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The 31 Planes of Existence
Transmetaphysical
Veteran
Can someone help me understand these? This is the one teaching of Buddhism that I simply cannot bring myself to accept. Are they realms, mental states, categorization of existence, etc., it's not really clear. For example, there's the animal realm and the human realm. I think it's clear that these are simply making the distinction between animal vs. human mental states, and not actual realms (it would be nonsensical for there to be an animal realm because we humans exist in the same "realm" as the animals).
The realms that really confuse me are the deva realms. According to AccesstoInsight:
"Realm of:
(10) Devas Delighting in Creation (nimmanarati deva)
(9) Contented devas (tusita deva)
(8) Yama devas (yama deva)
(7) The Thirty-three Gods (tavatimsa deva)
(6) Devas of the Four Great Kings (catumaharajika deva)"
Seriously, I really think it's hard to interpret these as merely mental states. Also, the distinctions between these seem arbitrary. For example, why are animals above Hell-beings, but below Hungry Ghosts?
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The realms that really confuse me are the deva realms. According to AccesstoInsight:
"Realm of:
(10) Devas Delighting in Creation (nimmanarati deva)
(9) Contented devas (tusita deva)
(8) Yama devas (yama deva)
(7) The Thirty-three Gods (tavatimsa deva)
(6) Devas of the Four Great Kings (catumaharajika deva)"
Seriously, I really think it's hard to interpret these as merely mental states. Also, the distinctions between these seem arbitrary. For example, why are animals above Hell-beings, but below Hungry Ghosts?
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Comments
Can you see reasons compatible with Dharma why they exist? If not, they probably don't and are in some sense metaphore or addition...
namaste
If you pay attention to the present lifetime you will see that your mental states in fact take the form of these planes described in the Buddhist texts. Sometimes you are a hungry ghost realm constantly seeking pleasures, in agitation, sometimes you are in some kind of hell due to the constant fear of something, when you are sitting in meditation and feeling peaceful you are in some kind of heaven etc
this is why they do not teach this stuff to beginners.
it is meant to be experienced when we get there. On our journey on the path.
It can very well be interpreted mentally if you take off the icing and look at it as a mental state. Well, of course the other option is to blindly believe in it hoping that one day you will go there so you can experience it then. Suit yourself
Really? When I was a kid I took up Buddhism as a subject in my school and these planes of existence were there in my Buddhist text books. It's not very complex to fantasize about going to heaven after death you know.
well if this was the only options, it would not be a fun choice to make.
what about a third option: don't believe or disbelieve but keep in mind if you are already aware and see for yourself when the time come.
There is no "mental gymnastic" here. Seeing that your mind attends to these states is not such a hard thing to do. It only requires mindfulness.
As I already said "suit yourself"
Hi Transmetaphysical,
It isn't necessary to take the different 'realms' literally.
I strongly recommend you read 'Two Kinds of Language' by Buddhadasa Bhikkhu for the answers you seek.
http://www.what-buddha-taught.net/Books5/Bhikkhu_Buddhadasa_Two_Kinds_of_Language.htm
The sections beginning 'Woeful States' and 'Heaven' may be of interest as well as many others.
Kind regards,
Dazzle
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I second this. I would also strongly recommend this essay
I think you are asking the wrong question. Instead of asking whether it is a metaphor or not why don't you ask what are the origins of the idea? How does it relate to the sramana movement? How does it relate to vedic and pre-vedic thought? What was the historical context? I think these are much richer questions.
This is good advice.
Who hasn't been an asura, competing with everybody? "How many times did you meditate this week? Who can sit the longest?" Asuras try to win the meditation game.
Or felt like a god? Above others because you feel you live a superior lifestyle. We are sure that we are enlightened, that we've arrived. We're rarely bothered by a thought, so we feel comfortable enough that we look no further.
If you look, you can recognize which realm you're currently in, or you might find a way of being that isn't in any of the six realms.
Some choose to stretch this distinction (between being and place) beyond breaking point by claiming these characteristics are merely illustrative states of mind, all of which can apply to humans, thus retro-fitting Buddha's actual teachings into their materialist mindsets.
I think they can be interpreted as both. But it is not necessary to believe in gods to cultivate the path. On the other hand it is necessary to understand your mental states to do the same. So stick with the last option and let the other one be for now.
/Victor
Good answer. If you think about the english word world, how it relates to humans and animals this becomes even more evident.
/Victor
Where?
I've seen them. They told me I am Maitreya.
Discuss. :P
Where?