Do you still believe Lance Armstrong?

hermitwin

I am just wondering if he has been lying for all these years.

RebeccaS

About what?

hermitwin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=hrREyjqXpyo

MaryAnne

Armstrong isn't here to defend himself. Armstrong's former friend is only responsible for himself, and his own actions. Throwing suspicions onto Armstrong, (and many other athletes) in his sport doesn't change the fact that HE is a cheat and a liar. There are no positive doping test results on Armstrong, either.

But all that aside, here's what keeps nagging me-
WHY is this important to you (Hermitwin) or should be important to any of us? There are much more important issues to bother the mind and conscious with....

This is pretty trivial and gossipy in the sight of other very real, very serious world issues and problems.

vinlyn

Mary Anne, I would agree if Lance Armstrong was a private person, doing a normal job. But he is a public sports figure who benefits financially from public adoration (which he seeks) for his product endorsements. As far as the innocent until proven guilty concept...fair enough...except that as early as 1999, Armstrong refused to cooperate with testing of urine samples.

As far as this being gossipy (a Precept matter) on a Buddhist website...well, you have a point there. Of course, the Precepts are only guidelines (not my position, but a common one here). And I think the question that is fair to bring up is drugs in general, and drugs in sports, is of national and international interest because hero-athletes set an example for young people. So the issue is not inconsequential.

hermitwin

DaltheJigsaw

Who knows. Perhaps he is or isn't. Maybe..down the road more truth/answers will come about?

vinlyn

Interesting video. I would correct his lawyer on one issue -- the proof was not in the pudding...the proof was in the piss!

Cloud

Moved to General Banter. B4B is for Buddhism-specific material for beginners.

genkaku

I'm inclined to believe in performance-enhancing drugs.

Beej

I love bike riding. It's my favorite way to exercise and one of my favorite past times. It's also one of my favorite ways to deal with stress. But, my back hurts. My knee hurts. My neck hurts. Yet, I still get on the bike and ride in spite of it, most times. All I take is the occasional Ibuprofen, some homeopathic arnica ointment, and the intermitent hot bath. And that stuff can only do so much. I don't exactly come from phenomenal genetic stock (both of my parents have had recent heart surgeries and no one in my family has ever been an exceptional athlete). It's hard to get up and do it everyday, but I try to do it.

There's so much freedom in riding a bicycle that I totally understand why Armstrong never wanted to give it up. I don't concern myself with wondering if he ever did anything to enhance his performance.... I marvel at his willingness to continue, though. I guess I don't really care if he did anything to enhance his performance because I don't really care that he won so many races. I don't really relate to competitive bike riding. I just relate to the freedom of it, the movement, the fresh air, the scenery, the smells, and the peace I feel after I get off of the bike. And that's why I understand why Armstrong wouldn' want to give it up.

Race. Don't race. Cheat. Don't cheat. Lie about it. Tell the truth. Either way, the man overcame cancer and got back on his bike. I will ride my bike until it kills me or I crumble into a heap from arthritis... and I'm not so sure I wouldn't lie to do it, either. I'm not proud of that, but it's, to-date, the most healthy addiction that I've ever had. And that's what I take from Armstrong. Just keep riding.

All the rest of the stuff, I can just leave in the dust.... and I'll just let the French worry about the fine details.

ThePensum

Perhaps whether you take Armstrong at his word or not, regarding use of drugs, tells you more about yourself than anything else.

Having watched the Tour De France since 1995 when I was fifteen, and watching all those doping scandals in the late 1990s, with the French champion Virenque thrown out with the rest of the Festina Team; all the runners up to Armstrong having been found guilty of doping at one time or another; well you can't help but think.

The interesting thing about those doping scandals (re Vireqnue) was that it wasn't the anti-doping agencies that found out, but the customs officials at the country borders, who found banned substances being trafficked.

Dakini

hermitwin said:

I am just wondering if he has been lying for all these years.

I don't think he has. He points out that he's taken drug tests all along the way, and nothing has come up positive. So why this obssession, why the witch hunt? That's what I don't get. It seems unfair that he'll get stripped of his titles.

vinlyn

Dakini said:

hermitwin said:

I am just wondering if he has been lying for all these years.

I don't think he has. He points out that he's taken drug tests all along the way, and nothing has come up positive. So why this obssession, why the witch hunt? That's what I don't get. It seems unfair that he'll get stripped of his titles.

I think because -- according to what I've been reading -- the accusations have come from multiple people.

Dakini

There's still no proof, is there?

Dakini

Dakini said:

There's still no proof, is there? So it's hearsay, so far?

vinlyn

This is quite a good article: http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/othersports/longtime-witness-against-lance-armstrong-finally-vindicated/2012/08/25/804ed02c-ef07-11e1-b829-786e028dccb3_story.html

andyrobyn

My opinion , which is influenced by conversations with and observations of athletes who have been at the Australian Institute of Sport ( not in cycling but in other sports which are competed in at Olympic level ), is that use of performance enhancing drug is part of the picture in at least some sports and not everyone who uses them gets detected - it was said to me in order to gain the necessary edge some competitors take risks which mean that the use of these drugs are detected.

jll

Witness testimony is also proof.
But there will be people who will continue believe Lance no matter
what happens in the court.
I believe he did use drugs.
He wasnt the only one.
If he confessed that he doped, how will the millions of adoring fans react?
I believe in forgiveness and acceptance.
Ok, he no longer has the 7-time tour de france title.
so what?
He is still an extremely wealthy man.
He is still an extremely gifted, dedicated and successful athlete (arguably the most successful cyclist in the last 10 years).
It does not negate all the good work he has done for cancer.
So, if I am a lance armstrong fan, I will advise him to just tell the truth.
I will be hurt but I will forgive him.
and I will still be his fan.

Dakini said:

Dakini said:

There's still no proof, is there? So it's hearsay, so far?

BonsaiDoug

@TheBeejAbides - I believe I know how you feel. At 65 I recently purchased a bike after about a 20 year lapse. And I'm hopelessly hooked! Every morning after my meditation sitting I hit the road. A great follow up to the meditation.

Dakini

The Soviet Olympic teams used to get around that by using performance-enhancing herbs, like rhodiola (a plant native to Russia). I wonder why Western teams can't figure out some kind of formula like that.

person

Its sad that a hero to so many got caught using drugs right before he passed away. His reputation has been tarnished to so many but he's still a role model to me. I wasn't born when he took that first memorable step into the future, but its always been a great inspiration.



Rest In Peace

vinlyn

person said:

Its sad that a hero to so many got caught using drugs right before he passed away. His reputation has been tarnished to so many but he's still a role model to me. I wasn't born when he took that first memorable step into the future, but its always been a great inspiration.



Rest In Peace

Are you confused or am I. Lance Armstrong is the bicycler who has been accused of taking enhancement substances.

Neil Armstrong was the astronaut who just died.

No relationship between the two.

Or am I missing something?

person

@vinlyn I think you may be talking about Greg LeMond? The American cyclist who won multiple Tour de Frances.

vinlyn

No. I think you've got this one all confused.

Can you point me to a source about Neil Armstrong taking drugs?

person

Sorry, I'm just having a go. April Fools.

Beej

hahahaha!

Good show, @person.... good show.

vinlyn

I smell a fraud!