are doing for the spread of Dharma everywhere.
The stories are very beautiful and there are great photos as well - how can these lamas be in any way "evil" or "bad" by their practice of Dorje Shugden? It doesn't make any sense! If you look at all the incredible teachings they have received and are giving to many more people around the world (to both Tibetans and non-Tibetans), you realise that Dharma is not about fighting over the "validity" of one practice, whether what that lama said was correct or what this lama said was incorrect - it is about, at the end of the day, the lamrim, how they have held their vows their whole lives and their incredible courage to continue teaching in the face of all the adversity (first, losing their country and having to reestablish in a totally foreign land, and then secondly, almost having their practices taken away from them).
i do recommend having a read of those articles on the website - it's on dorjeshugden.com. There's a bunch of good stuff on the right hand column when you first log in, titled "very interesting reads" or you could click on the "great masters" tab. Then come back here and share what lifted your heart the most today!
Just wanted to say I'm sorry for letting my emotions get the best of me. I don't know how much that helps, but hopefully we can all move forward from here.
Just wanted to say I'm sorry for letting my emotions get the best of me. I don't know how much that helps, but hopefully we can all move forward from here.
Thank you not1not2 for your note. It is not that we need an apology, but I think what DS practitioners would like now in the world is some understanding and open dialogue - a space where we can try to understand this situation better and gain some support for our practice, especially within a religious scene where this practice is so strongly suppressed and where practitioners are shunned or mistreated.
Many DS practitioners do not wish to get political. They respect the Dalai Lama very much and they also respect their own teachers, lineages and practices very much. They just want to have the freedom to practice without having to suffer ostracisation or, in some extreme cases, even physical attacks. There are protests and people are very verbal about it... I don't know if I really support having all these protests as that can tend to become political, but I understand why they do it - it is out of a deep wish to protect their lineage and practice and speak for those who are being overtly persecuted.
I myself believe in mutual respect. Whether we choose to practice something or not, or follow the advice of a teacher or not is really an individual choice (we all have our own karma to face at the end of the day, after all). But we can still have respect for each other and not go all the way out to bash the other fellow up! We even have respect for other religions that we don't agree with, so why would we suppress people within our own religion?
Everyone's post is interesting as we are able to share different views and thoughts and learn from each other through healthy debate. Here are some information that I would like to share in light on WHO is this Dorje Shugden for the benefit of those who may not really know or who are new. From here you can see Dorje Shugden's nature is to help all beings, it really does not matter which sect/school/monastery/tibetan or not you are from. All is required is your sincerity in practicing the Dharma.
Nature and Function
Dorje Shugden and the Deities of his mandala are the same nature as the Deities of the body mandala of Lama Losang Tubwang Dorjechang, who is in essence Je Tsongkhapa. After Je Tsongkhapa passed away, Khädrubje received five visions of him, each time appearing in a different aspect. Later, the great Yogi Dharmavajra saw Je Tsongkhapa in the aspect of Lama Losang Tubwang Dorjechang. This name was given to Je Tsongkhapa by Manjushri. It indicates that Je Tsongkhapa is the embodiment of both Conqueror Vajradhara and Buddha Shakyamuni. ‘Losang Dragpa’ is Je Tsongkhapa’s ordained name, ‘Tubwang’ or ‘Powerful Able One’ is an epithet of Buddha Shakyamuni, and ‘Dorjechang’ is Tibetan for Vajradhara. Lama Losang Tubwang Dorjechang is an enlightened being and the principal Field for Accumulating Merit in the Guru yoga of Offering to the Spiritual Guide, or Lama Chöpa.
Lama Lobsang Tubwang Dorje Chang
In reality the Lama Chöpa instruction comes from Manjushri’s Emanation Scripture, which includes special instructions on Mahamudra. The Emanation Scripture, which cannot be read by ordinary beings, was revealed directly to Je Tsongkhapa by Manjushri. It was passed down to successive lineage Gurus and when it reached the first Panchen Lama, Losang Chökyi Gyaltsän, he extracted the instructions on Lama Chöpa and the Root Text of the Mahamudra, the Main Path of the Conquerors and wrote them down in Tibetan. This was an act of great kindness because it meant that for the first time ordinary beings could read and practise Lama Chöpa and the special close lineage of Vajrayana Mahamudra. The Guru yoga of Lama Chöpa is one of the most blessed practices within Je Tsongkhapa’s tradition, being the essential preliminary practice for Vajrayana Mahamudra. An extensive commentary to this practice can be found in Great Treasury of Merit.
There are thirty-two Deities within the body mandala of Lama Losang Tubwang Dorjechang, and it is these Deities who manifest as the thirty-two Deities of Dorje Shugden’s mandala. This was explained by Je Phabongkhapa, an emanation of Heruka, in his prayer to Dorje Shugden: The aggregates, elements, sources, and limbs of Lama Losang Tubwang Dorjechang appear in the aspect of the five Lineages of Dorje Shugden and their retinues. Realizing that in reality I am practising the yoga of the thirty-two Deities of the body mandala, I offer this practice to you, O five lineages of Dorje Shugden; please accept it with delight.
Of the Deities of the five lineages of Dorje Shugden, the principal Deity is Duldzin Dorje Shugden. He is a manifestation of the aggregate of consciousness of Lama Losang Tubwang Dorjechang. Vairochana Shugden is a manifestation of the form aggregate of Lama Losang Tubwang Dorjechang, Ratna Shugden is a manifestation of his aggregate of feeling, Päma Shugden is a manifestation of his aggregate of discrimination, and Karma Shugden is a manifestation of his aggregate of compositional factors. Many sadhanas of Dorje Shugden state that Dorje Shugden is the embodiment of the ‘Guru, Yidam, and Protector’. Here, ‘Guru’ refers specifically to Lama Tsongkhapa. Thus, when we practise the sadhana of Dorje Shugden we are indirectly practising the Guru yoga of Je Tsongkhapa, as well as the practices of Yamantaka and Kalarupa. Atisha said, ‘You Tibetans rely upon hundreds of Deities but do not achieve even one attainment, whereas we Indian Buddhists rely upon only one Deity and achieve the attainments and blessings of hundreds of Deities.’ We should bear Atisha’s comment in mind and realize that it is much more meaningful to practise one Deity sincerely, regarding that Deity as the synthesis of all Deities, than it is to practise many Deities superficially.
Dorje Shugden – an emanation of Manjushri
Some people believe that Dorje Shugden is an emanation of Manjushri who shows the aspect of a worldly being, but this is incorrect. Even Dorje Shugden’s form reveals the complete stages of the path of Sutra and Tantra, and such qualities are not possessed by the forms of worldly beings. Dorje Shugden appears as a fully-ordained monk to show that the practice of pure moral discipline is essential for those who wish to attain enlightenment. In his left hand he holds a heart, which symbolizes great compassion and spontaneous great bliss, the essence of all the stages of the vast path of Sutra and Tantra. His round yellow hat represents the view of Nagarjuna and the wisdom sword in his right hand teaches us to sever ignorance, the root of samsara, with the sharp blade of Nagarjuna’s view. This is the essence of all the stages of the profound path of Sutra and Tantra.
Dorje Shugden rides a snow lion, the symbol of the four fearlessnesses of a Buddha, and has a jewel-spitting mongoose perched on his left arm, symbolizing his power to bestow wealth on those who put their trust in him. The single eye in the centre of his forehead symbolizes his omniscient wisdom which perceives directly and simultaneously all past, present, and future phenomena. His wrathful expression indicates that he destroys ignorance, the real enemy of all living beings, by blessing them with great wisdom; and also that he destroys the obstacles of pure Dharma practitioners.
Each of the thirty-two Deities of Dorje Shugden’s mandala has a specific function, which are explained in a prayer written by Sachen Kunlo, one of the great Sakya Lamas. In this prayer he explains that the function of Duldzin Dorje Shugden, the principal Deity of the mandala, is to lead faithful followers to correct spiritual paths by bestowing great wisdom; the function of Vairochana Shugden is to help us to pacify our negative karma and obstacles; the function of Ratna Shugden is to help us to increase our good fortune, lifespan, and virtuous realizations; the function of Päma Shugden is to help us to control our own mind so that we can help others achieve controlled, calm, and peaceful states of mind; and the function of Karma Shugden is to overcome the four maras and evil spirits who try to harm faithful disciples.
The nine Great Mothers help faithful followers of Dorje Shugden in their Tantric practices, the eight Fully-ordained Monks help them in their practices of Sutra, and the ten Wrathful Deities aid them in their various daily activities. In these spiritually degenerate times Dharma practitioners experience many obstacles, but if we rely upon Dorje Shugden with unwavering faith he will care for us just like a father caring for his children.
