How very disappointing...
federica
Seeker of the clear blue sky...Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator
Call me late to the party, but I recently discovered, reading the Wiki entry for him, that Lama Surya Sas was been accused of sexual impropriety, in 2019. He disputes 'some' of the allegations. Which must surely, logically mean that he agrees with others....?!
Sogyal Rinpoche was also at the centre of a scandal involving his abuse of students and followers.
Sogyal Rinpoche's impropriety did not - for me - detract to any significant degree from the masterpiece he wrote, "The Tibetan Book of Living and Dying" because it was an impersonal, educational insightful book. He never really spoke about himself, or referred to himself, except briefly and to explain his beginnings... I'm really far more disappointed with Lama Surya Das, because his 'Awakening' Trilogy is somewhat biographical, and replete with personal anecdotes. He mentions so many teachers and Gurus, who had a profound effect on his development, and relates different phases of his education - some of them of intense and deep practice - culminating in his being established as an elevated and respected Lama.
These men are not isolated cases, sadly. There are many accounts of Buddhist Monks from all traditions, being accused - and being found guilty - of extremely serious misdemeanours.
Some of these people were celibate as part of their tradition dictates. Others were perhaps free to marry and have families... So... why? Terrible abuse of power and position.
I'm just bitterly disappointed.
I recently began re-reading Surya Das' Awakening books. Then checked his current status on Wiki. I feel a little embittered now, and am finding it difficult to separate the words from the man...
Comments
Sexual misconduct is so frequent among teachers that I'm surprised when one does NOT have any.
I think TNH was a rare example of someone who never became embroiled in carnal complications...
TNH hugged everyone. His monks were as unenlightened as him, when I saw him and some of them. His books are superb. He was a pure being.
https://plumvillage.org/live
'The Tibetan Book of Living and Dying' was mainly written by one of Sogyal Rinpoche's disciples. The silly bits are his contributions between molesting students.
Llama Surya Daz and his brainwashed are still whitewashing his activities? Ah well, a waste of time? Or do we have to offer discernment?
Tee Hee welcome to the Hell-o Realms... (I'll bring sand witches)
The Buddha does not 'belong' to people, places, trees or temples 🤔
Seems like we are all Beginners again...
It’s interesting, this tendency towards sexual transgressions among spiritual teachers. I think the amount of respect they get from their circles of admirers makes them think that sex with disciples is also a possibility.
Every path has its own potential failings along with its successes.
Sexual transgressions happen to be a potential failing of the faith/devotional path.
The most common cases of sexual predation occurring within the Buddhist clergy seem to be found in those same teachers who have fostered deliberate levels of autonomy from their own spiritual peers, elders & masters. A relative freedom from scrutiny.
The power differences that allow spiritual pedophilia to occur in the master/disciple relationships do not occur in a vacuum. They are the careful orchestrations of a perpetrator over their subjects. Senior disciples must also enable such failings in their teacher to allow them to continue to be hidden.
Teachers who allow a student's ardor and faith/ devotion to be applied to the teacher, rather than to a practice, are simply grooming that follower for the potential arriving preceptual breakages that will swallow both of their practices.
Perhaps all of us have some potential for being abusive over those less able to defend themselves. Perhaps the seeing of where we might also have such potentials within ourselves might allow us to not walk so blindly down those same paths.
Right View and Right Intention help in understanding the nature of temptation.
Right Mindfulness and Right Concentration help cultivate inner discipline.
Right Effort encourages abandoning unwholesome states and developing wholesome ones.
And Dharma teachers being Dharma teachers (aka 'human' ) are still susceptible to temptation.
Temptation is like letting kids loose in a sweet shop. Some will resist with discipline, while others will indulge. The struggle with desire is at the heart of Buddhist practice, and even Dharma teachers, as human beings, are not exempt from it....
When our desires take over the mind.
What utterly disappoints me so much, is how prevalent it is in Religious fields. It is no less heinous or inexcusable to find such abuse in military circles, the Police Force, The Health service, where stories of abusive behaviour and sexual predation by those in high ranks, exists and persists. But I mean, you'd think that religious priests, Masters, gurus, or teachers, would hold themselves to a higher moral standard than yer average Senior surgeon or Lieutenant-Colonel.... it's really astounding just how widespread it is! I'm simply flabbergasted...
I am not sure it's wise to expect religious fields filled with devotees, most often brimming over with the wounded in life in both leaders and followers, to be any less susceptible to the human condition than any other groupings where power differences occur.
In fact, the very expectation that a religious field should be less dangerous to the vulnerable is a naivety that ill prepares a path walker to navigate through those power imbalances safely.
Only beings in positions of power over others, who unfailingly place the welfare of those in their care above that of their own, are likely to be free of power's abusive failings.
