Acupuncture & Acupressure Have you tried them ?
Shoshin
No one in particularNowhere Special Veteran
I have great confidence in ancient Chinese and Indian alternative pain relief...I had a book I bought years ago by an Indian guy (so I guess it must have been Ayurvedic Acupressure) however I let my daughter 'borrow' it and that was the last of saw of it...go figure 
mind you I have since found another book "The Natural Healer's Acupressure Handbook" ...
I bought this hand pressure point massager from Paddington market in Sydney back in the early 1980s...It's more of a hand reflexology thing, but work quite well..
I have used acupressure points for many years, and the most common one seems to be this 
Which seems to provide instant relief....
I remember years ago at a work's family day where a guy fell from a flying fox and dislocated his shoulder, when he was lying of the ground in agony, a young guy walked over to him and asked him where it hurt and then just applied pressure to some points on his body and the pain subsided, it was amazing to watch acupressure in action...and this young guy would have only been 17/18 ....but he really knew his stuff...
I would be interested to hear from other members of their experience with both techniques...ie Acupressure & Acupuncture...
If you have had either treatments ...did they work ? (did you benefit from the treatment)
Or do you think it's all a load of mumbo jumbo hit & miss nonsense ?
Comments
I had acupuncture many years ago, I don't think it made a blind bit of difference though. The guy tried lighting little fires on my legs as well, that was a bit weird.
Rubbing nails of two hands on each other said to be good for hair growth.
But don't rub nails of thumb, it enhances growth of mustaches and beard.
I have mat with pointed edges on which one has to walk. It helps to press all accu points. I have observed that it helps. It also helps to increase height.
OK, I give up: what the heck is a flying fox? So far I've found bats and purses. And those purses look too small to cause a shoulder injury!
Artists impression of flying fox:
I've had it on many occasions and definitely have faith in it. If you believe in chakras, energy fields, etc, then accupressure/puncture make perfect sense to me.
I've had some sessions of acupuncture with varying degrees of effect. The best was from an old Chinese guy, it really boosted my energy but I'm not sure if it helped anything else. I've also gone to school and completed a 500 hour training program in Shiatsu massage, I practiced part time for a few years but it never took off. I never really felt much benefit from using pressure points on myself, but found a massage of any kind really positive.
Then there are more recent studies where they compared actual acupuncture with a sham practitioner placing the needles randomly and don't find that acupuncture works any better. They both work better than the control group who got nothing, but it points to the idea that it may be placebo at work. Thinking a treatment works actually causes the body to release chemicals and hormones that can dull pain or heal ailments.
http://www.iflscience.com/health-and-medicine/exercise-better-acupuncture-treat-lower-back-pain/
http://www.dcscience.net/2013/05/30/acupuncture-is-a-theatrical-placebo-the-end-of-a-myth/
I have had a couple of sessions, and have heard of some people for whom it worked. The effect on me was not huge, but then my personal energy is known to be rather torpid.
My guess is that a lot of this complementary therapy stuff works on the placebo effect. The problem is that if you don't believe in it, then it isn't going to work.
Back in the day when I traveled the Brown Rice Circuit (meditation and other social tangents), I knew a lot of people who tried acupuncture/acupressure/shiatsu. Of them all, only one reported that things got worse. The others said the results were either neutral or positive.
I had acupuncture for a bit of arthritis in my neck. Went once a week for a couple of months. Was getting kind of snarky that it wasn't "working." Right up to the moment when it actually did work.
Whether such practices are hocus-pocus or not, the one sure thing you can say for them is that they don't involve taking another goddamned pill and thus messing with the body's natural chemistry. It's not clear to me why western medicine doesn't take acupuncture seriously enough to run the scientific trials that might allow them to say with certainty that it's not worth the powder to blow it to hell. It's a couple of thousand years old so if acupuncture is a scam, you've got to say it's a pretty good one.
I don't know what research has been done on acupuncture, but I think the research on other complementary therapies has been inconclusive.
See this report on homeopathy for example: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10449430
I've tried acupuncture a couple of different times and I didn't see any improvements.
I had a book on acupressure and for the most part it did help except in one area on my arm, I guess I got a little carried away and actually hurt myself - so you don't want to go overboard on pressure. Seems like it's a cross between massage and chiropractic stuff so I don't think you can go wrong - except to press too hard.
I am a Shiatsu practitioner. The pressure point being applied in the top photo is Large Intestine 4 or "The Great Eliminator" and it is advised to never press it in the first three months of pregnancy, because it can cause miscarriage.
I can tell you that acupressure, (and also, acupuncture) over time, can give great relief and be of enormous benefit to the client.