In general, all Buddhist practitioners need to develop unwavering faith in Buddha Shakyamuni, for without it their Dharma practice will have little power and bring few results; and in particular all Gelugpa practitioners need to develop firm and lasting faith in Je Tsongkhapa, otherwise they will never experience the unique qualities of his doctrine. Faith is the very root of all Dharma experience. Gelugpa practitioners who have a sincere trust in Dorje Shugden will have no difficulty in generating unshakeable faith in Je Tsongkhapa. Their practice of view, meditation, and action will naturally become pure and they will easily realize the special uncommon qualities of Je Tsongkhapa’s teachings. Thus they will be able to gain experience of the stages of the path of both Sutra and Tantra without any difficulty.
There are many interesting reads, information, pictures, bios and even video on this website dorjeshugden.com and everytime I go there I learn something magnificent and new about Dorje Shugden.
I have been practising Dorje Shugden for more then 3 years now and honestly I don't see any problem and instead it has helped me on my Dharma Path. It has calmed me down alot more then before and gave me new perspective on how to handle the difficulties i faced daily.
One thing for sure is when you do Dorje Shugden practice with the right motivation (which only an "enlightened" being would require such commitment) you will see that your problems get solved a lot faster and you become more stronger in your faith in your Guru and Yidam. It just basically grows stronger. Purification also comes quicker and you bounce back a lot faster whenever you fall esp in your practice.
Of course Dorje Shugden is also infamous to bringing material resources as and when you need it. It's not like he grants your every wish and make you rich instantly. He is a Buddha of Wisdom - Manjushri so if you are sincere, no matter how difficult the state you are in - you will never have to experience being completely "broke" and without help. Somehow or rather something always happens where some help will come. This is through my own personal experience.
Also you are truly protected in dangerous circumstances like accidents! Well lets just say I've had one too many, and i always am too bless i feel to come out scratch free all the time! This cannot be just coincidence.
There are many more incidences but I can go on and on. Perhaps other Dorje Shugden practitioners would like to share their story.
One thing is for sure - Dorje Shugden sure did not ask us to disrespect, hurt and harm anyone, even the Dalai Lama. How does he ask one may wonder? Through an Oracle! I have friends who actually has this privilege to be present when an Oracle is in town. And apparently Dorje Shugden advices the opposite in regards to the Dalai Lama - that is never to disrespect the Dalai Lama dispite what is going on as it has been predicted by Trijang Dorje Change and do not lose faith in both the Dalai Lama and Dorje Shugden
Now if Dorje Shugden was "evil" why would he bother affirming those points esp on the Dalai Lama which is viewed as destroying Dorje Shugden.
His story is humbling and his qualities is something we can all use as an example to emulate, improve our own self. He also tells on how Dorje Shugden is not sectarian and helps even those who are Sakya or Nyingma who used to go to the oracle for advices during His time as the Oracle. There were no sectarianism then but more peace between brothers and sisters. Read it at http://dorjeshugden.com/wp/?p=1127
along with all the other lineage masters - enjoy!
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Dear Dragon Thunder
Great post, thanks! i took your advice and checked out the biographies. I've noticed that there's been a lot of new articles and material on that website recently which is very helpful for learning more about both Dorje Shugden and the issue of the ban. (What I particularly like about that website is that it presents a very balanced view and many, many resources that allow readers to access the situation and come up with a well informed opinion themselves).
I agree with you that the biography section with detailed information about the lineage masters is especially inspiring. To me, these masters show us what it really means to be a Dorje Shugden practitioner - look at how much they benefit others, dedicate their lives for others and accomplish great deeds & attainments for the sake of others. How this could be considered a result of propitiating a "harmful spirit", I will never know.
so far in the world, it has only been Dalai Lama to decree that Dorje Shugden is harmful. Other lamas who are speaking against Dorje Shugden are only doing so after the ban was announced by Dalai Lama. How is it that one Lama's view and decision overrides all these other THOUSANDS of high lamas' and monks who have been doing Dorje Shugden's practice for the last 350 years?
I personally can't understand what Dalai Lama's intention or motivation is for announcing this ban but I also don't want to go down the route of criticising and bashing him. I think that on a more positive note, what we can focus on is to establish a little balance - which is to move away from just bashing the Dalai Lama and criticising what he is doing wrong, and focus instead on all the positive contribution, blessings, compassion and wisdom of these many, many DS lineage masters. Much more inspiring, helpful and beneficial for our individual practices and understanding of this great protector, don't you think?
I've been thinking about this sectarian thing and I came across a good source that mentioned this: The classical Gelugpa would learn the dharma from any other sources. Indeed, they follow Je Rinpoche’s attitude, who studied not just from one lineage but many of the major lineages of his time. So how can they be sectarian?
“ All six siddhas received instructions on the oral tradition of Chod, and, because they were Mahamudra siddhas, they of course received full instructions in Naropa’s Six Yogas. Thus, like the great Tsongkhapa, these are examples of the unbiased and true nonsectarian character and spirit with which the lamas of old approached the Buddha’s teachings.” However, despite this being the case (of studying other tradition’s teachings), due to the first mark as mentioned above, they do not run away from the path. Hence this is the third mark of a Gelugpa.
From: Willis, Janice Dean. Enlightened Beings-Life Stories from the Ganden Oral Tradition. Boston. Wisdom Publications. 1995.
The funny things is that the guy that started the thread was probably a Shugden practitioner that went silent and somehow I, who don't even believe in such things, ended up taking his side. That is weird. I guess I will stop now :^P
You may find it profitable to meditate on why and how this "funny" and "weird" thing happened to you. How did your mind get so carried away like that, arguing so passionately for something you don't even believe in?
At least you finally woke up though, and had the good sense to stop the insanity, which is a promising sign.
This whole thread is rampant with the spirit of dualistic thinking and confusion, with little wisdom that I can see.
I've been thinking about this sectarian thing and I came across a good source that mentioned this: The classical Gelugpa would learn the dharma from any other sources. Indeed, they follow Je Rinpoche’s attitude, who studied not just from one lineage but many of the major lineages of his time. So how can they be sectarian?
“ All six siddhas received instructions on the oral tradition of Chod, and, because they were Mahamudra siddhas, they of course received full instructions in Naropa’s Six Yogas. Thus, like the great Tsongkhapa, these are examples of the unbiased and true nonsectarian character and spirit with which the lamas of old approached the Buddha’s teachings.” However, despite this being the case (of studying other tradition’s teachings), due to the first mark as mentioned above, they do not run away from the path. Hence this is the third mark of a Gelugpa.
From: Willis, Janice Dean. Enlightened Beings-Life Stories from the Ganden Oral Tradition. Boston. Wisdom Publications. 1995.
Hey, that's very interesting. Thanks for sharing. I think it's always rather ironic that people accuse Gelugpas of being ironic when the very basis of their teachings - as composed and compiled by Je Tsongkhapa himself - draws from the essence of teachings across all existing tibetan Buddhist lineages, and from the Indian masters themselves. No way! Je Tsongkhapa embraced all the lineages and extracted teachings to be combined into the gelugpa tradition - the Gelugpa teachings would not be there if not for the teachings from the other schools.
In any case - you need only visit the gelugpa monasteries, such as Gaden, Sera or Drepung - and have audience with Gelugpa practitioners, monks, high lamas to see that they only ever promote the very essence of Dharma which is Guru Devotion, kindness and practising with a good motivation. I have never heard any of them say anything against any other tradition. Even if we ask them about other schools, they reply very simply and politely that they do not know about other lineages and have not studied, so they cannot say anything. They are very gentle and harmonious with other lineages.
The fact is Dalai Lama has issued the ban on a practice which is 350 years old without any strong basis. Fire puja has been done to destroy Dorje Shugden yet he is still around. What does that tell you who he is? Dalai Lama is passed the average life expectancy of Tibetans (may DL live long). Where is the proof that Dorje Shugden is shortening DL's life.
What is the basis for the ban and persecution towards practitioners?!
Dude...it is recorded...he saying it...with his own very lips. :-[ He even says that just asking them to stop is not enough IN ENGLISH, so one can't even say it was mistranslated.
If you can't accept proof from the lips of the Dalai Lama himself then I don't know what else to say.
I am not going into a history speech, at least for the moment, but the Dalai Lama institution was founded by a Mongolian prince (Dalai is not even a Tibetan word) because there were a bunch of those princes fighting for power and he needed something extra to legitimize himself.
The reason the princes were fighting is because the only criteria to see who would be the successor of the Empire was being related to Genghis Kahn. The 'Dalai Lama' told the people, who by the way worshiped the spirits of their ancestors and specially Genghis Kahn, that this prince was the reincarnation of Kublai Kahn (sorry I don't know if the names are spelled correctly), who was the grandson of GK and not some distant relative. In return this price recognized him (or the Dalai Lama recognized himself) as the reincarnation of Kublai Kahn's spiritual adviser. After that, people from Mongolia were happy to serve the so called adviser for their dead king concentrate power in Tibet.
