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There is no need to fear death if you know exactly what actually dies and what does not die but lives on eternally (you are with that person now but don't know it yet). As long as we attach to the flesh, we can't see what of us does not die—so we get freaked out! This explains why Bhagavan Buddha was so insistent that we give up clinging to the person of flesh. The person of flesh is dead to the life of spirit so when we cling to that person we feel the horror of death. Bhagavan Buddha brought us the light that we might spiritually see and have eternal life. When you receive his light you will have what we call COMPLETE VIEW (samyag-drishti).
How did Bhagavan Buddha approach his death?
When a blessed one is dying and his consciousness departs, he is peaceful and unaware of this death; he passes away fearlessly as if he were dreaming. - Maharatnakuta Sutra
Buddhism does not separate people into spirit and flesh, or material and spiritual come to that. We are seen as a whole, but as a process not as a thing of any sort, whether spirit, soul or essence, all the constituent parts of which are conditioned and come to an end. Buddhism is not about eternal life, which is seen as a delusion. You are alive now, you have a choice in this moment to be awake or not. That is what counts. At the same time, this is not a nihilistic view, as this process is the same in life - we are in constant flux, parts of ourselves dying, coming into being and changing from one moment to the next and even within one moment.
"Buddhism is not about eternal life, which is seen as a delusion".
When I think about (or crave) "eternal life" what I'm craving is an some existing that has unlimited amounts of time.
As I understand physics (not very well) time is one of the conditions for our existence here. Like space. If there were any ultimate release, I suppose it's a delusion to contemplate that it would involve unlimited amounts of any of the things that mark existing - neither unlimited amounts of time, nor unlimited space, not even unlimited chocolate.
WHAAAAAAAAAAAAT?!?!?!?! I need chocolate or it just won't be nirvana! A box of Godiva truffles daily is as close to nirvana as we can get on this side of things.
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federicaSeeker of the clear blue sky...Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubtModerator
edited January 2006
MMMMMMM!! Chocoalte.....
Oh! How I miss walnut whips!!
Sorry.....
Somebody mentioned earlier that he found his family, or even those in the West, are reluctant to discuss dying, preferring to sweep it under the carpet and pretend that of course, "it couldn't possibly happen to me!"...
Whereas those in the east, or maybe those practising a more eastern/oriental philosophy or Religion, are far more comfortable with it.
The two states have in their turn applied to me...
Morning Jerbear, we seem to have a few things in common though in my case it's SAD that has me awake, and at this time of year my sleeping pattern is all over the place, so I woke up at about midnight after five hours sleep. It does give me a chance to work undisturbed though and I like being able to sit a little earlier in the morning now that it's starting to get lighter.
Whereas those in the east, or maybe those practising a more eastern/oriental philosophy or Religion, are far more comfortable with it.
The two states have in their turn applied to me...
The subject of one's mortality and what does not die, which we can access by meditation, is usually answered by some Westerners with putting their fingers in their ears saying, "LALALALALALALALALALA—I AM NOT LISTENING!"
The subject of one's mortality and what does not die, which we can access by meditation, is usually answered by some Westerners with putting their fingers in their ears saying, "LALALALALALALALALALA—I AM NOT LISTENING!"
Don't they use light therapy for SAD? I heard that it is effective in reducing some of the syptoms r/t it. Don't know if the serotonin reuptake inhibitors are any good for it. They've had good luck with many affective disorders with them, but I hadn't heard SAD on the list yet.
I went back to sleep about 30 minutes later for 2 hours. I made my self stay up all day though. Went to Toledo to see a friend. So no way to take a nap. Didn't get home until an hour ago. Trying to straighten my sleep schedule out. I'm mainly off for the next 2 weeks. I only have to work one shift in 15 days, so I will be a day person for a change. I'm used to meditating at 3 PM. There is something to be said for habit. Trying to do it at a different time is tough for me as I am a creature of habit.
By the way, it looks like I will be getting your very cool statue at the end of February if you don't sell it. Will let you know when the money is in the bank and ready to buy.
WHAAAAAAAAAAAAT?!?!?!?! I need chocolate or it just won't be nirvana! A box of Godiva truffles daily is as close to nirvana as we can get on this side of things.
Me too, Jerry. MMM GODIVA!