Oh, yes, you can most certainly go wrong.... You can go wrong if you don't know what you're doing, because you need to know, or be able to tell whether the Pressure Point - or 'Tsubo' as it's more accurately called - is either 'full' or 'empty'. Pressure is different according to its state.
I'm not a huge fan of these 'do it yourself' books. I think they can assuredly do more harm than good.
Haha ....This
I'd recommend reading this article I posted. Lots of research has been done and hasn't found much of a positive result. In it, at the start, there is also a link to a pro acupuncture article that went head to head with this one if one is so interested.
http://www.dcscience.net/2013/05/30/acupuncture-is-a-theatrical-placebo-the-end-of-a-myth/
It really depends on the practitioner and what style or school of acupuncture s/he learned. Most practitioners of "Traditional Chinese Medicine" (TCM), which is a system Mao designed, after purging the traditional Taoist practices that really work, don't get results. TCM is actually more about herbs than acupuncture. Then there's the old Taoist tradition, which is what's still taught and practiced in Taiwan and Hong Kong, and here and there in the US by teachers from those countries. That can get fascinatingly wild and wooly; the use cupping, to remove toxins from deep in the muscle tissue after treating an injury, they can even do exorcisms, if there's been trauma or other types of issues. It can get astonishing results. Very cool. And then there's Japanese acupuncture, which is based on the old Taoist Chinese stuff, minus the woo-woo: the "ghost point" treatments (exorcisms). Japanese acupuncture can be very effective.
Lighting little fires on the skin is called moxibustion, and it's used to dispel excess heat in the system, or something like that. The herb that gets burned on the acupuncture point is called "moxa". I have no idea what it is.
An honest practitioner will tell you that if you don't see results within 3-4 weeks, to go find someone else. If you find an acupuncturist who gets results, stick with them. They can treat conditions the insurance-based medical system in any country isn't able to treat. They're a precious resource.
To answer the question about acupressure, I studied acupressure as part of my massage therapist training. I think it can give similar results to acupuncture, but without the needles. So, because it doesn't use needles, it would be preferred by some people, and is ideal for treating kids. It works with the same system of meridians and specific points on the body; it uses the same traditional "science" as acupuncture.
I had acupuncture from a rather elderly Chinese woman. Not so much out of need but cultural curiosity. What caught my attention was her accuracy about my physical health in general with no info at all from me.
I had acupuncture when undergoing treatment for cancer when I was 21. I found it gave me relief from the nausea I had a result of chemo.
But what works for one person may have no effect for another.
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It sounds like you're saying most of what passes for acupuncture isn't much good.
My Mother had acupuncture when she contracted a painful and prolonged bout of shingles. She noted an improvement which lasted for around three days or so, but the pain wasn't static, it moved around her midriff, so it was difficult to contain and - pardon the pun - pinpoint accurately for treatment. However, every time she had treatment, the pain lessened and brought her some relief.
I have practised acupressure on different people.
What I am about to describe may sound a bit 'woo-woo' but it's just the way things happen.
Everyone has different layers of physical energy. We are coated in them, like onion layers and each layer seems to have a different function, in that it's either a manifestation of, or it's a shield to, a specific emotionally-fired aspect of our persona. These have been referred to as auras, and some people can see them.
While I practised shiatsu, I began to see some, although not vibrantly, and terribly full of colour, they just seemed to manifest for a moment or two, but then faded. It was fascinating, because to be honest, I'm a frankly very down-to-earth gal. I don't experience Lucid Dreaming (vis-a-vis another current discussion) it's a total anathema to me and I still don't get what people are talking about. It's rare for me to even remember my dreams, and then, it's just snippets. I'm not one for flights of fancy, and am actually quite cynical on many things, so I never expected to see these energy layers, nor had ever considered them, nor looked for them. In fact, when my teacher mentioned them, in the context of being aware of them during a treatment, I actually wondered how the hell I was ever going to make any progress; it all sounded, well... very "woo-woo" to me!
So when I first began my practice as a student, I was puzzled when the Tutors all began to talk about 'being aware when the energy 'lets you in'.' "Wha.a.a.a.t....? eh? Say again? Oh good god..."
But after some time, even with an apparently willing, eager and expectant recipient, it was patently evident that, no matter how enthusiastic and receptive the person seemed to be - there was a barrier. Like, a block. I literally couldn't put my finger on it, or more precisely, my palm...
See the problem with the Western Mind, is that it has to have a logical, clear-cut, understandable explanation for everything. It demands clarification. A + B MUST equal something logical, otherwise, it's just not acceptable. So look for 'C' because it HAS to be there somewhere.