After that he was STILL not the big shot of Tibet. A major fight broke out between political factions that culminated in the Unification of Tibet, and Gushi Khan, who won the dispute, legitimized himself the same way the former mongolian prince did: by giving power to the Dalai Lama as the highest political authority of Tibet.
After that ANOTHER Mongolian dude tried to appoint another Dalai Lama as a means to establish his power.
Later on Tibet apparently got a brief period of independence from other empires, and the Monasteries appointed the Dalai Lamas. But then again it was the dominating aristocracy enthroning one of their own.
After he dies China will probably appoint one with the same intention, that is why he said he wouldn't be born inside Tibet if it was ruled by the Chinese.
Thank you namlessriver for your very interesting post and wriiting that gives the gist of the history on how someone like the Dalai lama even cam to power.
What I do not understand is "If" Dorje Shugden is such a bad evil spirit, then why is it that 9 monasteries ordered by HHDL to do a fire puja to basically kill/destroy Dorje Shugden was unsuccesful? This is like saying Dharma Protectors cannot defeat a spirit? Then why do we even rely on them? Or is it a clear indication that Dorje Shugden is really not a "spirit" but an enlightened being (Manjushri) hence indistructable because he has no karma to be destroyed?!
There is heaps of facinating reads, debates and non bias views on www.dorjeshugden.com, you something new everyday on this site. I like it because it presents information with logic and is very objective towards this issue. Plus it's mission statement is clear on it's motivation is not to defame of slam any Lama down but to encourage exchange to help people through this confusing controversy.
Another ironic thing is how can Dorje Shugden an evil spirit help HHDL escape to India?
Now why would Dorje Shugden help HHDL if he was evil and dislike HHDL? He is a spirit of great power surely he would know of what HHDL would do to him in the near future. It all does not match up.
I agree that most of pathseeker's posts are irrelevant to anything that I need to concern myself about. On the other hand, threatening people with violence, destroying their houses and possessions, denying them the right to buy goods and services that they need to survive, and driving them out of the community are all human rights violations. The issue is not Dorje Shugden, or local folk rituals. The issue is how certain people are being treated by people who exercise power in their community. The documentaries that have been posted contain evidence of human rights violations. If that is true, it can't be dismissed by calling it a cultural matter.
Sangha in the monasteries split. ie., gaden shartse and shar gaden due to the ban imposed by DL. Is schism being committed?
Dude, the Dalai Lama is not the head of the Gelug school, or any other school...The leader of the Gelug is a senior monk that is appointed to do so. He is not chosen based on reincarnation.
The Dalai Lama was a DS practitioner, and so was his master. And so were previous Dalai Lamas.
The Gelug head 101st Gaden Tripa waited till his term ended to defect to Shar Gaden! His designation is now called the 101th Gaden Trisur. Read about it at http://dorjeshugden.com/wp/?p=1010
I tell you the only schism that was created is created ever since this whole Ban shabang came into the picture!
Not only is it creating schism amongst the sangha community, it is causing sectarianism and disharmony within the Tibetan community as well as outside. None of this would have happened if there was no Ban. People who are pro -Dalai Lama seem to be take HHDL words literally, some even go as far as using it to cause harm to other people's lives, livelihood and future. Now like you said Steve, HH Gaden Trisur himself has made a very clear statement with his defect to Shar Gaden together with his whole Ladrang (household). Now what does that tell everyone? Like it or not HH Gaden Trisur is not bowing down to the BAN and is staying firm with his practice and keeping his Guru samaya clean! Period.
I tell you the only schism that was created is created ever since this whole Ban shabang came into the picture!
Not only is it creating schism amongst the sangha community, it is causing sectarianism and disharmony within the Tibetan community as well as outside. None of this would have happened if there was no Ban. People who are pro -Dalai Lama seem to be take HHDL words literally, some even go as far as using it to cause harm to other people's lives, livelihood and future. Now like you said Steve, HH Gaden Trisur himself has made a very clear statement with his defect to Shar Gaden together with his whole Ladrang (household). Now what does that tell everyone? Like it or not HH Gaden Trisur is not bowing down to the BAN and is staying firm with his practice and keeping his Guru samaya clean! Period.
Here is another interesting article you take a read
HH Penor Rinpoche Sympathetic to Dorje Shugden Monks
In fact this article brought much inspiration and got me feeling happy again that thankfully real Dharma still does exist. The article written by a very active forum addict TK who is a great informer on all the latest news on this issue.
In this article you can read and see very nice picture of HH Penor Rinpoche monastery.
When Penor Rinpoche heard re the ban and the difficulties/inconveniences for many monks to purchase items, PENOR RINPOCHE OPENED UP HIS NAMDROLING NYINGMA MONASTERY (fhttp://www.namdroling.org/) for the Dorje Shugden monks to get supplies. Shocked the local community in both good and bad ways! Shocked the Tibetan Govt. Shocked the others shops!... read more at http://dorjeshugden.com/wp/?p=2874
This shows true compassion, bodhichitta, kindness is way beyond the Tibetan POLITICS!!!
It is interesting isn't it that there have been so many rituals supposedly done to "destroy" and exorcise Dorje Shugden. If he was really destroyed, then why is everyone still so scared of this non-existent being? Why are so many highly attained lamas and masters so "scared" of this spirit and unable to do anything to bind / control him? If he was really destroyed, then why does he still appear through trances through oracles? Why is it that they need to keep "destroying" and "burning" him?
Just recently in 1996, monks from Sera were ordered to do a Hayagriva tamding - a ritual to destroy Dorje Shugden. The very next day, DS took trance in the oracle and spoke. Why is it that so many high Lamas have not been able to control or bind this supposed spirit?
It leads me to believe that it is because he ISN'T a spirit but a fully enlightened being - after all, it is only Buddhas which cannot be destroyed.
what does superstition and political intrigue have to do with the four noble truths?
Exactly so why is there persecution on these practitioners that does the Dorje Shugden practice? What is the big fuss as it has nothing really to do with Dharma?
It is a huge debate topic now simply because many monks and Lamas are suffering due to this ban not only that they are literally being "witch hunt" simply because they choose to follow a different path and their Guru's advice and teachings which has been passed on from generations to generation.
If you go to http://dorjeshugden.com/wp/?page_id=32, check out the section on Dorje Shugden lineage, you will discover the previous incarnation of DOrje Shugden is a highly attained master, yogi, meditator, scholar and has in fact written many Dharma texts that is still used up till today in the monastery.
He reinvigorated and renewed the tradition of debate, the powerful tool to develop piercing clarity of mind. Some of his prayers are still being recited daily by thousands of monks, like this one:
So that the tradition of Je Tsongkhapa
the king of the Dharma, may flourish
may all obstacles be pacified
and may all favourable conditions abound
With deep faith I prostrate to you, Vajradhara Dorje Shugden.
Although you have already attained the Buddha-ground
and engage in the twenty-seven deeds of a Buddha,
you appear in various forms to help the Buddhadharma and sentient beings.
You have manifested in different aspects as Indian and Tibetan Masters,
such as Manjushri, Mahasiddha Biwawa, Sakya Pandita, Butön Rinchen Drub, Duldzin Dragpa Gyaltsän, Panchen Sönam Dragpa, and many others. (Tagpo Rinpoche)
Dorje Shugden practice has a long history, but since Tagpo Rinpoche, Kyabje Pabongkha Dorje Chang’s Guru, has planted it firmly into Tibet’s spiritual soil, this enlightened Protector’s inner and outer guidance has become very precious to an estimated four million people in Tibet, Mongolia, Siberia, China, India, Bhutan, Taiwan and increasingly in the west. Mahasiddha Biwawa studied at Nalanda, the great Buddhist university near Bodhgaya . At night he practiced Heruka’s Tantra and Vajrayogini herself would come to partake of his tsog offerings, surrounded by dakinis. Which led his fellow monks to believe that he was having wild parties in his room. They called him Biwawa, bad man, and expelled him. As a traveling Yogi he showed his powers at various occasions in order to bring people to religion. He could stop the Ganges river, he could stop the sun in the sky. A king who hated Buddhists tried to have him drowned, buried alive and finally burned – to no avail (interesting how history has a tendency to repeat itself…this has recently been ritually done to Dorje Shugden, with the same result…). That king was so amazed that he and all his people became Mahasiddha Biwawa’s disciples. Sakya Pandita was the next form assumed in this lineage. He still showed miracle powers if needed and useful, for example to turn the emperor of China ’s mind to Dharma. But he would become renowned just as much for his mastery of both Sutra and Tantra, study and meditation. Buton Rinchen Drub was very compassionate even as a small child and could speak to Manjushri as if to another person. Yet he would emphasize even more than his predecessor the importance of the purity of one’s practice, relying on virtue and clarity, not miracles, because people tended to become less innocent and more self-centered. Buton Rinchen Drub was a great master of the Kalacakra Tantra. The sadhana composed by him is still in use today and recommended by His Holiness. He teachings were an important influence on Je Tsongkhapa.
