Buddhism, women and the goddess
Jeroen
Luminous beings are we, not this crude matterNetherlands Veteran
During my reading into Campbell I came across some very interesting areas of mythology to do with the goddess, birth and creation myths. It seems that in early societies it was probably matriarchal, only the mother of a child was known, and as women gave birth to the children so the goddess gave birth to creation. So it seems that women had a very key role in early spirituality, and may also have been the inventors of language, which makes sense because gathering is a much more language-intensive area than hunting which the men would be doing.
That these early tribes had a spiritual life is illustrated by the presence of grave goods, items for the buried person to use in the afterlife. This practice happened as early as two hundred thousand years ago, and it was extended also to the animals that were hunted. There have been found burials of skulls of early mammals, caught in the hunt, in ritualistic arrangements.
When the Buddha came along 2500 years ago there had already been a long period of patriarchy and agricultural settlement. That he allowed women into his sangha was already forward thinking for the time, but he was wrong in thinking that it would have halved the time his movement would last. There are still men and women practicing the Dhamma today.
But in a way I think this idea of the goddess will come again, that somehow in the future there will be an expression of spirituality going back to the early days of the Mother Goddess which will also contain shades of the Dhamma.
Comments
I have yet to have gender personally arise in my meditation as something specifically limiting.
The human condition expresses itself throughout the ages as our pandering of one polarity over another whereas spiritual adulthood offers a transcendence of such habituated limitations. This is a puddle of muddy water that no amount of stirring will clear. Its solution, like any component of suffering's cause, simply lies in a transcendence of whatever we cling to, reject, or ignore so that our interactions with any phenomena are met without those previously limiting preconditions.
We can either stir this muddy puddle or allow our self-made sediments to settle along their obscurations.
Why slumber in past & future questions when only this present moment offers the solution?
Well, the Buddha’s sangha still isn’t filled with women teachers, and imposes a lot of additional rules on bikkhuni’s. It’s not exactly a level playing field, or one in which women seem to be valued. How many senior Tibetans for example are women? In the west things are a little better, but only a little.
Perhaps at some point we will have another suffragette movement. In so many religious movements women are not valued or treated equally, while they make up half the earth’s population, it seems very unfair.
If a religious movement doesn't treat people fairly, stop empowering them with your participation. Stop supporting meditation teachers of either gender who have continued to hobble their own practices with cultural prejudices.
If you need a teacher, keep searching for one that practices in a way that you'd feel comfortable emulating.
If you have to choose between a teacher or a school that is popular and a teacher or a school that broadly manifests compassion, tenderness, sympathy, loving kindness, empathy, benevolence & wisdom, choose the latter.
The thing is, “compassion, tenderness, sympathy, loving kindness, empathy” are all very feminine qualities, you’d say naturally occurring. I’d say that women need to learn different things from men in the process to an enlightened life.
If you divide the population of the world up 50/50 by just about any parameter you'll have an uneven split between men and women. Compassion, tenderness, sympathy, loving kindness, empathy will no doubt end up with a greater share of women.
I think the next move to say that women are more of that quality and men are less is where we go wrong. It may only be a 70/30 or 60/40 split and there are plenty of men who are more of whatever. There is also often a greater variation within all women or men than there is between men and women.
Putting masculine or feminine traits onto men or women is old, traditional gender stereotyping. Or as the Krishnamurti meme @Jeroen posted elsewhere, dividing people up into identity groups is a form of violence.
There are many women teachers in the Mahayana - a significant number. Some are high-ranking and influential within their respective traditions. There are even women who are lineage holders. My Ngondro vows were conferred by a woman.
Some of the most important meditational deities are female (Tara, Vajrayogini, etc.), and the sacred feminine is also important.
I'm not sure what you mean by filled? Is there some number you're thinking about?
I know. Members of the Vajra Sangha have additional rules that apply to them only
How many Theravedans?
Do you mean Tibetan Buddhists, or ethnic Tibetans?
On a local level, there's really not that much of a problem and problem areas that have recently been brought to light are being aggressively dealt with.
Perhaps.
Indeed.
In Wicca the stages are Maiden, Goddess, Crone. The Men are designated Youth, Warrior, Sage. In fact, these designations from both genders are fluid.
In alchemy, hermaphrodite is considered an ideal.
In some Sufism, women are designated as men, so the limited don't think their circles are just for orgies.
The first modern liberal female Rabbi was secretly watching and learning Kabbalah from her father's teacher meetings. She had to be made a Rabbi. Yi ha!
The world is Dukkha as the Dukini said to the Shakyamuni ...