So, of course as largely western-Minded students, with a history of school or University-level Human Biology behind us, being told to 'be aware when the Energy lets you in' sound really daft. Ridiculous.
Western Education makes no allowance for the Mysterious and Miraculous.
We know that, by the number of studies carried out by Western Scientists, confirming time and time again, what Eastern practitioners have known for aeons: Meditation works.
We know that, by the amount of examination of the Mind, the brain and the Conscious, that Western Scientists want to know. They want to know what Mind is, as opposed to the brain, how it works, where, why and to what levels.
They just need to know.
And in needing to know they are effectively saying A + B MUST equal something logical, otherwise, it's just not acceptable. So look for 'C' because it HAS to be there somewhere.
So there's no room for expansive mystery. It has to be this or this, because of that or the other.
And so, our western minds set to work, palming, cupping, pressing random points ("I dunno... can YOU feel anything?" * shrug * ) Until it became clear, from what our tutors persistently yet patiently conveyed, that we had to work outside of the Mind. In other words, lay aside what we, as western people had learn through Biology. Put it aside. It's valid, pertinent and important. But put your heads aside, and work with what you're doing, freely. Don't think. Follow your hands, and what they feel, and what you feel instinctively, internally...
And then, one day, it happened.
I got it.
So, I'm there, 'connecting' with this happy, unassuming, relaxed and willing participant, who is anticipating a good ol' rub down and massage (I mean, who doesn't love a massage?!) and she's just laying there, so I begin, on her back, by laying one palm across her spine, at heart level, and the other down into the small of her back, just before the upward curve, and you just kneel like that, just for a moment, connecting with the person's energy (apparently.. I mean, I was doing my best, right?!) and suddenly...'phooom'. There it went. The barrier. It just.... let go.
It was as if my hands just dropped down a further half-centimetre, and penetrated a layer of jelly (or jello, to my USA buddies). There was just 'something' that went.
Man. I gave the best Shiatsu I had ever given up to that point. Her 'energy layer' had let me in.
The recipient had not deliberately excluded me. But part of her own close "defence mechanism" had.
It's that personal space that feels uncomfortable and invaded when people stand too close talking to you, you know?
Well, she didn't even know she had it, or that it was present. She was, to all intents and purposes, ready, willing and able, and good to go.
But she sure as hell felt it when it went.
Because she turned her head towards me, and asked - "What the hell was that - ?!"
I explained, as matter-of-factly as I could, that it was just an energy layer that had let me through.
(I think she might have been expecting me to walk on water after that....!)
But I 'got it'.
And the more I practised, the better I understood these energy levels. And a couple of times, I saw them.
It once took me 5 sessions with one guy to eventually convince these layers of his to let me in. But let me in, they eventually did. And from then on, his condition began to improve. And according to his wife, so did his temperament.
Look guys, make of the above, whatever you want.
I understand any cynicism. I get it, I had it too, once.
But hey. It works for me.
I guess I’m more inclined to see acupressure and acupuncture as Mind over Matter, with a bit of pressure in the right place from Matter over Mind/consciousness which in turn puts pressure on the target Matter which vibrates in such a way as to unblock the subatomic particle blockage allowing them to flow naturally/freely…hence the “placebo effect”…."Mind over Matter"
A theory of sorts…( more based I guess, upon scientific/quantum theory)
Form (matter) is made up of subatomic particles and these subatomic particles in the ‘form’ of a sentient being are each coated with consciousness/awareness or if you like a ‘sense of awareness’ (for example you kick your toe, it becomes very aware of the sensation, and due to the ‘karmic’ connection of all the other subatomic particles that make up the “sentient” being ( the karmic glue of cause condition & effect holds it all together ) “Ouch” is the result when they are all in agreement…
And regarding “DIY Self Help” books (or for that matter books of the Buddha Dharma can also fall into this category )…I’m under the impression, that whether or not one benefits from their contents would greatly depend upon the reader’s ability to absorb the information and apply it in such a way as to gain some experiential understanding…hence why, some gain heaps from certain DIY books whilst others who read the same books get little if anything from them…
No doubt ...some so-called DIY "self help" books are not worth the paper they are printed on, and the only people who normally benefit are the authors and their bank balances, by helping them 'selves' to the kind nature of others...
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BTW this is the hand massager I bought, back in the early 1980s, (I've still got it) you can use it in your hands or gently rub it over the soles of your feet...
Um come to think of it I also use to have a pair of Dr Scholls sandals...I remember some people couldn't wear them, wearing them made them pee a lot or they felt weird sensations all over their body...
