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There's always that ONE precept that's hard to follow!
Rowan1980
Keeper of the ZooAsheville, NC Veteran
Okay, maybe not always. 
I took the 8 precepts this morning for the first time. I have to say, I didn't realize how much I randomly--and mindlessly--start singing until, well, I had vowed not to for the next 24 hours! :buck: (I believe a Beyonce song was involved at one point.) Suffice it to say, I immediately felt regret for transgressing the precept each time I did it, performed the applicable purifications, etc., etc., etc. I'm not beating myself up over it because, hey, it's the first time I took these particular precepts.
So, when it comes to Pratimoksha vows, 8 Mahayana vows (if applicable), etc., does anyone else have THAT ONE (or more!) that's a beast to keep? 
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Not singing is a precept for lay people? Not that I sing often, but I wouldn't bother with that!
At least in the Gelug school of Tibetan Buddhism, if one takes all 8 precepts on Full Moons, New Moons, etc., that one is included, yeah.
I only follow the 5 but I just can't resist having a glass of wine with Italian food.
Maaaan, if I weren't a cheap date when it came to alcohol, I probably would, too.
No way I'd ever take a vow not to sing. Or listen to music.
Definitely not for more than 24 hours outside of a retreat environment. I'd go bonkers, I think.
Well, it's not that I can't handle silence. I rather like it. But music is so inspiring! I like to enjoy it from time to time, and I like to sing in choirs or music groups when the opportunity arises. I LOVE to create harmonies! That, in itself, is a spiritual experience. :om: . Music elevates the soul. I mean, the...um...consciousness.
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Some music is used for meditation. Probably all could be used for meditation.
I think it's more the why, rather than what.
Yes...why? What is the value?
For me the value of excluding a behaviour is to understand its potential to 'hinder' or enjoy. Most of us are in sensory overload.
After about five weeks of not listening to music on a retreat (no precepts, just not available), I put on some headphones and listened to some dreary intonation of Leonard Cohen. Sounded heavenly. This is how I learned to appreciate his music.
Some of us will know how amazing bland food tastes after fasting.
The precepts are a way to focus on what is most relevant to our liberation, not our senses, which we occupy the monkey mind with . . .
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The fourth precept is a real stinger, I find. The others, I'm pretty much stuck on.
A friend suggested some time ago, that in order to be able to qualify for housing benefit, I tell the Services that my mother and I don't get on, and she wants me out of her house.
I can't do it.
It's not true.
Granted, it would help my situation, but having discussed it with my mum, and having agreed my discomfort, we came to the conclusion that the living arrangements separate my H and I, because the house is small, cramped, and has no adequate facilities for more than 2 people.
Which is true.
But the temptation to have used 'unskilful speech' was pretty near overwhelming....
I too follow 5 precepts. But (The big 'BUT') I break sometimes. For example, I sometimes read magazines online and these websites put a cookie on your device and record the number of articles you have read. Mostly, they allow only a 1 or 2 articles freely. They ask for your subscription if you read more. I tend to read these in browser's incognito mode which deletes the cookie after I close the browser, me getting away with their restriction. A bit cheeky way of breaking the precept.
I follow the basic five and have no problem with the first four. The fifth one used to get me all the time but I now abstain from intoxicants that leave me heedless or less mindful. I still drink coffee and tea and smoke cigarettes and sometimes weed.
I am making an effort to cut out the coffee and cigarettes though.
The older I get, the more I am convinced that the value of the precepts lies not so much in the slick notion that you could keep them (if you tighten the screws enough, virtue will somehow be nailed down) but rather in the recognition that you could not possibly keep them ... but now you pay attention and take responsibility.
I'm probably wrong ... again .
I'm with you on that.
A highly respected Christian teacher once told me that the 10 commandments and the books of law in the old testament were not meant to be "followed". That, he said, was impossible. Rather, he explained that they were there to show the futility of trying attain righteousness thought effort.
I guess that carried over to my views about things like the Precepts. For me to "follow" or live by the precepts, is utterly impossible, but I'm not so sure they're something that has to be lived by as if they were a set of immutable laws. I find, however, that as time goes on I live by those precepts more, but not through any conscious decision or effort on my part.
Maybe in some future life I'll be able to live by it, but not this one.
I think this pretty much sums up the motivating factor for me to take the 8 precepts once in a while. (I follow the 5, or at least, I try to.) Granted, I've seen it couched in terms of earning merit and positive potential, which is fine, too. The notion of taking a step back on occasion from activities and objects that are readily available to better appreciate them without grasping is, for me anyway, a good reason. Your mileage may vary.
A precept not to sing? Why would you do such a thing to yourself?
I could kinda say I did it and survived. It was just for a day, so whew!
To spare my ears any more pain perhaps.
Exactly. :thumbsup: .
The precepts are just the guide rails that other Buddhists have found helpful in keeping them heading towards suffering's cessation.
If I accepted not singing as a precept (that would be a new one for me) then I would approach it as a mindfulness exercise to explore what each new inclination to sing really stemmed from.
Sometimes the heart sings and no words come forth . . .
Is mantra, dharma song? Things are subtle and have levels of applicability. If a flower sings its manifestation and we listen to its singing are we breaking precept?
If I steal your time with ignorance who is an accomplice?
Back to beginner class for me :-/ .
Some precepts are about not-harming. But some other rules like not singing (not even when no-one can hear you) or not sitting on chairs (not even when the chairs remain empty) or not eating after noon (not even when the refrigerator is full) can only be seen as some sort of personal training. They have to be about the effect on one’s own mind.
One effect I can see is that through abstinence appreciation grows. After one week without seats and couches I really loved the moment I could lean against the back of a seat again.
Maybe better; through abstinence sensitivity grows. After a week without music the wallpaper of sound in the shopping mall was quite irritating. Before that week I hardly noticed it.
The lasting effect, I imagine, is that those things I usually take for granted can be seen as things I am attached to (with either desire or aversion). The desires and aversions of everyday life get some contrast.
Together with some meditation in everyday life, following silly precepts can maybe help me to be less identified with my preferences? Not even the ones I tend to overlook?
I prefer to follow this somewhat relaxed precept (It tends to cover the 5 basics) "Do the least amount of harm possible under the circumstances !" This includes towards my 'self' along with other sentient beings...
I follow this everyday and the wholesome thing about it is, it allows room for error, one is not inclined to 'beat oneself up' should a flaw be exposed in the fabric of the reality experienced....
And as for singing...
"Tis easy to wear a smile and be pleasant when ones life flows along like some sweet "song" -But a person worthwhile is the one who can still sing and smile when things in their life go all wrong!" .
..
@Rowan1980
The precepts can be likened to the different facets of one Dharmic jewel.
Taught in this way, no one facet really shows any more of the jewel than what the reflections of all the other facets do.
Muddy one facet and all the other facets reflect that muddiness.
Clear one facet and all other the facets reflect that clarity.
Studied in this way, the difficulties perceived in following one precept can illuminate how one may really be having the exact same difficulties with all the others.
Precepts are really quite easy to follow. What is missing is being perfectly willing to follow them. Done half way only increases the dust of defilements.
As far as I am concerned the buddha DID NOT define what you could or could not do!
Precept: a commandment or instruction intended to define your moral responsibility.
Funnily enough I was told on this very site that I was completely wrong to assume, after coming to a veritable self understanding, (that moral responsibility must necessarily follow an understanding of the 4NT and 8FP), I was wrong to assume this.
LOL