"Hey, don't you want to talk about chocolate?"
kowtaaia,
Yes. Yes I do. I want to talk about it, and eat it, and talk about it, and eat it some more!
I actually use light therapy and melatonin supplements for my Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome. I use a large desk looking lamp, that is extremely bright. I have to say it works pretty well for what I have. You might want to look into it zenmonk_genryu.
I do have a lightbox, but it's in the UK and at the moment I'm saving up to have that and my other bits and pieces sent over. So next year it should be better, as that really does make a huge difference. On the plus side, working through or rather with the SAD itself is a good practice, reminding me to be a little more sensitive to my body/mind and how it can fall into patterns of reaction that exacerbate the situation if I'm not working with them.
My sleep pattern though is another matter, and I've found that even sleeping tablets don't tend to work well with me. I can take them for a few days, my sleeping pattern seems to stabilize and then if I'm up late one night - it's back to square one and the tablets by then no longer have any effect at all. That is also good though, for one thing I don't have a problem with dependance on any drug, they all wear off after a few days and taking increasing doses just gets way too silly before it even becomes feasible, and they can only ever be a short term measure anyway. Again, this too makes me look more deeply at how I spend my time, what comes up if I don't get enough sleep and so on, so it's all grist to the mill. And yes, I'm a grumpy git when I don't get enough sleep.
Yeah, I used to take sleeping pills or tablets as you call them. I became dependent and eventually they quit working. The melatonin supplement is a brand new drug that helps me to fix my circadian rythem so it is in sync with everyone else. It dosent affect the dependent part of the brain, so I lucked out.
Jerbear, even if we do sell that statue, I will ensure we have another. The larger statues are hand cast and do have to come a long way, so they're not items that we generally have to hand necessarily, being more special and custom orders. Which in itself is sometimes a problem for me as I get one day to appreciate the statue on the altar here and then have to say goodbye to it - a good lesson in impermanance. So please don't worry that we won't have it, we will. I do insist though that you not leave yourself short by doing this and that you take the discount I offered.
Keith, that's excellent and not something I was aware of, having relied previously solely on the light box, which did the job perfectly, but is now an issue because I don't have that. Thank you for that link. It's very much appreciated.
Rev. Genryu,
Life seems to be funny. Right after I told you about wanting it and saving up for it, I qualified to be in a drug study. I didn't know they paid you to be in it. I was doing it to help out people who have similar problems with pain and it's side effects, plus see if I could get help, also. I am being paid 500 dollars for participating. So, the money for the statue is coming from that study. Plus, if push comes to shove, Ypsilanti is only an hour from me so the shipping and handling can't be that much.
Sleeping tablets tend to make me loopy. We weren't 100% that it wasn't the sleeping tablets that made me confused. I've had 2 incidents where I woke up doing something bizarre. One was falling down a flight of stairs. I've stopped taking them. Some nights are hard, but I rather not find myself in another strange situation. Some nights, I sleep solid.
Hope it straightens itself out. By the way, my partner really likes melatonin. He never understood why I took Benadryl so much.
Rev. Genryu,
You may appreciate mine for a week if you like. Bow to it a few times also. Part of me thinks it would be kind of cool to have a monk use it for a week.
"Beware ye beauties undeceived! Know one false step is ne're retrieved. Nor all that tempts your wandering eyes; is lawful prize. Nor all that glisters; gold."
On a Favourite Cat, Drowned in a Tub of Gold Fishes
'TWAS on a lofty vase's side,
Where China's gayest art had dyed
The azure flowers that blow;
Demurest of the tabby kind,
The pensive Selima reclined,
Gazed on the lake below.
Her conscious tail her joy declared;
The fair round face, the snowy beard,
The velvet of her paws,
Her coat, that with the tortoise vies,
Her ears of jet, and emerald eyes,
She saw; and purr'd applause.
Still had she gazed; but 'midst the tide
Two angel forms were seen to glide,
The Genii of the stream:
Their scaly armour's Tyrian hue
Thro' richest purple to the view
Betray'd a golden gleam.
The hapless Nymph with wonder saw:
A whisker first and then a claw,
With many an ardent wish,
She stretch'd in vain to reach the prize.
What female heart can gold despise?
What Cat's averse to fish?