Different strokes for different folks I guess
Thanks @federica that is a very useful insight
You describe sceptical woo-woo very well.
http://opcoa.st/PdZCj
Is botox and creating trout lips the evil dark path of acupuncture? Looking 'good' whilst being mind sick? Personally I think it is an abomination.
I am very fond of alternative medicine, I once drank a whole bottle of rescue remedy, much to the consternation of the dropper brigade. My experience of shiatsu is very superficial, it was part of the Chinese Yoga I studied.
When you are a lobster needle insensitivity is part of the heritage.
Looks like a kinky dreidel
Get your mind out the gutter
But it's so warm and comfy
Oh, THOSE things! Thanks, I would never have found (or guessed) that! They are all over here, but we call them ziplines. Fun! But I wouldn't want to fall off.
Is acupuncture a scam?
Is God a scam?
Is currency a scam?
Is leadership a scam?
Is civilian control of the military a scam?
Is meditation a scam?
Is standup comedy a scam?
All have been demonstrated to work. All require some level of human belief and participation. But we're humans, aren't we, so what's wrong with believing and participating?
That's the power of reflexology.
There was a time when these sandals caused a sensation too...
They actually ask you, when you buy them, whether you have High BP or heart problems... and they advise you to begin wearing them for 5 minutes the first day, and slowly work up the time, until you can wear them all the time... I did this.
The difference in my own energy levels was quite remarkable. It surprised even cynical li'l ol' me....
Probably quite handy with these swimming around.
They look interesting. Where might I get some from @federica
https://www.kenkoh.co.uk/
They are the same as Dr Scholl's...You're right, you do need time to get use to them...Back in the early 1980s (after gradually getting my body use to wearing them) they became quite comfortable....and from then on, I lived in them...which reminds me I should buy another pair ...But there are a lot of cheap knock offs which no doubt could do more harm than good
Shoes can be fitted with shiatsu insoles. I have some with magnets ... I think the magnets fell out. Gardening and beach clogs make a good comfortable base ...
The magnets effect our magnet field (allegedly)
I wonder if that pampered @Jayantha is going barefoot to inspire us new agey, tree hugging, lobster freeing, tree hugging (already mentioned that), ultra spiritual consumerists?
I had a lot of experience with it when I had a chronic illness, before I knew anything about different schools/styles of acupuncture, that didn't help me at all. I tried a number of practitioners, both ethnic Chinese and western, and none could even diagnose the problem, which was a pretty easy one to diagnose, once I moved to a different state and found a couple of good practitioners. One of the ones who was the oddest (in my previous location) was actually an instructor of acupuncture at the local naturopathic college! Highly recommended, but didn't have a clue.
So when I moved to a town that had 3 acupuncture schools, one of them Japanese, I found a couple of really good practitioners (one young one was a trainee of the older one), and they explained to me about how TCM has taken over the field to a large extent, and I learned all the info I posted here about the history of the development of the 3 styles of it.
I wouldn't want to write off all TCM practitioners, because some of them reach beyond their basic training, and learn other techniques, and become effective practitioners. But I generally advise people to look for doctors of oriental medicine who are either from Taiwan/Hong Kong, or who have studied under people who are from there. Or to look for Japanese acu practitioners, if they can't find the other type.
But yes, I tend to think that TCM is bogus. I even asked one guy who said his main practice was herbs, why he did acupuncture, and he said it was because that's what the clients expect, that's what they want, so he goes through the motions. But what gives results is the herbal concoctions he sold, he said.
But don't misunderstand me; I'm not knocking acupuncture as a science; to the contrary, I'm saying it can be very effective. It can be a life-saver, even, for people who fall through the cracks of the conventional medical system, which is pretty limited, I had the misfortune to find out. But you have to choose your doc/practitioner carefully in order to benefit from it.
It's based on the body's electrical system, which is fascinating. Our bodies are electric, and acupuncture is a science that utilizes that quality of the body. I met an acupuncturist practicing "medical acupuncture", which is accepted by all insurance companies and is a system (with regional variations) developed in Europe in modern times. He started out life as an electrical engineer, but when he discovered acupuncture, he was so fascinated by it, he went back to school to get an MD degree and then learn this medical acupuncture. It involves electrical stimulation of the acupuncture points, which Asian acupuncture doesn't do. Anyway, I'm tickled by the idea of the human body as an example of electrical engineering. Pretty cool.
I was a barefoot marathon runner in lay life, barefoot is the way to go!
you mean THESE type of people? tree hugging hippies and I usually don't get along lol
Things might be easier if you were wearing a knitted Buddha hat.