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Dharma Police
lobster
Crusty Veteran
As we all appreciate the moderation here is calm, considered and fair. What happens if we are on a forum run by those advanced enough to know 'the True Buddhism' and the need to protect the beginners from the mavericks?
I remember going to a 'high' initiation. Outside the top shrine of the temple everyone was wondering if they would be let in. Some got to the dharma police at the door and started asking if such and such an initiation allowed their entry. It did not and they were turned away. If you need to ask obviously not advanced enough . . .So how was this process implemented? Basically if you looked like you were meant to be there you were allowed in. This really is how policing works. If you look and behave as a dharma abiding Buddhist, in you go . . .
Would Bodhidharma, crazy adepts and probably the Buddha himself be told to dress appropriately or asked who their teacher was?
Have you come across the dharma police? Are they funny, infuriating, power corrupted, doing the best they can? What is your solution to the 'protectors'? How can we protect ourselves from them? Should we see them as our greatest teachers?
I remember going to a 'high' initiation. Outside the top shrine of the temple everyone was wondering if they would be let in. Some got to the dharma police at the door and started asking if such and such an initiation allowed their entry. It did not and they were turned away. If you need to ask obviously not advanced enough . . .So how was this process implemented? Basically if you looked like you were meant to be there you were allowed in. This really is how policing works. If you look and behave as a dharma abiding Buddhist, in you go . . .
Would Bodhidharma, crazy adepts and probably the Buddha himself be told to dress appropriately or asked who their teacher was?
Have you come across the dharma police? Are they funny, infuriating, power corrupted, doing the best they can? What is your solution to the 'protectors'? How can we protect ourselves from them? Should we see them as our greatest teachers?
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Comments
what you describe also sounds utterly non buddhist.. the buddha said his teaching is
exoteric (open hand) as opposed to esoteric (closed fist)...open to all , not revealed.
but humans are humans.. and this is what comes out of our greed, hatred, and delusion
They came across as narrow, tight, pinched, sour people.
They were not good advertisements for the practise.
Things I got told off for doing included:
I got told off for touching another person. No high-fives even after we did a really good day's work in the kitchen. No handshaking to greet new people.
I got told off for sitting at that table, had to sit over there at the men's table.
Wasn't allowed to work in the kitchen with a female. Always had to be same gender working pairs.
We weren't allowed to do slow walking, totally forbidden!
Wasn't allowed to run.
I got told off for washing male and female sheets and cushion covers in the same load of the washing machine.
Couldn't wear shorts that showed my knees.
I got told off for wearing a shirt with a skull and crossbones on it.
I got told off for wearing a bright red shirt.
I got told off for talking about other meditation techniques. No, not practising them, just talking about them.
I got told off for pointing my feet towards the front of the meditation hall.
I'm sure there were a lot of other things I got told off about.
Later, when I had been there a while, they got me to be the manager for a while, and I had to enforce the same damn rules, tell people not to play music or sing, not to use incense, not to use such strong deodorant...
It was all pretty uncool.
The only reason I stayed is because the meditation was FREAKIN AMAZING and the restrictions and rules were a small price to pay.
The 'dharma nazis' made me laugh. It does seem a small price to pay. People really are doing the best they can.
Who has been at a lax centre - monks skateboarding around the stupas, nuns rapping for visiting rinpoches . . . quite often the very same places . . .
The 'dharma nazis' made me laugh. It does seem a small price to pay. People really are doing the best they can.
Who has been at a lax centre - monks skateboarding around the stupas, nuns rapping for visiting rinpoches . . . quite often the very same places . . .
what what WHAT??? Lol.. I've never seen or heard of such a thing.. Where was this?
I've given all I can
It's not enough...
I've given all I can
But we're still on the payroll...
Sorry. It's stuck in my head now...
This is what you get when you mess with uussss...
You crazy kids! ;-)
And the Dharma Nazis I encountered were doing the best they could. They just had a lot of rules to enforce, and poor interpersonal skills.
After some time I began to see the purposes of the rules, but at first it seemed petty and absurd.
Not a very Buddhist action I know... and new people can be a little bewildered with all the things going on in a temple... but I admit I laughed.
In our temple, the rules are pretty lax for new people (no shoes though, lol) but if you're a lay leader of you've been there awhile the teacher will point out things to you. Or as he outs it, turning up the dificulty level.
Of course hearing instructions to supposedly sleeping retreat folks at night that there should only be " one body per tan" gave me a little appreciation for how far the Dharma boundary's were sometimes stretched..
It boggled my mind too but why should Monastics & lay persons be different from others folks in the world. Just because a person has been inspired to step onto the path is no guarentee that they stay there. I think I have often ambled to and fro over the path so why wouldn't others.
At the very least their behaviour was no less valuable to anyone receptive to the Dharma than any other teaching I can think of.
Therevadin places in the West are often very virtuous, moral and strict. Western Zen I should imagine also but I have no experience of Zen centres, just practitioners.
You should also be aware that some centres introduce people to Buddhism, when the management have gone rogue.
http://viewonbuddhism.org/controversy-controversial-teacher-group-center-questionable.html
Just in case your serious...
A tan is usually a raised 3'x6' area in a Zendo where during retreats a trainee eats, recites sutras, meditates and sleeps. This was a instruction that sleepers need to stay in there own sleeping bags.
Ah the Californian early 70's summer of love!
Will the breaking of a rule disturb these enlightened masters so much?
If so, they are not masters.
Are they afraid any diversion from the norm will put enlightenment of the students at risk?
If so, they don't understand the way things go.
Just my opinion.
Do it with a transmission of Ego and it's a certainty.
Knock Knock.... "This is the A.A. Police. Did you call your sponsor an idiot today?"
We need A.A. Police, but we haven't got any. We've not got any rules either, apart from Rule 62, "Don't take yourself to god-dammed seriously".
It works for us.
And every vow you break
Every smile you fake, every claim you stake
I'll be watching you
The Police
Somebody told me they had a "kuti" a while back, I was mystified until they explained it was basically a garden shed.