Presumptuous Maid! with looks intent
Again she stretch'd, again she bent,
Nor knew the gulf between.
(Malignant Fate sat by, and smiled.)
The slipp'ry verge her feet beguiled,
She tumbled headlong in.
Eight times emerging from the flood
She mew'd to ev'ry wat'ry god,
Some speedy aid to send.
No Dolphin came, no Nereid stirr'd:
Nor cruel Tom, nor Susan heard.
A Fav'rite has not friend!
From hence, ye Beauties undeceived,
Know, one false step is ne'er retrieved,
And be with caution bold.
Not all that tempts your wand'ring eyes
And heedless hearts, is lawful prize;
Nor all that glisters, gold.
Brigid,
I understand! When it comes to Godiva chocolates, it's such an impermanent but fantastic experience. We usually get one of those 36 truffle packs (expensive I know) and only have one each per day. If were bad, we have 2 each. But every day is a little taste of bliss. By the way, we only do that once a year. Can't afford to do it more often.
Jerry,
That's the best way to savour them! I think it's good mindfulness practice. Do nothing but taste the chocolate, savour the textures, feel how they transform and melt in your mouth...
Oh, no, there I go again! And yes, they are expensive, and you know what? I don't care. Belgian chocolate is, in mho, worth every single penny!! NO one in the universe makes finer chocolate.
-_-;; I must be lacking in the chocolate gene. It just doesn't make me drool the way it does for some people.
But almond divinity! Ah, now *there's* a weakness! To get it, we have to travel all the way to Amish country--a drive we only make perhaps once a year--to buy a perfect little tissue-wrapped box of the stuff, priced dearly as silk, and then bring it home, to savor a little each day, as you described, Jerbear. Now that I know more about mindful eating, I can't wait to bring home another box and eat it even more slowly than before...
Or...I could just bring more money with me next time, and get more of it!
How could I be sure that I had an essential "me" that could reincarnate? Where was this indelible bit of identity, that would still be myself even if all my circumstances and memories were not available to me?
That's an interesting thought about reincarnation I'd never considered before.
I couldn't be certain. And I haven't been certain about anything since. I'm looking into Buddhism because at this point in my life, I am truly a seeker--settled on nothing, convinced of nothing, filled with questions and wonderings and a desire to know. Meditation and looking at Dharma teachings has brought me some peace of mind, so I am definitely open to learning more.
Oh! Just as a side note to all of you who are in your early 40s and think you might be old: you can't possibly be old! You're only two years or so shy of my parents, and everyone says they're quite young! So don't worry.
Keith,
You're right. We do get easily distracted on this site. The site should be called "New Buddhist with ADD.com".
As for death, I've seen it many times. It really isn't that big a deal. The body wears out and it's time for things to end as all biological organisms do. I believe in treating every death as the ending of a life. I'm one of those silly people that get upset about seeing an animal dead in the road.
The one type of death I really haven't had to face is the death of a child. I imagine that is much more heartbreaking than the kind of death that I face. I don't feel that I have the right to comment on that. I don't think I could tell a suffering parent "You suffer because you are attached to the child". Eventually they may find a way to let go of the attachment, maybe not. My hope is that it doesn't ruin their lives now.
Working in a veterinary hospital, I saw death in a way that I hadn't before. It's not that it became...common to me, in any way, or that it didn't affect me--it definitely did! But rather, it became less scary when I knew how it happened. I'm still terrified of dying myself, but now I actually know how the physical process works. When a friend of my family was dying a few months ago, I was better able to offer her comfort and say my goodbyes because I understood that she was dying although her family couldn't understand it. I feel that I was able to make more of my last moments with her because of my recognition of the physical signs that she didn't have much time.
I hope that I don't sound calloused. In a way, I am. Since I work in intensive care, I see death pretty regularly. I do have to have a certain amount of professional distance from it. But how I've done it is to look at as clinically as possible. I realize that people need to deal with it in their own way. Had to be tough working with animals. I love dogs and would probably cry to assist in putting one to sleep. Actually, my teacher is a veterinarian by trade plus running a sangha. I shall ask him how he deals with it.