The trend of emphasizing humility and keeping one’s samaya commitments pure continued with Duldzin Drakpa Gyaltsen (Duldzin literally means ‘holder of vows’). He was very close to Je Tsongkhapa and his first Gelugpa disciple, with Khedrupje and Gyaltsapje coming from the Sakya tradition. Although both master and student were Manjushri-emanations, they worked in their relative aspects to show an example of humble practice. In this way they helped Lord Manjushri’s instructions, which Tsongkhapa received through direct communion, to reach many people. Duldzin Drakpa did everything to help in creating good conditions for these teachings to spread. It was him who undertook the building of Gaden Monastery. He also built his own temple for Kunrik practice near Gaden and took care of the Monastery when Lama Tsongkhapa was away. After Je Lama’s passing he was offered the Gaden throne but preferred to remain in the background to clear obstacles and prepare the way for the flow of Dharma.
His main practices were Guhyasamaja, Kunrik and Yamantaka; his main Protector was Kalarupa. Panchen Sonam Drakpa was the only Lama ever to be abbot of all three great Gelug Monasteries in one life. In addition he held the position of the fifteenth Gaden Tripa. His written works are greatly important teaching material to this day. A book with a collection of his works has just been published in English. He reinvigorated and renewed the tradition of debate, the powerful tool to develop piercing clarity of mind. Some of his prayers are still being recited daily by thousands of monks, like this one:
So that the tradition of Je Tsongkhapa
the king of the Dharma, may flourish
may all obstacles be pacified
and may all favourable conditions abound
These four lines are a wonderfully concise description of the blessed works of a Dharma Protector, and whether we know it or not, it is extremely unlikely for most of us to meet, much less practice Dharma if not for these Protectors’ unconditional compassion and miraculous help, because the degree of our self-obsession and materialism is overpowering our perception to the extent of total spiritual blindness.
Panchen Sonam Drakpa’s main practices were Chakrasamvara/Vajrayogini and Yamantaka. His main Protector was the 4-armed Mahakala.
He took rebirth as Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen who lived at the same time as the fifth Dalai Lama. They both were students of Lobsang Chokyi Gyaltsen, the first Panchen Lama. He went for many meditation retreats in caves where in one of his holy visions he was shown that he would later manifest as Dorje Shugden.
He was a famous teacher with many followers from Tibet and outer Mongolia, and abbot of Drepung Osel Ling and Ngakpa Trasang, the tantric school of Drepung . His Yidams and Protector were Chakrasamvara/Vajrayogini and Yamantaka and the 4-armed Mahakala and Setrap Chen. He and the Great Fifth were considered equally eminent Lamas. It is said that one day Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen defeated the Dalai Lama in debate and the latter’s attendants grew so jealous that they later arranged for Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen to be strangled with a Khata. However, this is just the outer appearance. THE EMERGENCE OF DHARMAPALA DORJE SHUGDEN
While Je Tsongkhapa was giving a Dharma discourse, Nechung appeared to Duldzin Drakpa Gyaltsen in the form of a white dove, urging him to manifest as a protector of Je Tsongkhapa’s teachings who are so sublime and precious that a special protector is needed to guard and further them in this world. Nechung repeated his request to Duldzin Drakpa Gyaltsen’s subsequent incarnations and during the time of Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen approached again, asking him if he remembered his promise. Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen replied that since there was no anger in his mindstream, how could he manifest the wrathful energy of a Dharma protector? Thus the event of strangulation was displayed with bodhicitta motivation, enabling the enlightened being Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen to manifest wrath at the moment of death and to emerge in this way as the transcendent supramundane Dharmapala Gyalchen Dorje Shugden. Since killing a bodhisattva is nonetheless a very grave event, the elements reacted violently, and various strange occurrences took place for some time.
Dorje Shugden has played a major role in bringing the Buddhadharma from Tibet into the world, as we will see, and will continue so on a global scale.
So following cause and effect how can someone with a line of pure incarnations as an attained being become an evil spirit is just totally ridiculous. The funny thing is HH the Dalai Lama himself wrote a prayer praising Dorje Shugden, and even built the 1st Dorje Shugden statue with his own bare hands which exists till today in Phelgyeling Monastery in Kathmandu.
The question is not who is right who is wrong and which side should we take. The question is not about Dalai Lama vs Dorje Shugden but more Dalai Lama and Dorje Shugden. And could there be a a bigger picture beyond our capability to understand now that benefits so many in the near future.
Dorje Shugden is not sectarian and does not harm anyone just cause they practice a different school of thought. He is a Dharma protector and does literally precisely that. And so it is our responsibility to share Dharma knowledge or info to clear away any misconception and doubt if any in people's mind so that things are clearer for them to make their choices based on understanding and truth, not for political reasons. That is the main objective of even discussing this topic.
Hope it helps. And thanks for allowing our voice to be heard
Nothing like that at all, Torin. The Dalai Lama is not the Buddhist pope. He is, however, the head of the Gelugpa school, and as such he has the right to tell his students what practices are OK to do and which aren't. The reason he banned the Dorje Shugden practice is because it is intended to suppress other schools of Buddhism, which is not beneficial to anyone. It's really not very complex, despite the smokescreens put up by the Dorje Shugden people.
Palzang
There are many substantial facts pointing to Dorje SHugden's qualities which is highly beneficial. It'll be fairly long to post in here for those who may be interested. So I'll just include one of the points below:
Dorje Shugden’s form teaches the paths of Sutra and Tantra
Dorje Shugden's form teaches the complete stages of the path of Sutra and Tantra, and such qualities are not possessed by the forms of worldly beings.
He appears as a fully ordained monk to show that the practice of pure moral discipline is essential for those who wish to attain enlightenment. In his left hand he holds a heart, which symbolize great compassion and spontaneous great bliss – the essence of all the stages of the vast path of Sutra and Tantra. His round yellow hat represents the view of Nagarjuna, and the wisdom sword in his right hand (like the one held by Manjushri and Je Tsongkhapa) teaches us to sever ignorance, the root of samsara, with the sharp blade of Nagarjuna’s view. This is the essence of all the stages of the profound path of Sutra and Tantra. He rides a snow lion, symbolizing the four fearlessnesses of a Buddha.
Explanation of his remaining features can be found in Heart Jewel, as can the specific enlightened function of each of the thirty-two Deities of his mandala, which are explained in a prayer written by Sachen Kunlo, one of the great Sakya Lamas.
Only enlightened beings display a meaningful aspect that teaches the entire path to enlightenment. Therefore, Dorje Shugden is a Buddha.
Comments
http://www.cesnur.org/press/Newsweek.htm
I don't know but from what I've read, the DS practitioners do seem the likeliest suspects for these murders and their history prior to that is one of sectarianism and aggressiveness. They were arguably causing schism in the Sangha (which is a very grave offense in Buddhism) and blatantly disregarding the head of Gelugpa's instructions.
Now, I'm not well-versed in the actual doctrinal arguments but let's not sit around being offended by HHDL's stance on the issue, when DS practitioners have behaved quite ruthlessly and immorally themselves.
I'm not a fan of the tulku system either and I agree with you there but your five minute research into the history leaves some serious gaps.
Like I said, believe whatever you want but you should be aware that this practice has always targeted other Buddhists for hostility, primarily Nyingmapa's. Many people I know, both teachers and prominent practitioners are currently "targeted" as enemies by those who promote this practice.
Dude, the Dalai Lama is not the head of the Gelug school, or any other school...The leader of the Gelug is a senior monk that is appointed to do so. He is not chosen based on reincarnation.
The Dalai Lama was a DS practitioner, and so was his master. And so were previous Dalai Lamas.
The Dalai Lama holds and transmits ALL lineages of Tibetan Buddhism. The Ganden Tripa is the official head of the Gelug lineage.
This is one of the primary reasons why the DS people oppose him so strongly.
They believe that the an authentic Dalai Lama is "pure" Gelugpa.
Its a complicated and kind of fascinating issue. Its also a very unfortunate one.
While there is the Gelug Tripa, the Dalai Lama is the ranking Tibetan Buddhist in general and considers a high amount of sway in the Gelug tradition, to the point where he is something of a leader. So, unless you can show evidence of the Gelug Tripa contradicting HHDL on this, your point is irrelevant.
Honestly, you're just being a contrarian now. You know what I mean. I would normally explain further, but I'm not going to waste my time with something so obvious.
