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Marriage equality for all Americans, finally!
karasti
BreathingMinnesota Moderator
Just sharing because it makes me so happy 
Supreme Court in the US ruled that states cannot ban gay marriage, opening the door for gay people to get married in every state. Finally.
It will be an extra special 4th of July.
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Comments
Hurrrah!!
Those Westboro Baptists will be fuming....
A day to celebrate! I find I am alternately smiling and crying. And with the upholding of ACA yesterday - an embarrassment of riches.
I have to admit, I didn't think much of the chances for either, not with this court. Add to that, people realizing that racism and its flag is alive and well and cannot be disguised as "heritage" anymore, and we've had the strangest couple of weeks I can think of in a long time.
Several people are proclaiming this is the end, the rapture is coming. If that is who God takes in the rapture, then yes, please, take them!
Good news. Good to hear, many thanks.
"Don't let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya!"
It really has been quite the time. I remember in 2012 when WA state legalized marijuana AND gay marriage at the same time. It took a while to sink in, like it wasn't serious, it couldn't be. And now, it feels like we are hurtling 'forward', or at least hurtling. I'm sure it feels like that in a negative fashion with those who see this as evidence of the 'end times'. Perhaps it is? The end of state sponsored superstition and discrimination.
I have acquaintances who are conservative Christians who consider this progress to be just the opposite of progress, unless it is progress toward some Revelation-inspired prophecy of doom. They are certainly correct, in any case. It's just that the rest of the world will putt along without them, like it has in spite of the several hundred or so end-of-the-world predictions we've been treated to over the last 2000 years.
I'm curious as to how the religious 'right' will respond, how they will 'harden' their position in response. The acquaintances I mentioned above are genuinely resentful and angry. They fear being 'forced' to 'accept' gay marriage, which is an interesting projection as thought control is a huge part of Christianity and the other Abrahamic religions. The right wing news sources are shamelessly inciting their fears and insecurities, warning that churches will be sued unless they perform gay weddings, that Christians will be marginalized and persecuted (more so than now, in spite of Christians being a clear majority AND powerful enough to breach the separation of church and state by imposing religious-based laws). Poor them, I guess.
It seems to me that we should be joyous for all LGBT Americans today, but that we should not take joy in the suffering of those who are on the wrong side of American history. We also should remember that all the challenges in this general movement are not solved, and there are going to be a slew of court cases to straighten out dozens of aspects of a transitional period in American life.
The reaction is both heart warming and hilarious.
There are a lot of people that are so upset about this that they have decided to move to Canada to get away from it.
Probably wondering how to set up wifi in an igloo.
Well, good luck to them on that -- Canada was the 4th country to legalize gay marriage. Go Canada!
Please no, really, we have enough kooks up here already...
Well, Mexico is out because they made the same move last week.
May I suggest perhaps another continent?
The States did have a heck of week though. Well done, guys!
Perhaps the Westboro Baptists will seek asylum in Russia.
The battle may be won but sadly when it comes to the war on the religious right's mental afflictions
"One can't reason a person out of a position that they were not reasoned into !"
I saw a TV interview with some of those Westboro Baptists, they really are barking mad, one sandwich short of a picnic, check-up from the neck-up needed, lift not going all the way to the top! Bleedin' loonies!!
I can't get over how quiet it is at work!!! The Southern Rednecks who are normally loud and proud seem to be quiet and pouting, removing their flags from the inside of their cubes, and the religious people are hudled up whispering " well, fine, they can get married, but they don't need to be bringin' that around me and switchin in front of me" . LOLOLOLol...Fine with you? whatever. Yes, the gays are chasing you down and want to 'turn you out' lolololol. Like I said....so quiet and hush, hush...
Yep....what a week, here huh? Change happens....and it can happen all at once and quick....I'm feeling so excited and encouraged.
Just for the record, I'm not taking joy in anyone's suffering. I find it an ironic thought to consider their view of God and Christianity and the rapture being on it's way. It seems to me those who are so angry and afraid are most likely to be left behind, not the other way around. Truly, if the rapture is coming, I don't wanna go, lol.
I look forward to when it dies down, like it has in the states it was legalized in, and is just part of life. Where every person under the sun with an opinion who posts on twitter isn't given center stage to voice their ignorance and fear and hatred.
I don't care if people don't believe in gay people or gay marriage (which is funny in itself...it exists, you can't really say you don't believe in it like you don't believe in the tooth fairy...). But I care when people cannot grasp that their beliefs should only apply to them. Not to anyone else. That Alito (I think it was him) said that our country has one Ruler of all the people. Uh. Please, don't speak for me. He also said in the dissent that basically we had it right i 1868 and we should stay there. Good gravy.
And while I know people all have their biases and perspectives, it just always surprises me to see Clarence Thomas vote for things that hold people back. Considering the position he holds, I guess I just expect him not to agree that the constitution had it right in 1868, considering where that would have placed him in that time in the social order, since that was the year the 14th amendment was ratified.