When I realized that I no longer believed in eternal life, it was tough. Not seeing my mom or sister or best friend was tough. But I couldn't change what I thought to be true because it felt better to me. That isn't a bad way to go if you can handle it, but my intellectual integrity would be compromised. So what does one do with death? Face it as real. Not pretty and flowery like harps and clouds, but real. Can't tell you what it feels like but you have to experience it. It's real and you have to really grieve the loss. But it's grieved and over as much as one can be.
Hope that clarifies my position because as I read my response it did seem rather cold.
I didn't find it cold. I totally understand how professional distance is essential for you working in the ICU. I've had a lot of friends who have died. Some were in the hospital at that moment and I found that the professionalism of the nurses is what gave me the strength to see my friends off. It was an absolute comfort to me to see the nurses going about their work, taking care of people instead of making a fuss or freaking out about something that happens everyday for them and is a natural part of life. They were all warm and compassionate and had the skills to help those who were grieving as well as those who were dying. I had and have the deepest respect for them and for you, my friend Jerry.
Love,
Brigid.
P.S. The "Nobody Special" user title is just an ego thing. I have a vague recollection of reading it somewhere in regards to a sign hanging in a monastery as a gentle reminder.
I hope that I don't sound calloused. In a way, I am. Since I work in intensive care, I see death pretty regularly. I do have to have a certain amount of professional distance from it. But how I've done it is to look at as clinically as possible. I realize that people need to deal with it in their own way. Had to be tough working with animals. I love dogs and would probably cry to assist in putting one to sleep. Actually, my teacher is a veterinarian by trade plus running a sangha. I shall ask him how he deals with it.
When I realized that I no longer believed in eternal life, it was tough. Not seeing my mom or sister or best friend was tough. But I couldn't change what I thought to be true because it felt better to me. That isn't a bad way to go if you can handle it, but my intellectual integrity would be compromised. So what does one do with death? Face it as real. Not pretty and flowery like harps and clouds, but real. Can't tell you what it feels like but you have to experience it. It's real and you have to really grieve the loss. But it's grieved and over as much as one can be.
Hope that clarifies my position because as I read my response it did seem rather cold.
I didn't think your response cold. It was real. It seems it would be so diffcult coming from believing in eternal life to ?not knowing for sure? what happens after death. And, then to see it day after day. But we all have the ability to step up to the plate when bravery and strength in difficult circumstances is required.
I was terrified years ago when I was younger around 20. Now I think it's more if im going to go-make it quick.
Nowadays I try to make everyday a good day and livable from the early morning to late at night-i TRY NOT TO WASTE TIME.
ok Illl stop with the :bs:
I'm sh** scared of dying. there I said it. Are you happy now?
Oh man, my whole world is falling apart! Hey, whatever helps you is what is right intellectually for you. If you're scared, it takes more of a man in my book to admit it than try to act all macho about it. A lot of people don't know the meaning of the word man in my book. So do what works for you.
I didn't think your response cold. It was real. It seems it would be so diffcult coming from believing in eternal life to ?not knowing for sure? what happens after death.
This is from a Zen master.
A student simply must endure and tolerate the angry mind. Many masters have also said that because of anger, man becomes a tiger, a bee, a snake, or some similar stinging or biting creature. From foolish mindedness, man becomes either a bird or a butterfly. Depending upon his degree of low-mindedness, man becomes either an ant, mosquito or the like. From craving things, man becomes a hungry ghost. The type of desire or anger molds the nature of hell into which men will accordingly fall. Each and every state of mind determines the kind of creature man is to become. --Master Kyong-Ho (1849-1912) korean
The conditions which made it possible for our own birth have not been sufficiently extinguished by us to insure the end of rebirth (you have to be an Arhat for that one). So logic dictates we shall be reborn again according to our predisposition. Our consciousness will re-link with a set of conditions insuring again-birth into some from (rupa) from that of a god to even a hell being.
I was terrified years ago when I was younger around 20. Now I think it's more if im going to go-make it quick.
Nowadays I try to make everyday a good day and livable from the early morning to late at night-i TRY NOT TO WASTE TIME.
ok Illl stop with the :bs:
I'm sh** scared of dying. there I said it. Are you happy now?
The conditions which made it possible for our own birth have not been sufficiently extinguished by us to insure the end of rebirth (you have to be an Arhat for that one). So logic dictates we shall be reborn again according to our predisposition. Our consciousness will re-link with a set of conditions insuring again-birth into some from (rupa) from that of a god to even a hell being.
