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Crying and Zazen
Hello all! It has been a while since I have posted here. Since, I have joined my local Zendo and have been an active part of study group and discussions. On Sunday, I will be attending my first service. It will be a 50min meditation session with sutras, tea, and kinhin. The 50 minutes is broken up into 25 sitting, kinhin, then another 25mins sitting.
My Roshi mentioned to us not only when I met with him and the Ino, but even during discussion/group a couple of days later that people come to the Zendo when they have been through something traumatic. Something inside their heart, their mind, or both, changes.
I think one of my last posts here was in October of last year about a friend of mine who committed suicide. I also had open-heart surgery four years ago, and both of these things were traumatic for me, and have affected me deeply. So naturally, when my Roshi mentioned that to us, I thought of those things. That being said, I've read a quote or two (not sure where I came across it originally) that states that if you haven't cried while meditating, you haven't begun to meditate. So, I guess I'm slightly worried 'what if I cry while sitting in Zazen?' 'How do I deal with it, or cope?' 'Is it okay to cry?' I suppose what I'm trying to ask is, have any of you who are Zen Practitioners (Soto, Rinzai, or etc). cried while sitting? What happened? What did you do? Do you have any advice for me? I have not sat with my group yet, so it should be interesting, I think.
Thank you,
Skylotus
My Roshi mentioned to us not only when I met with him and the Ino, but even during discussion/group a couple of days later that people come to the Zendo when they have been through something traumatic. Something inside their heart, their mind, or both, changes.
I think one of my last posts here was in October of last year about a friend of mine who committed suicide. I also had open-heart surgery four years ago, and both of these things were traumatic for me, and have affected me deeply. So naturally, when my Roshi mentioned that to us, I thought of those things. That being said, I've read a quote or two (not sure where I came across it originally) that states that if you haven't cried while meditating, you haven't begun to meditate. So, I guess I'm slightly worried 'what if I cry while sitting in Zazen?' 'How do I deal with it, or cope?' 'Is it okay to cry?' I suppose what I'm trying to ask is, have any of you who are Zen Practitioners (Soto, Rinzai, or etc). cried while sitting? What happened? What did you do? Do you have any advice for me? I have not sat with my group yet, so it should be interesting, I think.
Thank you,
Skylotus
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Comments
But regardless what they think if you cry that is your feeling at the time. The Dalai Lama cautioned that if we meditate and never go into our 'stuff' we are not making the kind of progress that could be possible otherwise.
So I would say that I would expect they would be compassionate but regardless you are a good person and you have a heart and it is part of the human condition to feel sad. I hope you stay with your experience whatever happens.
I cry when I cry.
I sleep when I sleep.
I eat when I eat.
It is just another thing we do.
Disclaimer: I am not typing that as some Buddhists would when they say I sleep when I sleep and I eat when I eat.. some of them are crazy as in wisdom. I am not, I was just trying to say that if I cry then I cry, I don't suppress it. I am not always in a constant state of virtuous awareness or anything nirvana like
By the way I have cried at the center I used to go to while we were all doing a short meditation before my guru spoke. I was mixed up in some stuff that really ravaged me and was completely against my conscience and was feeling so regretful.
I can relate to this.. when I first began meditating I was basically full of so much pain that I'd repressed for decades! So naturally lots of stuff began to arise, sometimes I couldn't even pinpoint exactly what it was! But I always just let it come up, and out and let the tears flow- However I have met other meditators who left retreats because this began happening to them, and they werent' comfortable letting it come up and out then and I guess you have to do whats right for you at the time. I believe it is part of the process, and for me, I always felt better afterwards:) Its sort of the emptying out process, letting go of stuff that you believe is you, it needs to be felt/acknowledged and let go of.. I would think that if I was in a sangha that looked down on or discouraged tears, I'd probably find another sangha. Thats just me;)
Anyway, best wishes!
Peace and metta:)
"A morning not spent weeping is a morning wasted,
An afternoon not spent weeping is an afternoon wasted,
A night not spent weeping is a night wasted."
We are callous and blunted, our experience and perceptions;
To weep, our shell dissolves
we are already naked
do not be afraid to cry
Accept.
Move on.
It's fine.
@genkaku, laughter and crying are close bed-fellows... sometimes, when people hear tragic news, there is an impulse to smile/laugh... it's a psychological "knee-jerk reaction" in response to sudden unnerving stimulii.
You guys were closer than you thought.
You want to know my most embarassing zazen experience? I had skipped breakfast that day, and for some reason my stomach and guts began growling and making noises during the quiet meditation like my plumbing was going to explode. I could only sit there with a tremendous blush on my face. Then the noises stopped, and I had an overpowering fart emerge that I couldn't control.
The entire room erupted with laughter and when it turned out be a stinker, the Teacher told us all we needed an unscheduled break, "for some, more than others" and reminded us the bathrooms were in the basement.
And I had to go back in and sit back down later. Thankfully, my guts had quieted down by then. I didn't get much real meditation done that day, though.
Someone in my group began to cry. She quietly got up and left the session, with as little disruption to others as possible, and returned and resumed, once she felt better.
Nobody commented, nobody minded, and although she apologised, we all assured her it was entirely unnecessary....
@Cinorjer +1 on the growling guts - the few times i did group meditation it often happened to me too. :rant:
@Cinorjer HA! That is fantastic! At least your group laughed! LOL. I'm sure it was all in a good-natured fashion.
@PrairieGhost No, of course not.
I don't know about zazen protocol, but I've seen many people cry during teachings; I always recall the moment Geshe Sopa said you don't have to give up on yourself "...even if you have killed someone," and looked briefly at a young man near me, who then began crying silently.
The emotions can be spiritualised.
Lust for enlightenment, makes a good log for our far shore raft.