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The Holy Life

KeromeKerome Love, love is mysteryThe Continent Veteran

It struck me that Buddha often talks about the holy life in the sutras. But that since we in the west do not have a tradition of going forth, there is not a clear demarcation, a point at which you can say the holy life begins.

For me there was a lengthy period of introspection from 2011 to 2019, almost eight years where I lived by myself and had minimal contact with other people. It was almost like a long retreat, where I meditated a lot and read the dhamma. I can recommend it, in many ways it was good for me.

I notice that now that I live with other people again, I look at them (and my relations to them) differently. It is all part of practice, I notice their emotions and how they arise from their attachments, and I notice my emotions in response, and I see where that comes from. I do think the years of living alone have helped my medativeness.

How do you connect with the holy life?

Shoshin

Comments

  • BunksBunks Australia Veteran

    I am alone about 60% of the time and I have to say, since Covid started, my practice has gone to s**t.

    I need a kick start....

    Shoshinhow
  • howhow Veteran Veteran
    edited August 11

    I've trained both within community and as a hermit just to find that while both had their own advantages and disadvantages, my connection to the "Holy life" in the end was little more than my willingness at any moment to practice with this one breath that is currently cycling through this body. The "holy life" of yesterday or tomorrow are dreams compared to the potential awakening that only this momentary fleeting moment can offer.
    If I was to think that there could be a demarcation between an ordinary life and a holy life, I might look at where selfishness starts to manifest as selflessness.

    lobsterShoshinコチシカRen_in_black
  • personperson Don't believe everything you think the liminal space Veteran

    For me the non holy life on its own is miserable. I have attachments and aversions that keep me from dedicating myself fully to the holy life. Making the holy life an important aspect of my life is honestly more about keeping the misery making effects of the worldly life at bay.

    I connect by consciously keeping it a sizable portion of my daily life intake whether I feel like it or not. At this point though it doesn't take much effort much of it has become habit.

    Though my strings have gone a bit loose on the diet front and have rededicated myself to tightening things up.

    Bunkslobster
  • BunksBunks Australia Veteran

    Thanks @Kerome - this thread is officially my kick start!!

    Blessings to you all <3<3<3

    personlobster
  • ShoshinShoshin No one in particular Nowhere Special Veteran

    The Holy Life
    How do you connect with the holy life?

    On the
    daily, twice a day...
    And the time off the cushion, monitoring/observing the flow of thought patterns throughout the day as I interact with other sentient beings...giving them a gentle holy nudge in the right direction if they start to wander.......

    personBunkslobster
  • BunksBunks Australia Veteran

    Awesome @Shoshin !

    Shoshin
  • ShoshinShoshin No one in particular Nowhere Special Veteran

    I should add that they do wander often, so it's an ongoing thing...

    Bunks
  • lobsterlobster Veteran

    How do you connect with the holy life?

    By:

    • inspiration.
    • goodly company.
    • sharing
    • avoiding pseudo spirituality
    • attention, attention, attention ... aka mindfulness
    • thinking of my ego (the unholy one) in the third person
    • practice fills the Wholes

    Wot you want more?

    • hypnotising the subconscious into positive patterns
    • having reminders eg shrines, buddhas about
    • metta compassion towards others
    • mantra on loops rather than music
    • calling on Buddha helpers eg. Amitabha
    • enjoying virtual calming environments

    You want even more? Find it. Tell us. <3

    ShoshinBunksperson
  • KeromeKerome Love, love is mystery The Continent Veteran

    I know it’s maybe not a topic for these times... everybody lives in the marketplace, commercialism has grown into a huge monster, people are focused on material things. It’s a little bit last century to think about holiness.

  • SuraShineSuraShine South Australia Explorer

    @Bunks said:
    I am alone about 60% of the time and I have to say, since Covid started, my practice has gone to s**t.

    I need a kick start....

    Same. The longer it drags on, the lazier I've gotten. Admittedly as of today we have 0 new cases and only 6 active cases. We are so much luckier than Victoria or NSW. I need to keep reminding myself of that and get back into my practise.

    @Bunks - today in particular has been just horrendous for you guys :anguished: Sending you much love from across the border.

  • BunksBunks Australia Veteran

    @SuraShine said:

    @Bunks said:
    I am alone about 60% of the time and I have to say, since Covid started, my practice has gone to s**t.

    I need a kick start....

    Same. The longer it drags on, the lazier I've gotten. Admittedly as of today we have 0 new cases and only 6 active cases. We are so much luckier than Victoria or NSW. I need to keep reminding myself of that and get back into my practise.

    @Bunks - today in particular has been just horrendous for you guys :anguished: Sending you much love from across the border.

    Thanks @SuraShine! It hasn’t been easy. My parents have seen their grand kids once in 7 months. But what can we do?

    My concern is that there is a slowly growing under current of discontent with the state government here and if this lock down drags on longer than the 6 weeks First mentioned, people are go8ng to stop listening and start ignoring them.

    We will have to wait and see.

    I hope you guys can stay safe and free over there!