The Dalai Lama is the ranking lineage holder and is arguably holds the most sway over the Gelug lineage despite the fact that the Ganden Tripa is the official head of the lineage. I guess that's partly what you're taking issue with, and I guess I misspoke. But in a lineage-based tradition, being the ranking lineage holder is no small matter.
Why was the Gelugpa tradition at that moment perceived by some Tibetans to be in danger as to require another guardian exclusive to its tradition?
Why did the historical circumstances come together for this to occur when the Gelugpas supposedly celebrated their greatest victory?
What was the tension between the Fifth Dalai Lama and the Gelugpa tradition that he felt such animosity towards its monks of whom he was one?
One possible interpretation is that the Fifth Dalai Lama represented less the purely religious Gelugpas, since he seems to have largely preferred to practice according to his own visions based on a Nyingma version of Tibetan Buddhism, and represented more the Gelug tradition as a political-administrative power base.
This is not the example Je Tsong Khapa had shown his followers. He had resisted political involvement and rejected direct association with the Chinese emperor.
See, for example, Tibetan Nation, p. 103. But a fair ruler of a country has to represent all religious traditions which reduced the Gelugpas to the role a majority political party plays in support of its leader. Dorje Shugden does not need to be looked at as a political rival to the institution of Dalai Lama, as he oddly was again recently, but simply as a guardian of one particular religious tradition whose concern is purely religious in the sense of protecting the Dharma from declining into mere political or worldly involvement.
According to this interpretation, Dorje Shugden had to arise at the time when the Ganden Phodrang government was established since with it arose the greatest danger for Gelugpas: to lose their religious tradition to mere political and social involvement.
Today that danger is even greater because since the advent of modernity religion is defined almost exclusively in sociological terms and whatever religious knowledge does not fit the social parameters of the moment becomes eclipsed. The loss of the inner core of meaning is what a Buddhist protector is believed to guard against since he or she is entrusted with the continuity of a wisdom tradition.
And Dorje Shugden being a protector entrusted to certain teachings doesn't mean he's sectarian. It's just his "specialisation". There are Shakya practitioners of Dorje Shugden, so he's not a sectarian protector. He's a Dharma Protector.
Read this on the front page of dorjeshugden.com:
H.H. Gaden Trisur Rinpoche defects to the Dorje Shugden camp
http://dorjeshugden.com/wp/?p=1010
The Dorje Shugden – Dalai Lama Conflict (PART 2: Original of Dorje Shugden: arisal as a protector during the time of the 5th Dalai Lama)
(extracted from research of Ursula Bernis)
http://www.shugdensociety.info/Bernis2EN.html
And thank you Nameless River who ended up taking my side. But really, I personally support His HOliness and support Dorje Shugden practitioners. I just wish to understand more and believe that Dorje Shugden practitioners should not be treated like outcasts.
It is very difficult if you have received the commitment and practice from your Guru, and then the spiritual head "bans" it. Many monks have suffered and I knew that they are for real because I have friends visiting Gaden and Drepung in Mundgod, India who told me what happened to the monks there. It is real and it's not just media propaganda.
I'm sorry but the society is not a valid source of info on this issue, or any issue for that matter. I have read some of their brochures and they are outrageous.
I am new here at the newbuddhist forum so I hope to learn more and perhaps seniors like you who are "old friend on the site" can help to share more resources on where I can find more info about the current situation that are "better sources".
But then again, like what Nameless River said, academics or authority in Tibetan History could also have agenda.
I do not agree with the Western Shugden Society and what they say (I find that some of the accusation in The Great Deception is attacking His Holiness), but I do think what I quoted was quite a good point - to think about the questions that were posed.
The questions etc are fine to ask but the DSS is just plain weird.
For better info you will have to talk to people who can read Tibetan and have access to historical documents that give a clear and accurate picture of the history of the situation.
The unfortunate thing is that these documents arent available in english and the NKT and DSS are capitalizing on this via the internet.
Its unfortunate.
Dear Palzang
Btw, The Dalai Lama is NOT the head of the Gelugpa school. The head of the Gelugpa school is the Gaden Throneholder also known as HH The Gaden Tripa.
The Dalai Lama claims that Shugden practice is sectarian but there is no proof of it. And talking about Gaden Tripas. The 101st Gaden Tripa, at the end of his term, has recently LEFT Gaden Monastery because he would like to practice Dorje Shugden. He joins the ranks of HH Trijang Rinpoche (whose previous incarnation was the junior tutor to the Dalai Lama).
Ignorant twits like me may not know much but when highly attained beings such as Gaden Trisur and Trijang Rinpoche practice, i think there must be some good behind it.
Also, what's very weird is that the Dalai Lama has given permission for Trijang Rinpoche to practice Dorje Shugden. If it's a practice which harms Tibet, why would the Dalai Lama give him permission? By the way, there's a video of the Dalai Lama actually saying this so no misquotes possible.
It's a fascinating topic. There are more smokescreens than you think.
Nameless - you're absolutely right! thank you for being open - in the Buddhist sense of the word, which is not rejecting.
Please continue
Music Delighting the Ocean of Protector - An Account expressing the realizations of the wonderful three secrets of the emanted great Dharma King, Mighty Dorje Shugden, supreme protector of conquere Manjusri Tsongkhapa's Teachings
by Kyabje Trijang Dorje Chang
at http://dorjeshugden.com/articles/musicdelighting.pdf
There is also the original scanned Tibetan texts available.
So the question is, how do you ascertain whose/which view should we agree with.
First of all, Trijang Rinpoche, Dalai Lama's tutor is an authoritative figure in Tibetan Buddhism and wrote this text. Yet, Dalai Lama said that his Guru and those who practised Dorje Shugden are wrong check out this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5HMCA-8pec
And, Dalai Lama himself was a Shugden practitioner and even wrote a prayer called MELODY OF THE UNCEASING VAJRA.
Yes, I do agree with you, and I do have friends who knew monks in Gaden & Drepung in India, and they have mentioned that this text is true and has been used for Dorje Shugden practitioners.
What I am interested in is Dorje Shugden and not NKT nor WSS :cool:
I think this whole discussion is going on a big detour. I'd like to bring it back to the original point made by pathseeker - a call to be even kinder to people who we may not agree with etc. Yes, that is the buddhist way - in our meditations, we are taught to visualise sending metta and compassion even to our enemies and spirits, but now people practising a different deity are being persecuted, attacked, have their houses burned, denied education and welfare aid from the government, ostracised etc...
This is being done supposedly in the name of the dalai lama - it is so primitive, like the same justifications that were given during the Christian Crusades or even by Muslim terrorists. These supporters of the dalai lama don't realise that by being so aggressive and militant in their supposed "upholding" of the ban, they are shooting themselves in the foot - they make the dalai lama look bad, and as the dalai lama is the spiritual leader of all tibetan buddhists, they also give a bad name to all of tibetan buddhism.
People will look upon tibetan buddhists and think, "wow this is what their religion is about? They defend their spiritual leader by attacking others?" and I wouldn't be surprised if that turned them off buddhism completely. After all, all we hear about in the news/media now is about this controversy - the politics surrounding all of Tibetan buddhism. Either it's about the free tibet cause or it's about the Dorje Shugden issue. So where is the real practice? You never hear about that because the people who are really practising sincerely are doing just that.... quietly doing their practice in the quiet peaceful, non-political spaces of their own monasteries. Unfortunately, the world doesn't get to see these beautiful and amazing Dharma practitioners. They see only the politics and that is the face they will see of Buddhism.
So yes, this is a plea and a call to all Buddhists that if you really want to reflect your gurus and your practices well, you should be even kinder, practice even harder, be even more patient and more tolerant - even to those you don't agree with. That way, you really show the world what practice is about. Two results can arise:
1) If you support the Dalai lama, then you will show a good reflection of the dalai lama and win people over to wanting to follow the dalai lama also;
2) if you are a Dorje Shugden practitioner, then you will show a good reflection of this protector and win people over to wanting to also do the practice.
Either way, kindness and sincerity wins the day, wherever you are or whatever you are doing/supporting. Goodness always prevails over evil, after all!!!
We can never go wrong by doing the right thing, applying the 6 paramitas. Please don't get me wrong that I am hung up on what's right and what's wrong. I'm not a judge in conducts as I am just one striving to apply the buddhist teachings for happiness of oneself and others.
Peace
Thank you the Red Niece. I totally agree with you. It's not about Shuden practitioners. As Buddhists, we even have to be kind towards spirits and offer them food during tsog, so needless to say, our Dharma brothers and sisters. Remember, these Shugden practitioners are BUDDHISTS and believe in the Buddha!
