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What happens if we stop meditating?
lobster
Crusty Veteran
in Meditation
To my amazement I found taking a 'b vitamin' complex produced a similar calming to meditation.
Ah ha ... that will save some time for extra mindfulness [so I thought] BUT [and it is a Beyonce sized BUTT]
formal meditation is far more, far more subtle and important than imagined ...
So ...
after 6 months of very erratic practice I am back on the daily addiction.
Why and what are the differences for me:
- more wisdom, compassion and less trump style tantrums 😇
- definitely more humbled 🤓
- more disciplined
What are the curls, highlights and good hair days for you?
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Well, obviously the world will come to an end — never stop meditating!
But really if you don’t stop meditating and you just carry on, you could be meditating while making tea, while going to the bathroom, while going for a morning run... you might learn to meditate through an entire day.
I think for me, meditation...
And on some really good days it brings me to a point where I can no longer feel my breath and seem disconnected from my senses.
I recently tried the Wim Hof breathing method, he has a growing profile online - rounds of deep inhales and exhales and breath retentions. For me, produces a state of euphoria similar to the deep state of relaxation experienced in Samadhi. In maybe 60% shorter time. Doesn’t have the contemplative and insight aspects of meditation. But the Resultant mental clarity and after affects are there. It’s been quite a revelation. It got me thinking about the Samatha breathing meditation I’d been doing for a couple of years and whether both methods essentially induced a mild hypoxia, same results, different sets of clothes. So was I kidding myself with Samatha re spiritual aspects, when really all I was experiencing was a Simple trick of the breath ? My studies continue !
I think I've managed to convince myself that no matter what F-witchery I get up to, the only existence that is ever available to meditate is in this present but fleeting micro second.
Here, each past second of meditation or its absence becomes surprisingly irrelevant compared to whether I actually meditate in this current one or not.
When a floor needs to be swept clean of dust, a common way of not cleaning that floor is to ignore it or to engage in endless planning on how to best do it whereas meditation is simply the taking up of a broom and sweeping it.
When we stop meditating, our responses to phenomena create deeper states of self-entrenchment.
When we meditate, our responses to phenomena allow for a manifestation of selflessness.
Reading 'Being Nobody, Going Nowhere' is proving to be a salutary lesson in staying present, and how important it is...
I find myself creating scenarios and conversations in my head (I have quite peculiarly always done this) but the difference is that I stop myself and recognise the futility and foolishness of letting my mind wander so far as to remove me entirely from the Present Moment, and right slap-bang-wallop into fantasy-land...
Creating conversations with unseen companions has always been a form of escapism for me, particularly when alone, or left to my own devices, even though other people are in the house.
Now, I am cultivating the habitual ability to still the thoughts and calm the mind, and to let it rest peacefully in Calm Abiding... And I'm finding it quite a gratifying process...
Hey @federica - you do realise we all do that right? 👍😁🙏❤️
Er... squeaks No...?
Not really... I mean, when people create scenarios in their heads and have imaginary conversations with indeterminate characters... it's not something most people share or talk about....
Haha! I do it all the time.....the amount of imaginary arguments I've had with my Dad and ex-wife is actually quite absurd. I win them all of course!
Can one really stop meditating once one really starts???
For me. when I began to meditate, after a while I found the meditative experience started to flow into everyday life ...
Cushion time being like a battery charger, however instead of the batteries gradually becoming weaker over time, the energy increases...Cushion time and daily life blend into one/not two.... so to speak...
I think there comes a time when one crosses the mental threshold, and returns less and less to old habits patterns , but until this point is reached, (YMMV) the mind can and will continue to go back ...to its home away from home habit patterns...
Tis said old habits die hard ...and the self is full of them...
Well apparently from the OP picture of the beautiful and clean couch apparently we remove all the clutter in our house and spend time cleaning and decorating?
Personally I find meditation much easier than all of that work.. jus' kidding
Tee Hee!
You mean we are conversing/expressions only of self? I knew it!
Now do we block or prostrate? In other words are we idling or idolising?
As an imaginary teacher of the Buddha, Allah and the Spaghetti Monster (hallowed be her source) I am notoriously uncertain of reality as a rigid construct ...
To put it another way as the Buddha Might: We are not what we think ...
Cod Bless Us All.
Oh well, naturally I do too. I astonish myself with the rapier wit and flash put-downs, they have nowhere to go with it! Classic!
But in fact as I mentioned, I am slowly weaning myself off such distractions. While I do that, Mind makes no progress.
I'm thinking Progress is preferable to Papanca...