  • federicafederica Seeker of the clear blue sky... Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubt Moderator

    @Kerome said:
    I know it’s maybe not a topic for these times... everybody lives in the marketplace, commercialism has grown into a huge monster, people are focused on material things. It’s a little bit last century to think about holiness.

    It's also a Capitalist, Western mind-set... Is there money in it? How successful can you become? What are your promotion prospects? Commission? Incentives...? How will you survive...?

    New York: ..."Whaddya mean you have to 'let go'..? Let go of what? What - ?!? All your belongings?! Are you MAD - ?! What about your chic, bijou loft apartment? ...A WOODEN CABIN?! Good grief, you're insane..!
    And your Armani/Gucci/Gaultier/Lagerfeld/Beaton designer wear...? A robe?!!? Oh, 2-colour? Ochre and maroon, eh? OH, WELL THAT'S OK THEN!!! What dafuq...!?
    At least Prunella, your GF is... Whaddya mean, you've broken up - ?! Oh that's just perfect!!
    I'm sorry darling, I need to lie down in a dark room, with a freezing flannel on my face, I'm getting one of my infernal headaches....!"

    Indonesia: "Enjoy your time as a monk, my son! See you in a year! And if you stay longer, many blessings to you!"

    lobsterBunksNerida
  • howhow Veteran Veteran

    Sometimes I am helped in remembering that..
    our successes in making our way down the Buddhist road towards suffering's cessation lies less bombastically through the worlds representations of meditative achievements and failures but instead lies more simply in how tenaciously any one of us can practice with every little step taken in our daily lives towards a manifestation of that Buddhist teaching.
    Here, the world's endless faces of suffering simply illuminate where the path towards sufferings cessation lies, and where it does not.

    Ren_in_blackBunkslobsterperson
  • lobsterlobster Veteran

    It’s a little bit last century to think about holiness.

    In many dharma views there is no holiness separate from common decency. Some would go further and have no time or affinity with holiness or spirituality. Feeling they are a distraction from avoiding dukha and increasing sukha.

    In my personal view avoiding Karen behavour, promoting social justice and voluntary simplicity is The New Way.
    https://pairedlife.com/etiquette/What-is-a-Karen-and-How-Can-I-Avoid-Being-One

    Free Your Mind

    howBunksFosdickShoshin
  • KeromeKerome Love, love is mystery The Continent Veteran
    edited August 13

    Do you think that people still respect holiness? Certainly where I live there is not so much regard for holiness or those kinds of lifestyles. There seems to be a definite division in attitude according to people’s backgrounds.

    @lobster said:
    In many dharma views there is no holiness separate from common decency. Some would go further and have no time or affinity with holiness or spirituality.

    I feel that we should somehow acknowledge those who make an effort to look after our spiritual lives. Whether that is by calling them holy remains to be seen.

  • lobsterlobster Veteran

    I feel that we should somehow acknowledge those who make an effort to look after our spiritual lives.

    No need.

    • The fakes want followers
    • The useless want to be led
    • The genuine are busy. Acknowledgement irrelevant ...

    You got time for a spiritual life? Is that a tik-tok thing?

    Wait ... did I go wrong again :3

    how
  • KeromeKerome Love, love is mystery The Continent Veteran

    @lobster said:

    • The fakes want followers
    • The useless want to be led
    • The genuine are busy. Acknowledgement irrelevant ...

    I’m not quite certain whether I’m useless or genuine in that case. Certainly not busy.

    You got time for a spiritual life? Is that a tik-tok thing?

    Lots of time for indoor pursuits with Covid.

  • personperson Don't believe everything you think the liminal space Veteran

    Thich Naht Hahn has that quote, that in a boat in a storm if one person remains calm it helps others remain calm.

    Some other western Dharma teacher, can't remember who, talked about how its valuable to have places in the world that can remind people that there is another way to live. That there is a greater peace to be had. You could say a place to find peace from the storms of our mind.

    I think for most of the world living a good, honest life, conscious of and helpful to others is a noble life that makes the world a better place. I think the worlds mystical traditions are pointing at something more transcendent and I think the value of those paths are worth preserving and protecting. I'd like there to still be room for both in the world. The holy places serve as examples and inspiration for the rest of us. I'd worry that without them we'd soon enough forget the value of kindness and peace in the pursuit of our material, political aims.

    As for the label holy, there is probably too much baggage to that word in the secular west. I think there is a fair bit of traction with spiritual but not religious.

    lobsterhow
  • personperson Don't believe everything you think the liminal space Veteran
    edited August 13

    @lobster said:
    In my personal view avoiding Karen behavour, promoting social justice and voluntary simplicity is The A New Way.
    https://pairedlife.com/etiquette/What-is-a-Karen-and-How-Can-I-Avoid-Being-One

    Free Your Mind

    That's better, a small but important adjustment to help avoid a case of "meet the new boss, same as the old boss"

    lobster
  • lobsterlobster Veteran

    I liked @federica response.

    Find your holy. Find your life. Which is the fantasy? Expiry date embedded ...

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