Thanks WickWoman. Love the new pic. I need to get a fun filled one some day.
Mujaku,
I don't really know what the point of the post was except that we are to be respectful around a dying person. If how those around a person dying affect which realm (which we can't prove) one will be born in, I know plenty of people who would go to a lower realm. Some cultures believe it is perfectly normal to wail and scream while their loved one is passing. I am not about to tell them not to grieve in a way inappropriate to their custom so that it may fill Buddhist cosmology. I hope that's the right term.
Also, that really takes the whole idea of karma and throws it out the window. I've been good and I've been bad, but I deal with my own deeds and misdeeds. If friends and family need to cry or whatever, fine.
All,
This brings up an interesting question. I lost my twin sister d/t a brain aneurysm bursting in her head. She was brain dead before she finally was taken off life support. Now, we know that when a person is brain dead, they can no longer carry out higher or middle functions of the brain. Every thing is reflexive. So would it even matter at that point how one acts around the dead? If they can't pick up on it, it wouldn't cause any negative karma. What's your thoughts?
Comments
Buddhism does not separate people into spirit and flesh, or material and spiritual come to that. We are seen as a whole, but as a process not as a thing of any sort, whether spirit, soul or essence, all the constituent parts of which are conditioned and come to an end. Buddhism is not about eternal life, which is seen as a delusion. You are alive now, you have a choice in this moment to be awake or not. That is what counts. At the same time, this is not a nihilistic view, as this process is the same in life - we are in constant flux, parts of ourselves dying, coming into being and changing from one moment to the next and even within one moment.
"Buddhism is not about eternal life, which is seen as a delusion".
When I think about (or crave) "eternal life" what I'm craving is an some existing that has unlimited amounts of time.
As I understand physics (not very well) time is one of the conditions for our existence here. Like space. If there were any ultimate release, I suppose it's a delusion to contemplate that it would involve unlimited amounts of any of the things that mark existing - neither unlimited amounts of time, nor unlimited space, not even unlimited chocolate.
WHAAAAAAAAAAAAT?!?!?!?! I need chocolate or it just won't be nirvana! A box of Godiva truffles daily is as close to nirvana as we can get on this side of things.
Oh! How I miss walnut whips!!
Sorry.....
Somebody mentioned earlier that he found his family, or even those in the West, are reluctant to discuss dying, preferring to sweep it under the carpet and pretend that of course, "it couldn't possibly happen to me!"...
Whereas those in the east, or maybe those practising a more eastern/oriental philosophy or Religion, are far more comfortable with it.
The two states have in their turn applied to me...
The subject of one's mortality and what does not die, which we can access by meditation, is usually answered by some Westerners with putting their fingers in their ears saying, "LALALALALALALALALALA—I AM NOT LISTENING!"
Hey, don't you want to talk about chocolate?
Don't they use light therapy for SAD? I heard that it is effective in reducing some of the syptoms r/t it. Don't know if the serotonin reuptake inhibitors are any good for it. They've had good luck with many affective disorders with them, but I hadn't heard SAD on the list yet.
I went back to sleep about 30 minutes later for 2 hours. I made my self stay up all day though. Went to Toledo to see a friend. So no way to take a nap. Didn't get home until an hour ago. Trying to straighten my sleep schedule out. I'm mainly off for the next 2 weeks. I only have to work one shift in 15 days, so I will be a day person for a change. I'm used to meditating at 3 PM. There is something to be said for habit. Trying to do it at a different time is tough for me as I am a creature of habit.
By the way, it looks like I will be getting your very cool statue at the end of February if you don't sell it. Will let you know when the money is in the bank and ready to buy.
Me too, Jerry. MMM GODIVA!
"Hey, don't you want to talk about chocolate?"
kowtaaia,
Yes. Yes I do. I want to talk about it, and eat it, and talk about it, and eat it some more!
My sleep pattern though is another matter, and I've found that even sleeping tablets don't tend to work well with me. I can take them for a few days, my sleeping pattern seems to stabilize and then if I'm up late one night - it's back to square one and the tablets by then no longer have any effect at all. That is also good though, for one thing I don't have a problem with dependance on any drug, they all wear off after a few days and taking increasing doses just gets way too silly before it even becomes feasible, and they can only ever be a short term measure anyway. Again, this too makes me look more deeply at how I spend my time, what comes up if I don't get enough sleep and so on, so it's all grist to the mill. And yes, I'm a grumpy git when I don't get enough sleep.