I am grateful for the outcome. I've been thinking all day about what it must be like for so many who did not have a chance to get married yesterday, and now they do. Their government did something right. But barely. 4 of the 9 justices voted against it based on our founding principles. AKA religion. It just burns my ass (sorry, it's true) that people sworn to our highest office use their personal religion to make decisions for such a diverse country when the constitution is supposed to look out for ALL of us. Not just those living under the "Ruler."
The talk Barack Obama gave to members of the LGBTQI and their supporters a few days ago at the introduction of Pride week....
President Obama is a real charmer, he's earned many merits with this wholesome karma...
He's da man
As a citizen of the United States I'm very happy as well.
The current generation of humans is not separate from future generations.
Very pleased they set the appropriate precedent.
I'm always really impressed with the way the founding fathers set up our nation. We have three branches and they are meant to work as checks-and-balances.
One justice on the supreme court believed that the wisdom the court could offer on this issue was not applicable -- leaning toward abstention. However, when things escalate far enough to reach the supreme court, they have reached there for a reason. The precedents set by the court are pretty much inviolable in our nation, so it was a really pivotal moment. If you look at the votes, the act passed 5-4 which shows you the state of things, but it still passed, and it will save a lot of lives (it really will).
"It's just love!" as they say.
To a more inclusive and caring tomorrow! Cheers! holds up ceremonial apple juice
I think you're very right about a lot of this calming down as it becomes part of life. When I was out running errands today, I actually wished some of the nuts that are so worried about this might notice that things in the grocery store today are operating the same as they did yesterday. Same for Costco. Same for Bed, Bath, & Beyond. People were driving as per usual. Life goes on. And for a whole group of people, life will go on in a much better way than ever before.
To be completely frank, there are a few things that Clarence Thomas doesn't understand. First, he's more confused about his race than Rachel Dolezal. Second, he doesn't realize that a Republican president chose him as a "token". And if "you" disagree with that, go back to 1990 and ask yourself what percentage of Republican voters would have voted for Clarence Thomas if we voted for the Supreme Court. Third, he is so set in his opinions, so closed minded that he never talks during the questioning phase of Supreme Court cases. He already knows all the answers. If I could magically place any one person back in American life 200 years ago, I would choose Clarence Thomas. I wonder if he would enjoy picking cotton or tobacco for 16 hours a day and then talk about how slavery did not take away a person's dignity.
The other Supreme that bothers me to no end is Scalia. What a snide little man he is. And if there is anyone who harms the dignity of the court, it is he. His dissents are downright embarrassing and unprofessional, and they amount to little more than temper tantrums. Today his official suggestion (since it came from the Bench, was if you had a particular question, go ask a "hippie". Frankly, I'd rather ask a hippie than a dippie.
I will at least give John Roberts some credit. In his dissent he said, ""If you are among the many Americans -- of whatever sexual orientation -- who favor expanding same-sex marriage, by all means celebrate today's decision. Celebrate the achievement of a desired goal. Celebrate the opportunity for a new expression of commitment to a partner. Celebrate the availability of new benefits. But do not celebrate the Constitution. It had nothing to do with it." At least I sense that his opinion was based on his view of the law, rather than a personal belief.
It's a pretty God damned sad day in America when a black man fails to live up to white liberal expectations.
I have the same thoughts and wonders about women who vote for those who seek to limit their freedoms, about poor people who vote for those who take away funding for the programs they rely on. It's not really about race, it just happens that Thomas is a man who is part of a minority group who has suffered greatly at the hands of others due to their beliefs at the time. And now he votes for others to suffer as well based on his beliefs. I don't comprehend that. I find it odd every time someone votes in favor of something that goes against their best interests, or when they vote against the freedoms for other that they themselves (or their ancestors) had to fight for.
In fact, Thomas has been married twice, both times to white women. Which wasn't legal for him to do (per the supreme court changing the law for the country just like today) until 1967...when he was almost 20 years old. So it's strange to me that when he was quite old enough to recall that change that he would deny another minority group the exact same right that he benefits from. Based on his religious beliefs. Which were also the foundation for the argument against legalizing bi-racial marriage...
From "The New Yorker" over a year ago:
"As of this Saturday, February 22nd, eight years will have passed since Clarence Thomas last asked a question during a Supreme Court oral argument. His behavior on the bench has gone from curious to bizarre to downright embarrassing, for himself and for the institution he represents. ... These days, Thomas only reclines; his leather chair is pitched so that he can stare at the ceiling, which he does at length. He strokes his chin. His eyelids look heavy. Every schoolteacher knows this look. It’s called “not paying attention. ... But the process works only if the Justices engage. ... Thomas is simply not doing his job. ... By refusing to acknowledge the advocates or his fellow-Justices, Thomas treats them all with disrespect. It would be one thing if Thomas’s petulance reflected badly only on himself, which it did for the first few years of his ludicrous behavior. But at this point, eight years on [now 9 years], Thomas is demeaning the Court."