It was a little happy moment to discover on the dorjeshugden.com website earlier today that there are some very lovely articles which have just been posted up about great masters who were/are renowned DS practitioners. Great! Fits in quite well with what I have been thinking recently about how we need to stop just focusing on what the Dalai Lama is doing "badly" or "wrongly" all the time, and look at what other incredible Lamas all around the world are doing for the spread of Dharma everywhere.
The stories are very beautiful and there are great photos as well - how can these lamas be in any way "evil" or "bad" by their practice of Dorje Shugden? It doesn't make any sense! If you look at all the incredible teachings they have received and are giving to many more people around the world (to both Tibetans and non-Tibetans), you realise that Dharma is not about fighting over the "validity" of one practice, whether what that lama said was correct or what this lama said was incorrect - it is about, at the end of the day, the lamrim, how they have held their vows their whole lives and their incredible courage to continue teaching in the face of all the adversity (first, losing their country and having to reestablish in a totally foreign land, and then secondly, almost having their practices taken away from them).
i do recommend having a read of those articles on the website - it's on dorjeshugden.com. There's a bunch of good stuff on the right hand column when you first log in, titled "very interesting reads" or you could click on the "great masters" tab. Then come back here and share what lifted your heart the most today!
Thank you not1not2 for your note. It is not that we need an apology, but I think what DS practitioners would like now in the world is some understanding and open dialogue - a space where we can try to understand this situation better and gain some support for our practice, especially within a religious scene where this practice is so strongly suppressed and where practitioners are shunned or mistreated.
Many DS practitioners do not wish to get political. They respect the Dalai Lama very much and they also respect their own teachers, lineages and practices very much. They just want to have the freedom to practice without having to suffer ostracisation or, in some extreme cases, even physical attacks. There are protests and people are very verbal about it... I don't know if I really support having all these protests as that can tend to become political, but I understand why they do it - it is out of a deep wish to protect their lineage and practice and speak for those who are being overtly persecuted.
I myself believe in mutual respect. Whether we choose to practice something or not, or follow the advice of a teacher or not is really an individual choice (we all have our own karma to face at the end of the day, after all). But we can still have respect for each other and not go all the way out to bash the other fellow up! We even have respect for other religions that we don't agree with, so why would we suppress people within our own religion?
Everyone's post is interesting as we are able to share different views and thoughts and learn from each other through healthy debate. Here are some information that I would like to share in light on WHO is this Dorje Shugden for the benefit of those who may not really know or who are new. From here you can see Dorje Shugden's nature is to help all beings, it really does not matter which sect/school/monastery/tibetan or not you are from. All is required is your sincerity in practicing the Dharma.
Nature and Function
Dorje Shugden and the Deities of his mandala are the same nature as the Deities of the body mandala of Lama Losang Tubwang Dorjechang, who is in essence Je Tsongkhapa. After Je Tsongkhapa passed away, Khädrubje received five visions of him, each time appearing in a different aspect. Later, the great Yogi Dharmavajra saw Je Tsongkhapa in the aspect of Lama Losang Tubwang Dorjechang. This name was given to Je Tsongkhapa by Manjushri. It indicates that Je Tsongkhapa is the embodiment of both Conqueror Vajradhara and Buddha Shakyamuni. ‘Losang Dragpa’ is Je Tsongkhapa’s ordained name, ‘Tubwang’ or ‘Powerful Able One’ is an epithet of Buddha Shakyamuni, and ‘Dorjechang’ is Tibetan for Vajradhara. Lama Losang Tubwang Dorjechang is an enlightened being and the principal Field for Accumulating Merit in the Guru yoga of Offering to the Spiritual Guide, or Lama Chöpa.
There are thirty-two Deities within the body mandala of Lama Losang Tubwang Dorjechang, and it is these Deities who manifest as the thirty-two Deities of Dorje Shugden’s mandala. This was explained by Je Phabongkhapa, an emanation of Heruka, in his prayer to Dorje Shugden:
The aggregates, elements, sources, and limbs of Lama Losang Tubwang Dorjechang appear in the aspect of the five Lineages of Dorje Shugden and their retinues. Realizing that in reality I am practising the yoga of the thirty-two Deities of the body mandala, I offer this practice to you, O five lineages of Dorje Shugden; please accept it with delight.
Of the Deities of the five lineages of Dorje Shugden, the principal Deity is Duldzin Dorje Shugden. He is a manifestation of the aggregate of consciousness of Lama Losang Tubwang Dorjechang. Vairochana Shugden is a manifestation of the form aggregate of Lama Losang Tubwang Dorjechang, Ratna Shugden is a manifestation of his aggregate of feeling, Päma Shugden is a manifestation of his aggregate of discrimination, and Karma Shugden is a manifestation of his aggregate of compositional factors. Many sadhanas of Dorje Shugden state that Dorje Shugden is the embodiment of the ‘Guru, Yidam, and Protector’. Here, ‘Guru’ refers specifically to Lama Tsongkhapa. Thus, when we practise the sadhana of Dorje Shugden we are indirectly practising the Guru yoga of Je Tsongkhapa, as well as the practices of Yamantaka and Kalarupa. Atisha said, ‘You Tibetans rely upon hundreds of Deities but do not achieve even one attainment, whereas we Indian Buddhists rely upon only one Deity and achieve the attainments and blessings of hundreds of Deities.’ We should bear Atisha’s comment in mind and realize that it is much more meaningful to practise one Deity sincerely, regarding that Deity as the synthesis of all Deities, than it is to practise many Deities superficially.
Dorje Shugden rides a snow lion, the symbol of the four fearlessnesses of a Buddha, and has a jewel-spitting mongoose perched on his left arm, symbolizing his power to bestow wealth on those who put their trust in him. The single eye in the centre of his forehead symbolizes his omniscient wisdom which perceives directly and simultaneously all past, present, and future phenomena. His wrathful expression indicates that he destroys ignorance, the real enemy of all living beings, by blessing them with great wisdom; and also that he destroys the obstacles of pure Dharma practitioners.
Each of the thirty-two Deities of Dorje Shugden’s mandala has a specific function, which are explained in a prayer written by Sachen Kunlo, one of the great Sakya Lamas. In this prayer he explains that the function of Duldzin Dorje Shugden, the principal Deity of the mandala, is to lead faithful followers to correct spiritual paths by bestowing great wisdom; the function of Vairochana Shugden is to help us to pacify our negative karma and obstacles; the function of Ratna Shugden is to help us to increase our good fortune, lifespan, and virtuous realizations; the function of Päma Shugden is to help us to control our own mind so that we can help others achieve controlled, calm, and peaceful states of mind; and the function of Karma Shugden is to overcome the four maras and evil spirits who try to harm faithful disciples.
The nine Great Mothers help faithful followers of Dorje Shugden in their Tantric practices, the eight Fully-ordained Monks help them in their practices of Sutra, and the ten Wrathful Deities aid them in their various daily activities. In these spiritually degenerate times Dharma practitioners experience many obstacles, but if we rely upon Dorje Shugden with unwavering faith he will care for us just like a father caring for his children.
In general, all Buddhist practitioners need to develop unwavering faith in Buddha Shakyamuni, for without it their Dharma practice will have little power and bring few results; and in particular all Gelugpa practitioners need to develop firm and lasting faith in Je Tsongkhapa, otherwise they will never experience the unique qualities of his doctrine. Faith is the very root of all Dharma experience. Gelugpa practitioners who have a sincere trust in Dorje Shugden will have no difficulty in generating unshakeable faith in Je Tsongkhapa. Their practice of view, meditation, and action will naturally become pure and they will easily realize the special uncommon qualities of Je Tsongkhapa’s teachings. Thus they will be able to gain experience of the stages of the path of both Sutra and Tantra without any difficulty.
Extracted from: http://dorjeshugden.com/wp/?page_id=2175
Source:
Tharpa Publications / Wisdom Buddha Dorje Shugden website, 2008
http://wisdombuddhadorjeshugden.org/dorjeshugden-nature.php
I have been practising Dorje Shugden for more then 3 years now and honestly I don't see any problem and instead it has helped me on my Dharma Path. It has calmed me down alot more then before and gave me new perspective on how to handle the difficulties i faced daily.
One thing for sure is when you do Dorje Shugden practice with the right motivation (which only an "enlightened" being would require such commitment) you will see that your problems get solved a lot faster and you become more stronger in your faith in your Guru and Yidam. It just basically grows stronger. Purification also comes quicker and you bounce back a lot faster whenever you fall esp in your practice.
Of course Dorje Shugden is also infamous to bringing material resources as and when you need it. It's not like he grants your every wish and make you rich instantly. He is a Buddha of Wisdom - Manjushri so if you are sincere, no matter how difficult the state you are in - you will never have to experience being completely "broke" and without help. Somehow or rather something always happens where some help will come. This is through my own personal experience.