Edit: Heres a link to it. http://www.rozerem.com/
Life seems to be funny. Right after I told you about wanting it and saving up for it, I qualified to be in a drug study. I didn't know they paid you to be in it. I was doing it to help out people who have similar problems with pain and it's side effects, plus see if I could get help, also. I am being paid 500 dollars for participating. So, the money for the statue is coming from that study. Plus, if push comes to shove, Ypsilanti is only an hour from me so the shipping and handling can't be that much.
Sleeping tablets tend to make me loopy. We weren't 100% that it wasn't the sleeping tablets that made me confused. I've had 2 incidents where I woke up doing something bizarre. One was falling down a flight of stairs. I've stopped taking them. Some nights are hard, but I rather not find myself in another strange situation. Some nights, I sleep solid.
Hope it straightens itself out. By the way, my partner really likes melatonin. He never understood why I took Benadryl so much.
You may appreciate mine for a week if you like. Bow to it a few times also. Part of me thinks it would be kind of cool to have a monk use it for a week.
Hmmmmm
LOL! I was going to go further with that statement, but I stopped myself.
Not in time, apparently.
:eekblue:
poem: On A Favorite Cat
'TWAS on a lofty vase's side,
Where China's gayest art had dyed
The azure flowers that blow;
Demurest of the tabby kind,
The pensive Selima reclined,
Gazed on the lake below.
Her conscious tail her joy declared;
The fair round face, the snowy beard,
The velvet of her paws,
Her coat, that with the tortoise vies,
Her ears of jet, and emerald eyes,
She saw; and purr'd applause.
Still had she gazed; but 'midst the tide
Two angel forms were seen to glide,
The Genii of the stream:
Their scaly armour's Tyrian hue
Thro' richest purple to the view
Betray'd a golden gleam.
The hapless Nymph with wonder saw:
A whisker first and then a claw,
With many an ardent wish,
She stretch'd in vain to reach the prize.
What female heart can gold despise?
What Cat's averse to fish?
Presumptuous Maid! with looks intent
Again she stretch'd, again she bent,
Nor knew the gulf between.
(Malignant Fate sat by, and smiled.)
The slipp'ry verge her feet beguiled,
She tumbled headlong in.
Eight times emerging from the flood
She mew'd to ev'ry wat'ry god,
Some speedy aid to send.
No Dolphin came, no Nereid stirr'd:
Nor cruel Tom, nor Susan heard.
A Fav'rite has not friend!
From hence, ye Beauties undeceived,
Know, one false step is ne'er retrieved,
And be with caution bold.
Not all that tempts your wand'ring eyes
And heedless hearts, is lawful prize;
Nor all that glisters, gold.
Thomas Gray
I understand! When it comes to Godiva chocolates, it's such an impermanent but fantastic experience. We usually get one of those 36 truffle packs (expensive I know) and only have one each per day. If were bad, we have 2 each. But every day is a little taste of bliss. By the way, we only do that once a year. Can't afford to do it more often.
That's the best way to savour them! I think it's good mindfulness practice. Do nothing but taste the chocolate, savour the textures, feel how they transform and melt in your mouth...
Oh, no, there I go again! And yes, they are expensive, and you know what? I don't care. Belgian chocolate is, in mho, worth every single penny!! NO one in the universe makes finer chocolate.
LOVE that poem. My father's always quoting it. We have a tortoiseshell female.
Another line he likes to use is "A cat can look at a king..."
What a coincidence!
Your dad too, eh? There's a dozen more than 1 cat here.:cheer: :cheer:
But almond divinity! Ah, now *there's* a weakness! To get it, we have to travel all the way to Amish country--a drive we only make perhaps once a year--to buy a perfect little tissue-wrapped box of the stuff, priced dearly as silk, and then bring it home, to savor a little each day, as you described, Jerbear. Now that I know more about mindful eating, I can't wait to bring home another box and eat it even more slowly than before...
Or...I could just bring more money with me next time, and get more of it!