Ya think that imaginary arguments aren't one of the best teachers you could have.
Is there anything in those arguments that doesn't clarify the need for the 4NT & 8 FP.
It amazes me how often folks think that they lack for a personal teacher when our own minds seem chalked to the brim full of inner teachers instantly pointing out why, where, when & how we are attached to anything.
Maybe rather than looking for respite from such conversations we could simply think of them as the bell on a lazy fisherman's fishing pole ringing out the arrival of our next lesson in attachment.
I'm fortunate that it's ringing more often.
You go to hell...
Well when shit happens/Dukkha, one is more likely to succumb to its charm ...
Back to the grind(er)
Monkey see monkey do...
Most of us ... oh all right me ... are Micky Mouse Buddhhists. Convincing ourselves that polishing the papanca ringing tones is making us better. Mostly that is just batter.
So how do we entrap our pseudo buddha mouse?
[please insert cushion under buttocks and I'll tell you - ooh I just did]
https://buddhaweekly.com/if-you-cant-go-outside-go-inside-how-mindfulness-can-help-cope-with-covid-19-12-easy-tips/
I don’t think it’s just you in the Mickey Mouse club, I reckon I am in there too. Irregular practice check, Internet buddhist check, Dharmaist tendencies check... its a very dubious picture we’re building up.
But maybe with the wisdom of crowds we will get somewhere.
Life sometimes changes in a day and with that change comes disruption to schedules.
One of the things I had hoped meditation would help me with is finding the middle way of adaptation. A way to accept change gracefully, neither trying to keep ahead of change nor turning my back.
Right now life is changing quite a bit and some of us are finding disruption.
So I try to find the middle way of adaption. Meditation practice is practice after all. If a sitting mediation schedule is impossible, then there is walking meditation or taking the bus meditation.
In my life I had some similar issues, and I found that disruption is caused by resistance. The more you can accept and let go, the easier it becomes to move past them. But it is a path that requires some maturity and perseverance, to not let it turn into just only ever saying ‘yes’, but a deeper engagement with things.
I love this kind of thread because (chuckle) it leads nowhere. @lobster ityk!
BTW k = kindly; ty is a thank you; I am just I
To clarify, resistance is almost always caused by clinging. The things you hold on to so desperately cause you to form judgments, which cause you to exert effort, which causes turmoil. If you can find out what you are clinging to, it becomes easier to let go, to open the clenched fist.
Real Family-Based Mindfulness
Abandon all hope!
One of the great things about awareness reigning training in Vajrayana is the diversity of practices, tweaks and feedback.
The idea of group mind/sangha is utilised in intensification and learning from others understanding.
For example in formal meditation. The yups and dawns of change are acceptable with grace. If not we may have to relax further or flounder further ...
Talking of fish (flounder) they are one of the auspicious signs of awakening ... and edible too. As mindfulness of vehicle becomes apparent, we can notice the dharma is always present
Cod, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
courage to change the things I can,
and wisdom to know the difference.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serenity_Prayer
Glad this topic has come up as meditation is all over the place at the moment. I’m working from home and have a 2 year old running mental in the house so it’s hard to find some peace and quiet.
At the moment I see that old traits are coming back ie anxious,nervous very reactive as my partner says 🙄 also bad tempered and quick to fly off the handle these aren’t new things for me as I’m struggled with them for some time.
I know if I’m meditating everyday and reading about Buddhism, things get allot better for me personally but I always seem to come back to square 1.
The way I see it the more effort I put into calming the mind and reading(studying Buddhism) the better person I become. It’s just keeping the momentum going is my problem.
If anyone has advice for me it would be greatly appreciated as I feel I’m just aimlessly going through life at the moment.
Thanks
I think @Jpswan2020 that if you can learn to look at your own heart, then you can mindfully observe your own emotional reactions and learn to disentangle them. It makes it far easier to relax and let go of things. One of the key aspects of Buddhism is that it encourages us to become more knowledgeable about our own hearts, rather than avoiding or ignoring.
A monk once told me that it’s very difficult for a lay person to expect to get samadhi or Jhana as we have far too many distractions.
My experience would back that up.
The only time I’ve got anything other than mixed results in meditation was when I was on some form of retreat away from home and family.
@ Jpswan2020
Only within this one present fleeting nano second is a meditation practice possible.
How that will affect your life will simply depend on the priority you give to that effort over everything else.
There is no occurrence within a householder's life that limits your ability to practice save the ones that you decide will limit it.
Moment by moment, the priority that we offer the unlimited potential of our practice is either renewed or not.