Also you are truly protected in dangerous circumstances like accidents! Well lets just say I've had one too many, and i always am too bless i feel to come out scratch free all the time! This cannot be just coincidence.
There are many more incidences but I can go on and on. Perhaps other Dorje Shugden practitioners would like to share their story.
One thing is for sure - Dorje Shugden sure did not ask us to disrespect, hurt and harm anyone, even the Dalai Lama. How does he ask one may wonder? Through an Oracle! I have friends who actually has this privilege to be present when an Oracle is in town. And apparently Dorje Shugden advices the opposite in regards to the Dalai Lama - that is never to disrespect the Dalai Lama dispite what is going on as it has been predicted by Trijang Dorje Change and do not lose faith in both the Dalai Lama and Dorje Shugden
Now if Dorje Shugden was "evil" why would he bother affirming those points esp on the Dalai Lama which is viewed as destroying Dorje Shugden.
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{page:Section1;} --> </style><!--[if gte mso 10]> <style> /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-priority:99; mso-style-qformat:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para-margin-top:0in; mso-para-margin-right:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:10.0pt; mso-para-margin-left:0in; line-height:115%; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri; mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast; mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri; mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-bidi-theme-font:minor-bidi;} </style> <![endif]-->[FONT="]His Eminence Choyang Duldzin Kuten Lama himself (an Pracle Lama which is considered a high status in the Tibetan Buddhism hirarchy)
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His story is humbling and his qualities is something we can all use as an example to emulate, improve our own self. He also tells on how Dorje Shugden is not sectarian and helps even those who are Sakya or Nyingma who used to go to the oracle for advices during His time as the Oracle. There were no sectarianism then but more peace between brothers and sisters. Read it at http://dorjeshugden.com/wp/?p=1127
along with all the other lineage masters - enjoy!
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Great post, thanks! i took your advice and checked out the biographies. I've noticed that there's been a lot of new articles and material on that website recently which is very helpful for learning more about both Dorje Shugden and the issue of the ban. (What I particularly like about that website is that it presents a very balanced view and many, many resources that allow readers to access the situation and come up with a well informed opinion themselves).
I agree with you that the biography section with detailed information about the lineage masters is especially inspiring. To me, these masters show us what it really means to be a Dorje Shugden practitioner - look at how much they benefit others, dedicate their lives for others and accomplish great deeds & attainments for the sake of others. How this could be considered a result of propitiating a "harmful spirit", I will never know.
so far in the world, it has only been Dalai Lama to decree that Dorje Shugden is harmful. Other lamas who are speaking against Dorje Shugden are only doing so after the ban was announced by Dalai Lama. How is it that one Lama's view and decision overrides all these other THOUSANDS of high lamas' and monks who have been doing Dorje Shugden's practice for the last 350 years?
I personally can't understand what Dalai Lama's intention or motivation is for announcing this ban but I also don't want to go down the route of criticising and bashing him. I think that on a more positive note, what we can focus on is to establish a little balance - which is to move away from just bashing the Dalai Lama and criticising what he is doing wrong, and focus instead on all the positive contribution, blessings, compassion and wisdom of these many, many DS lineage masters. Much more inspiring, helpful and beneficial for our individual practices and understanding of this great protector, don't you think?
“ All six siddhas received instructions on the oral tradition of Chod, and, because they were Mahamudra siddhas, they of course received full instructions in Naropa’s Six Yogas. Thus, like the great Tsongkhapa, these are examples of the unbiased and true nonsectarian character and spirit with which the lamas of old approached the Buddha’s teachings.” However, despite this being the case (of studying other tradition’s teachings), due to the first mark as mentioned above, they do not run away from the path. Hence this is the third mark of a Gelugpa.
From: Willis, Janice Dean. Enlightened Beings-Life Stories from the Ganden Oral Tradition. Boston. Wisdom Publications. 1995.
At least you finally woke up though, and had the good sense to stop the insanity, which is a promising sign.
This whole thread is rampant with the spirit of dualistic thinking and confusion, with little wisdom that I can see.
Hey, that's very interesting. Thanks for sharing. I think it's always rather ironic that people accuse Gelugpas of being ironic when the very basis of their teachings - as composed and compiled by Je Tsongkhapa himself - draws from the essence of teachings across all existing tibetan Buddhist lineages, and from the Indian masters themselves. No way! Je Tsongkhapa embraced all the lineages and extracted teachings to be combined into the gelugpa tradition - the Gelugpa teachings would not be there if not for the teachings from the other schools.
In any case - you need only visit the gelugpa monasteries, such as Gaden, Sera or Drepung - and have audience with Gelugpa practitioners, monks, high lamas to see that they only ever promote the very essence of Dharma which is Guru Devotion, kindness and practising with a good motivation. I have never heard any of them say anything against any other tradition. Even if we ask them about other schools, they reply very simply and politely that they do not know about other lineages and have not studied, so they cannot say anything. They are very gentle and harmonious with other lineages.
What is the basis for the ban and persecution towards practitioners?!
Thank you namlessriver for your very interesting post and wriiting that gives the gist of the history on how someone like the Dalai lama even cam to power.
What I do not understand is "If" Dorje Shugden is such a bad evil spirit, then why is it that 9 monasteries ordered by HHDL to do a fire puja to basically kill/destroy Dorje Shugden was unsuccesful? This is like saying Dharma Protectors cannot defeat a spirit? Then why do we even rely on them? Or is it a clear indication that Dorje Shugden is really not a "spirit" but an enlightened being (Manjushri) hence indistructable because he has no karma to be destroyed?!
There is heaps of facinating reads, debates and non bias views on www.dorjeshugden.com, you something new everyday on this site. I like it because it presents information with logic and is very objective towards this issue. Plus it's mission statement is clear on it's motivation is not to defame of slam any Lama down but to encourage exchange to help people through this confusing controversy.
Now why would Dorje Shugden help HHDL if he was evil and dislike HHDL? He is a spirit of great power surely he would know of what HHDL would do to him in the near future. It all does not match up.
You can watch this on
Dorje Shugden saved the Dalai Lama's Life
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mV4VAQgt4Bs
Sangha in the monasteries split. ie., gaden shartse and shar gaden due to the ban imposed by DL. Is schism being committed?
The Gelug head 101st Gaden Tripa waited till his term ended to defect to Shar Gaden! His designation is now called the 101th Gaden Trisur. Read about it at http://dorjeshugden.com/wp/?p=1010
Not only is it creating schism amongst the sangha community, it is causing sectarianism and disharmony within the Tibetan community as well as outside. None of this would have happened if there was no Ban. People who are pro -Dalai Lama seem to be take HHDL words literally, some even go as far as using it to cause harm to other people's lives, livelihood and future. Now like you said Steve, HH Gaden Trisur himself has made a very clear statement with his defect to Shar Gaden together with his whole Ladrang (household). Now what does that tell everyone? Like it or not HH Gaden Trisur is not bowing down to the BAN and is staying firm with his practice and keeping his Guru samaya clean! Period.
Not only is it creating schism amongst the sangha community, it is causing sectarianism and disharmony within the Tibetan community as well as outside. None of this would have happened if there was no Ban. People who are pro -Dalai Lama seem to be take HHDL words literally, some even go as far as using it to cause harm to other people's lives, livelihood and future. Now like you said Steve, HH Gaden Trisur himself has made a very clear statement with his defect to Shar Gaden together with his whole Ladrang (household). Now what does that tell everyone? Like it or not HH Gaden Trisur is not bowing down to the BAN and is staying firm with his practice and keeping his Guru samaya clean! Period.
HH Penor Rinpoche Sympathetic to Dorje Shugden Monks
In fact this article brought much inspiration and got me feeling happy again that thankfully real Dharma still does exist. The article written by a very active forum addict TK who is a great informer on all the latest news on this issue.
In this article you can read and see very nice picture of HH Penor Rinpoche monastery.
When Penor Rinpoche heard re the ban and the difficulties/inconveniences for many monks to purchase items, PENOR RINPOCHE OPENED UP HIS NAMDROLING NYINGMA MONASTERY (fhttp://www.namdroling.org/) for the Dorje Shugden monks to get supplies. Shocked the local community in both good and bad ways! Shocked the Tibetan Govt. Shocked the others shops!... read more at http://dorjeshugden.com/wp/?p=2874
This shows true compassion, bodhichitta, kindness is way beyond the Tibetan POLITICS!!!
Just recently in 1996, monks from Sera were ordered to do a Hayagriva tamding - a ritual to destroy Dorje Shugden. The very next day, DS took trance in the oracle and spoke. Why is it that so many high Lamas have not been able to control or bind this supposed spirit?
It leads me to believe that it is because he ISN'T a spirit but a fully enlightened being - after all, it is only Buddhas which cannot be destroyed.