Bad, bad Pandy. *smacks wrist*
What do they all eat? Do you share your sprouts and seeds with them, or do they bring you fine fat mice? :tonguec:
That's an interesting thought about reincarnation I'd never considered before.
You sound like a good canditate for Buddhism!
:hair:
Gee, thanks.
You're right. We do get easily distracted on this site. The site should be called "New Buddhist with ADD.com".
As for death, I've seen it many times. It really isn't that big a deal. The body wears out and it's time for things to end as all biological organisms do. I believe in treating every death as the ending of a life. I'm one of those silly people that get upset about seeing an animal dead in the road.
The one type of death I really haven't had to face is the death of a child. I imagine that is much more heartbreaking than the kind of death that I face. I don't feel that I have the right to comment on that. I don't think I could tell a suffering parent "You suffer because you are attached to the child". Eventually they may find a way to let go of the attachment, maybe not. My hope is that it doesn't ruin their lives now.
Some of them do like certain sprout varieties, actually. There was a mouse once.
He whose insight penetrates here
is a truly great man.
— Hakuin Ekaku
When I realized that I no longer believed in eternal life, it was tough. Not seeing my mom or sister or best friend was tough. But I couldn't change what I thought to be true because it felt better to me. That isn't a bad way to go if you can handle it, but my intellectual integrity would be compromised. So what does one do with death? Face it as real. Not pretty and flowery like harps and clouds, but real. Can't tell you what it feels like but you have to experience it. It's real and you have to really grieve the loss. But it's grieved and over as much as one can be.
Hope that clarifies my position because as I read my response it did seem rather cold.
I didn't find it cold. I totally understand how professional distance is essential for you working in the ICU. I've had a lot of friends who have died. Some were in the hospital at that moment and I found that the professionalism of the nurses is what gave me the strength to see my friends off. It was an absolute comfort to me to see the nurses going about their work, taking care of people instead of making a fuss or freaking out about something that happens everyday for them and is a natural part of life. They were all warm and compassionate and had the skills to help those who were grieving as well as those who were dying. I had and have the deepest respect for them and for you, my friend Jerry.
Love,
Brigid.
P.S. The "Nobody Special" user title is just an ego thing. I have a vague recollection of reading it somewhere in regards to a sign hanging in a monastery as a gentle reminder.
It was very good writing BF. You underestimate yourself.
I didn't think your response cold. It was real. It seems it would be so diffcult coming from believing in eternal life to ?not knowing for sure? what happens after death. And, then to see it day after day. But we all have the ability to step up to the plate when bravery and strength in difficult circumstances is required.
mmm scared of dying.
I was terrified years ago when I was younger around 20. Now I think it's more if im going to go-make it quick.
Nowadays I try to make everyday a good day and livable from the early morning to late at night-i TRY NOT TO WASTE TIME.
ok Illl stop with the :bs:
I'm sh** scared of dying. there I said it. Are you happy now?
regards
But in the jungle where the tigers are ...
Man who paint toilet, not neccesarily shit-house painter.
This is from a Zen master.
The conditions which made it possible for our own birth have not been sufficiently extinguished by us to insure the end of rebirth (you have to be an Arhat for that one). So logic dictates we shall be reborn again according to our predisposition. Our consciousness will re-link with a set of conditions insuring again-birth into some from (rupa) from that of a god to even a hell being.
Can you prove it?
Mujaku,
I don't really know what the point of the post was except that we are to be respectful around a dying person. If how those around a person dying affect which realm (which we can't prove) one will be born in, I know plenty of people who would go to a lower realm. Some cultures believe it is perfectly normal to wail and scream while their loved one is passing. I am not about to tell them not to grieve in a way inappropriate to their custom so that it may fill Buddhist cosmology. I hope that's the right term.
Also, that really takes the whole idea of karma and throws it out the window. I've been good and I've been bad, but I deal with my own deeds and misdeeds. If friends and family need to cry or whatever, fine.
All,
This brings up an interesting question. I lost my twin sister d/t a brain aneurysm bursting in her head. She was brain dead before she finally was taken off life support. Now, we know that when a person is brain dead, they can no longer carry out higher or middle functions of the brain. Every thing is reflexive. So would it even matter at that point how one acts around the dead? If they can't pick up on it, it wouldn't cause any negative karma. What's your thoughts?