Seriously? The New Yorker? That's the standard for a black man's political views? I'm sorry but I can't accept that. Conservative Christian Blacks are entitled to their believes the same as everyone else. I'm sorry but i have gay friends as well as black Christian friends and they are both entitled to their different views.
Sure they are. And he's a public servant, and I'm entitled to my viewpoint as well. The problem with the Supremes is that they answer to no one. Really, the only people in the entire country that you can say that about.
He is entitled to his beliefs just like anyone else. But the people in our government, especially our courts, are sworn to uphold the constitution which, in part, protects people from a government that institutes a federal religion. When Christian judges (or whatever) use their beliefs to make decisions for people who are not Christian, then there is a problem. Entitled to his personal beliefs, yes. Allowing them to influence his legal decisions when he was appointed to serve the entirety of US citizens, many of whom do not share his beliefs, no.
Like I said, I just find it a curious thing. I'm not in any way saying he's not entitled to his own beliefs. I just find it ironic and I wonder how he resolves it in his mind.
Karasti, you make a good point. My overall judgement about what makes a good Supreme Court justice is this: if they're totally predictable, they're probably not doing a truly good job, whether they are liberal or conservative.
If there were some way to select Supreme Court justices who were truly neutral, I'd be all for it. But electing them, and bending to the whim of the country -- whether in a liberal or conservative swing -- is a bad idea.
And you're right, Karasti. When I was principal, I was being paid to reflect the policies of the School Board, which sometimes were very far from my own.
I have to laugh when I hear someone like Ted Cruz say that "the people have spoken on this (whatever) issue", when in reality it's a distinct minority that reflect his position (and yes, Shak, I know, they all do that to some extent).
@Shak ... No dude, it's more than someone expecting Clarence Thomas to be more liberal because he's black.
It's that he is completely off the wall. Serious problems. He's either not all there, or he simply doesn't care anymore...at all.
Read his opinions...they make zero sense. I think he writes his dissents on bar napkins.
Very true , and several of them apparently don't even have to answer to common sense.
I'm curious, what does "switchin" mean?
@SpinyNorman Think it refers to switch-hitting (as in baseball, a batter that can hit left or right handed), I always thought it was a reference to bi-sexuality whereas 'playing for the other team' would refer to homosexuality.
@SpinyNorman brace yourself ...
It means they are not playing cricket. [lobster faints] Strange but true, some colonies do not play cricket.
Heathens!
... and now back to other sports ...
Yes, cricket was invented by English gentleman to foster jolly sportsmanship behaviour like playing for the other team. And those who are ambidextrous would have a natural advantage in ball games.
Oh I see. I'm not really up on these new-fangled games they play in the colonies. "Baseball" you say? Sounds like "rounders" to me.
From a legal standpoint, it's about time. That was the easy part -only took 220+ years or so. Now the real work begins for the reality of equality or at least equal treatment for all. As a Buddhist, I have seen the exclusionists take their bigotry underground. Watch out for the new coding - the haters are very good at verbal camouflage.
Our LGBT friends have a right to celebrate. But when the party is over, it's back to the trenches. The tragedies of late in the news show that we must all be aware that hatred does not die just because the law has.
@Vastmind, I don't think you will find any increase in open display of sexuality from either the gay or the straight communities relative to what you have already seen. Remember, if you suppress one group of people, you suppress all the people.
Remember Manzinar.
Congratulations America! I should hope Australia is next!
We are all one world, one species on this rock. Let's all play nice together and share.
@SpinyNorman @lobster Yeah, we North American Colonials do things differently for sure. Instead of a cup of milky tea in the middle of proceedings, we prefer a nice cold beer.
You colonials forget that the English invented beer, they had to come up with something because the water wasn't safe to drink. Later on English gentlemen invented sherry of course.
Tea was invented by the Buddha, another English gentleman.
Not really.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beer
But that article says that "Archaeologists speculate that beer was instrumental in the formation of civilizations." and of course it was British gentlemen who invented civilisation.
Gentlemen don't plunder
British gentlemen invented Spain too. That's why Napoleon invaded it.
Of course Napoleon got his just deserts when the Duke Of Wellington showed him what English gentlemen are really made of.
British gentlemen also invented "history" by the way.
Is there anything British Gentlemen didn't do?
Every time we mention them we proliferate their agenda, play into their game, and encourage them on.
They are monkey mind. We need to relax and let them go.
Well, no. God was the original British gentleman of course.
I live in Canada, and I find comments like this disrespectful and infuriating.
Our WiFi is just as good as yours, and we are legally forced to live in igloos.
@SpinyNorman
I'm not your buddy guy.
OK buddy.
You must be pretty close to the border.