It is a huge debate topic now simply because many monks and Lamas are suffering due to this ban not only that they are literally being "witch hunt" simply because they choose to follow a different path and their Guru's advice and teachings which has been passed on from generations to generation.
If you go to http://dorjeshugden.com/wp/?page_id=32, check out the section on Dorje Shugden lineage, you will discover the previous incarnation of DOrje Shugden is a highly attained master, yogi, meditator, scholar and has in fact written many Dharma texts that is still used up till today in the monastery.
He reinvigorated and renewed the tradition of debate, the powerful tool to develop piercing clarity of mind. Some of his prayers are still being recited daily by thousands of monks, like this one:
So that the tradition of Je Tsongkhapa
the king of the Dharma, may flourish
may all obstacles be pacified
and may all favourable conditions abound
With deep faith I prostrate to you, Vajradhara Dorje Shugden.
Although you have already attained the Buddha-ground
and engage in the twenty-seven deeds of a Buddha,
you appear in various forms to help the Buddhadharma and sentient beings.
You have manifested in different aspects as Indian and Tibetan Masters,
such as Manjushri, Mahasiddha Biwawa, Sakya Pandita, Butön Rinchen Drub, Duldzin Dragpa Gyaltsän, Panchen Sönam Dragpa, and many others.
(Tagpo Rinpoche)
Dorje Shugden practice has a long history, but since Tagpo Rinpoche, Kyabje Pabongkha Dorje Chang’s Guru, has planted it firmly into Tibet’s spiritual soil, this enlightened Protector’s inner and outer guidance has become very precious to an estimated four million people in Tibet, Mongolia, Siberia, China, India, Bhutan, Taiwan and increasingly in the west.
Mahasiddha Biwawa studied at Nalanda, the great Buddhist university near Bodhgaya . At night he practiced Heruka’s Tantra and Vajrayogini herself would come to partake of his tsog offerings, surrounded by dakinis. Which led his fellow monks to believe that he was having wild parties in his room. They called him Biwawa, bad man, and expelled him. As a traveling Yogi he showed his powers at various occasions in order to bring people to religion. He could stop the Ganges river, he could stop the sun in the sky. A king who hated Buddhists tried to have him drowned, buried alive and finally burned – to no avail (interesting how history has a tendency to repeat itself…this has recently been ritually done to Dorje Shugden, with the same result…). That king was so amazed that he and all his people became Mahasiddha Biwawa’s disciples.
Sakya Pandita was the next form assumed in this lineage. He still showed miracle powers if needed and useful, for example to turn the emperor of China ’s mind to Dharma. But he would become renowned just as much for his mastery of both Sutra and Tantra, study and meditation.
Buton Rinchen Drub was very compassionate even as a small child and could speak to Manjushri as if to another person. Yet he would emphasize even more than his predecessor the importance of the purity of one’s practice, relying on virtue and clarity, not miracles, because people tended to become less innocent and more self-centered. Buton Rinchen Drub was a great master of the Kalacakra Tantra. The sadhana composed by him is still in use today and recommended by His Holiness. He teachings were an important influence on Je Tsongkhapa.
The trend of emphasizing humility and keeping one’s samaya commitments pure continued with Duldzin Drakpa Gyaltsen (Duldzin literally means ‘holder of vows’). He was very close to Je Tsongkhapa and his first Gelugpa disciple, with Khedrupje and Gyaltsapje coming from the Sakya tradition. Although both master and student were Manjushri-emanations, they worked in their relative aspects to show an example of humble practice. In this way they helped Lord Manjushri’s instructions, which Tsongkhapa received through direct communion, to reach many people. Duldzin Drakpa did everything to help in creating good conditions for these teachings to spread. It was him who undertook the building of Gaden Monastery. He also built his own temple for Kunrik practice near Gaden and took care of the Monastery when Lama Tsongkhapa was away. After Je Lama’s passing he was offered the Gaden throne but preferred to remain in the background to clear obstacles and prepare the way for the flow of Dharma.
His main practices were Guhyasamaja, Kunrik and Yamantaka; his main Protector was Kalarupa.
Panchen Sonam Drakpa was the only Lama ever to be abbot of all three great Gelug Monasteries in one life. In addition he held the position of the fifteenth Gaden Tripa. His written works are greatly important teaching material to this day. A book with a collection of his works has just been published in English. He reinvigorated and renewed the tradition of debate, the powerful tool to develop piercing clarity of mind. Some of his prayers are still being recited daily by thousands of monks, like this one:
So that the tradition of Je Tsongkhapa
the king of the Dharma, may flourish
may all obstacles be pacified
and may all favourable conditions abound
These four lines are a wonderfully concise description of the blessed works of a Dharma Protector, and whether we know it or not, it is extremely unlikely for most of us to meet, much less practice Dharma if not for these Protectors’ unconditional compassion and miraculous help, because the degree of our self-obsession and materialism is overpowering our perception to the extent of total spiritual blindness.
Panchen Sonam Drakpa’s main practices were Chakrasamvara/Vajrayogini and Yamantaka. His main Protector was the 4-armed Mahakala.
He took rebirth as Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen who lived at the same time as the fifth Dalai Lama. They both were students of Lobsang Chokyi Gyaltsen, the first Panchen Lama. He went for many meditation retreats in caves where in one of his holy visions he was shown that he would later manifest as Dorje Shugden.
He was a famous teacher with many followers from Tibet and outer Mongolia, and abbot of Drepung Osel Ling and Ngakpa Trasang, the tantric school of Drepung . His Yidams and Protector were Chakrasamvara/Vajrayogini and Yamantaka and the 4-armed Mahakala and Setrap Chen. He and the Great Fifth were considered equally eminent Lamas. It is said that one day Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen defeated the Dalai Lama in debate and the latter’s attendants grew so jealous that they later arranged for Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen to be strangled with a Khata. However, this is just the outer appearance.
THE EMERGENCE OF DHARMAPALA DORJE SHUGDEN
While Je Tsongkhapa was giving a Dharma discourse, Nechung appeared to Duldzin Drakpa Gyaltsen in the form of a white dove, urging him to manifest as a protector of Je Tsongkhapa’s teachings who are so sublime and precious that a special protector is needed to guard and further them in this world. Nechung repeated his request to Duldzin Drakpa Gyaltsen’s subsequent incarnations and during the time of Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen approached again, asking him if he remembered his promise. Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen replied that since there was no anger in his mindstream, how could he manifest the wrathful energy of a Dharma protector? Thus the event of strangulation was displayed with bodhicitta motivation, enabling the enlightened being Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen to manifest wrath at the moment of death and to emerge in this way as the transcendent supramundane Dharmapala Gyalchen Dorje Shugden. Since killing a bodhisattva is nonetheless a very grave event, the elements reacted violently, and various strange occurrences took place for some time.
Dorje Shugden has played a major role in bringing the Buddhadharma from Tibet into the world, as we will see, and will continue so on a global scale.
The question is not who is right who is wrong and which side should we take. The question is not about Dalai Lama vs Dorje Shugden but more Dalai Lama and Dorje Shugden. And could there be a a bigger picture beyond our capability to understand now that benefits so many in the near future.
Dorje Shugden is not sectarian and does not harm anyone just cause they practice a different school of thought. He is a Dharma protector and does literally precisely that. And so it is our responsibility to share Dharma knowledge or info to clear away any misconception and doubt if any in people's mind so that things are clearer for them to make their choices based on understanding and truth, not for political reasons. That is the main objective of even discussing this topic.
Hope it helps. And thanks for allowing our voice to be heard
There are many substantial facts pointing to Dorje SHugden's qualities which is highly beneficial. It'll be fairly long to post in here for those who may be interested. So I'll just include one of the points below:
Dorje Shugden’s form teaches the paths of Sutra and Tantra
Dorje Shugden's form teaches the complete stages of the path of Sutra and Tantra, and such qualities are not possessed by the forms of worldly beings.
He appears as a fully ordained monk to show that the practice of pure moral discipline is essential for those who wish to attain enlightenment. In his left hand he holds a heart, which symbolize great compassion and spontaneous great bliss – the essence of all the stages of the vast path of Sutra and Tantra. His round yellow hat represents the view of Nagarjuna, and the wisdom sword in his right hand (like the one held by Manjushri and Je Tsongkhapa) teaches us to sever ignorance, the root of samsara, with the sharp blade of Nagarjuna’s view. This is the essence of all the stages of the profound path of Sutra and Tantra. He rides a snow lion, symbolizing the four fearlessnesses of a Buddha.
Explanation of his remaining features can be found in Heart Jewel, as can the specific enlightened function of each of the thirty-two Deities of his mandala, which are explained in a prayer written by Sachen Kunlo, one of the great Sakya Lamas.
Only enlightened beings display a meaningful aspect that teaches the entire path to enlightenment. Therefore, Dorje Shugden is a Buddha.