If you are looking to find some momentum to your practice, just developing a habituated re-entry into the next possible moment of practice will pretty directly take you there.
I can not help with the 2 year old as I tend to favour a cattle prod as a child rearing device ... [which I believe is illegal]
Now the momentum [also available as a political movement] advice:
mindful nasal breathing
https://www.yogajournal.com/meditation/mindful-breathing-practice-tough-emotions
listening to mantra via headphones
OM MANI PEME HUM
You needn't be a master woodworker to find woodworking rewarding. Accepting the limitations of your commitment level doesn't mean giving up. And I doubt most folks here have hit that plateau in any case.
Find what you can do, and do that. Mindfulness first aid.
All you got is 30 seconds on the toilet? It's better than nothing, and it's not forever.
When it comes to not finding the time to meditate, often the excuse is .."My day is full...I'm too busy...I don't have the time" ....What one is really saying is "My mind is full"...the mind is pre-occupied with what has happened and what could happen and not what's actually happening right now...
There are 24 hours in a day which is 1440 minutes...minus 3 minutes leaves one with 1437 minutes to waste or to pursue other interests like study, work, rest and play... ...
Here's a simple 3 minute guided mindfulness practice...
I began meditation in October. It was great and I kept getting better at longer sessions, kept studying the Dhamma and eventually attended a few group meditation sessions. I liked it so much!
Then.... I stopped in February and it got harder to return. Each day that passed I kept lying to myself, making up new excuses and eventually spent around 2 months in chaos. I realised how confused I was, my mind drifting and moving me from one spot to another carelessly, particularly certain vices.
However, meditation provided me with an insight and perspective -I think also ageing and leaving the early-mid 20s section- that helped me face what I was doing and why I was doing it. I understood it and, instead of being possessed by guilt, I accepted it. The point then was: what was I going to do?
I retook it! And it was hard... but I kept the dhamma study and meditation practice. Now I'm doing one hour minimum in the mornings, and if lazy or "busy" during the morning, I do a 30 minute evening sesh. This latter one is probably one of the greatest discoveries during my path. It helps me to go to sleep, it is so nice! I understand now why some meditators recommended splitting the practice into two sessions minimum.
Meditation is like a gym for me. A gym for my mind to construct a better self....by rejecting the idea of a self.... haha!
@コチシカ
Those morning and evening meditation sessions can truly be a pilgrimage along the path towards suffering's cessation.
A place where above all the other distractions in daily life you say you're going to try to simply face this present time slot of existence with as much acceptance as you can muster.
Pivotal positions of spiritual assessment that can illuminate each moment of existence as not just another chance to part the veils of our own delusiveness, it is in fact the only time when we can ever do such a thing..
From here, any moment in your day, to the degree that one is willing to allow it, can offer its own reflection of what those morning & evening meditation sessions offer.
Serious meditators are constipated?
Push a little harder. (Midwife meditation dharma.) 🤓
Yes well, I have been spending more time with my 70-year-old mother and 83-year-old stepfather now that we are living together, and unfortunately they are very much set in their ways. Whenever I attempt to discuss any kind of Buddhist meditation with them, they say, oh we did all that when we were younger and they refuse to consider it. It’s sad and frustrating.
So in a way these two, who used to be spiritual seekers in their youth, have given up on meditating and on seeking. What happens to them? Well they turn more towards practical matters, she towards dealing with the household and he towards helping her and his memories.
@Kerome
Considering how you have spoken elsewhere in such glowing terms of the open spiritual supportiveness that your parents raised you within, this particular thread must be pretty close for you.
Most people explore spirituality to some degree as part of their investigation of the world. Most eventually find it more challenging to stick with it than they are willing to put up with.
We need only look at ourselves to know how tenacious the roots of our own ignorance can be and how disheartening an eventual capitulation to that momentum must be for any past seeker of the way to be reminded of.
To the degree that one can manifest selflessness as compassion, sympathy, tenderness, benevolence, empathy, love and wisdom is the degree to which you keep those options open for all when the eventual age limitations of self protectiveness come knocking.
It is interesting that the grace that your folks once offered to you, might eventually be the same one that you can return back to them with your care.
I would say it is a blessing. Thank goodness you have that to not only give, but also to rely on, yourself....
Yes indeed, thanks @how. They and their support network are starting to feel the limits of their age. For me it is a question of trying to find a good middle way between all our respective handicaps. I hope to be able to give to them what they will need. But it’s not all going to be plain sailing and it will confront me with a few of my habits too.
Hmmm let me think.....