How much more difficult it must be for ordinary teachers, in isolation from their betters, to be ever transcendent of their own baser natures when ever surrounded by followers whose practices are devotional in nature.
Our Sangha's are littered with bitter practitioners who have only discovered later in life, how complicit they've been in a teacher's failings just by placing them on a pedestal.
@how makes a very good point about isolation and autonomy of (some) teachers contributing to transgressions.
I'll give the example of our local Chan teacher. The name and details are not important for the purposes of the discussion, especially because, as far as I know, there are no allegations, and he appears to be both legit and ethical.
However, the situation looks very non-ideal...
At least to me, it is totally unclear what his precepts, if any, are. Everyone, including me, will project/assume what they are or should be, but none of us will have a clear picture. He was one of a handful of people who got full Dharma transmission from a famous Taiwanese priest, so people project very high attainment. As far as I know, he is not a priest, but a lay teacher. His centre is a two-person show, himself and an assistant. There are no publicly available statements as to what his precepts, if any, are. Neither in general, nor in the murky fields of sex and money. As far as I know, he is not "under" any other teacher.
In my view, such teachers should have clear and publicly available statements on their websites as to their precepts and status in terms of whether they are a monk or not, and if they are a lay-teacher, then do any precepts apply.
Let's make it really simple: I think that 90% of people coming to his centre assume he is celibate. He never says that, and no one asks, at least publicly, nor are there any statements to that effect. This cannot be a good situation.
The Fallacy of Authority
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority
Fortunately, I am in the naughty corner. Not only can I do what I like, local legal constraints permitting BUT I continue practicing some hot-potch nonsense for my own benefit...
https://mettaray.com/Religion/
Yep, he is now a member of that group where the member is accused of sexual impropriety.
Sadly, accusation = guilt.
No, in this case, allegations and guilt were established.
https://religionnews.com/2020/07/30/buddhist-teacher-lama-surya-das-admits-sleeping-with-former-students-dzogchen/
Yes, but before he confessed, people were still treating it as a foregone conclusion.
Thankfully, things seem to have blown over. There's a moral to the story - if Lama-la asks for sex, the best answer is NO.
The answer is always no, if no means no. No matter who, why, or where.
Rape is the most inhuman and degrading, humiliating indignity any one person can brutally inflict on another. And the VAST majority of perpetrators are men, raping women. Which reveals the sobering reality that the dating pool for hetero women, also contains their most dangerous predator.
A quick search using Spanish governmental sources....
"According to the INE, in 2023, there were 2,867 adults convicted of sexual offenses, with 97.2% being men and 2.8% women. Among minors, there were 424 convictions for sexual offenses, with 97.9% being boys and 2.1% girls. These figures indicate that the vast majority of perpetrators are male."
=/
‘ Yes, but before he confessed, people were still treating it as a foregone conclusion.’
This statement is hilarious!
Let me get this straight…
Before I admitted I did it… How DARE YOU accuse me of something and then assume/conclude my guilt on that said thing.
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Quite right
Yes, and I have up-close-and-personal experience that confirms this.
The answer to the question that you're probably asking yourself, is, yes, I was.
And I guess I fall into that statistically insignificant minority
I would say that hetero women have their own predatory instincts, too. I've known a few.
Anyway, this convo has gone from impropriety, to rape, and I'm not down for that.
Done.
Unchecked power can be quite corrosive.
One celibate monastery populated by men and women who lived and practiced together, managed to side-step many of the more commonly reported cases of sexual opportunism through an adherence to precepts against inappropriate sexuality along with a setting up of supportive structures to help those precepts succeed.
Establishing that even the appearance of a potential sexual impropriety should be avoided. No closed-door meetings, nobody in positions of power situating themselves between the vulnerable and an escapable doorway, having another "sensible" adult be within an audible hearing distance of any counseling's or meetings, etc.
Having teachers clearly posit to their followers that one of the more inevitable harms of any sexual interactions between their Sangha members occurs when relationship breakups oblige one or another of the participants to leave their practice places & teachers of choice. That any sexual indulgences in such circumstances are simply a fostering of one's own ego over the spiritual needs of others.
Anyone breaking such rules were summarily asked to leave and no longer hold themselves up as representatives of that school, no matter how long they had practiced there.
While a bit too hardcore for some of the laity to follow themselves, I think it certainly helped monastics and the followers of their satellite centers & groups to avoid many of the failings that seem to have afflicted so many other Buddhist lineages.
My ideal man/buddha is a woman.
My ideal teacher/guru/lama/zen mistress is an enlightened woman.
Still looking for hens teeth too.
Here for example...
Synopsis of Chapter 6 of the Vimalakīrti sutra
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vimalakirti_Sutra
Me too.
Idem
You have my wholehearted, unconditional, and unwavering support. I actually belong to a local organisation that counsels men who have been subject to abuse. I never assume nor presume that men are exempt from such treatment.
🙏