Sukha!
https://www.yogajournal.com/yoga-101/how-to-find-sukha-in-your-practice-and-your-life/
Half.
Of course you can say men and women are obviously different, and it might be so that women are less well suited to the spiritual path. That is true, and in part the reason for this topic. The Buddha made it more difficult for women to be nuns.
But then I think because of their biology women are less well suited to be celibate nuns, they are made to mother the next generation. That is why the Mother Goddess religion is more well suited to them.
And of course celibacy for men works so well. Look at the Catholic Church's history.....
I'm sorry I just find that statement incredibly offensive to women. Having followed a Mother Goddess path myself in my youth (Wicca), and being devoted to Mary as a child growing up Catholic, I can say I unequivocally agree that matriachal religions are more loving and peaceful than the current patriachal "Big 3".
But women can and do engage in celibacy quite successfully. I spent 8 years being celibate by choice and still managed to nurture and raise my daughter well. Perhaps you meant to word that differently?
The Dharma as I have come to understand it, goes 'beyond' the culturally conditioned hang ups which sadly are still prevalent today in some Buddhist traditions, schools and sects, which favour male over female ...
From what I gather, in the ultimate sense Dharma practice itself transcends gender & sex......however, in the conventional world old habits die hard, some male practitioners still 'cling' to the "us & them" mentality of separateness/division...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guanyin#:~:text=In Chinese mythology, Guanyin (觀音,uncertainty, despair, and fear.
Hmmm ....
Seems kind of .... arbitrary ...... , but good enough for purposes of discussion.
I didn't suggest that, but we must admit to there being certain differences.
I don't get your connection between population and suitability.
Additional rules do not necessarily mean more difficulty. AS I mentioned before, I have rules placed up on me that don't always apply to other Buddhists
Really? I'd wager there are a lot of women who would vigorously take issue with that statement
Non sequitur.
Mahayana Buddhism, represents Campbell's idea of the monomyth well and gives room for the feminine to manifest. Tara and Quan Yin are excellent examples of the divine feminine within Buddhism. Their practices are open to all regardless of gender, as well.
Buddhism also has numerous convents. Even a few co-ed communities
In my experience with the Mahayana, there are at least equal numbers of both men and women. Women are elected and selected to positions of importance in both teaching and administration. I've also found that women tend to gravitate towards feminine deity practices. If memory serves, the first 3-year retreat held at Vajra Vidya in Crestone, CO, had more women than men in the class.
I'm not sure where your info about women in Buddhism comes from, but, it's a lot different from my experience.
It seems people are quick to take offense… but never mind, it’s not important.
I'm not offended. None intended. None taken. I'm not inclined to being quick to take offense, but I read something that doesn't seem quite right.
It was important enough to post in the first place, wasn't it?
You've posted things in this thread, that don't seem quite right, in my experience. I'm offering discussion about what you posted.
It’s all good, feel free to think and discuss
Thus have I heard: According to some Chinese theory, women are 99% spiritual and 1% non-spiritual.
Men are 1% Spiritual and 99% non-spiritual.
However, it is just as difficult for a woman to overcome her final 1%, as it is for a man to overcome his entire 99%.
Make of that what you will.
I have also heard that for a heterosexual woman, it is hard to grasp that her dating pool (the remaining 50% of the population) also contains her only natural constant predator.
I have often endured prejudice, either unconsciously or deliberately applied.
And the news that the Buddha was reluctant to permit women into the sangha, is hearsay.
I believe he had no prejudice.
I also believe many of his followers - who submitted his teachings in writing - were prejudiced. So they imposed their own inclinations on the matter.
That some Schools make things more difficult for women is no surprise. It's been going on for millennia, and is still going on today.
I mean, the #MeToo movement is relatively recent, isn't it?
The Catholic church has an inhumane and appalling record of its treatment of women.
Westerners object and criticise the Muslim stance on how Islam treats women, yet under their very noses, Socially, in Commerce, and Religion, The West is just as culpable.
It's getting tiresome.
We require of male sympathisers to talk less, and act more.
Thanks.
May all beings be free of ignorance and discrimination.
I personally like and know three female Buddhist teachers: Ayya Vayama, Lama Tsondru and Damcho.
I have noticed a dominance of men, but I am open always to wise people, do not care about their sex. It is unfortunate people still discriminate on these grounds, getting further away from wisdom.
Peace!
This goes into consideration: I have received an email from my first teacher, a template but still.. He is announcing a series of Zoom talks to learn from the Sakyong directly.
I think, in line of what Fede has said, requieres action. I have deleted the e-mail. Incredible they listen to an ordinary being pretending to be Enlightened. And yes, if you mistreat others, particularly weaker individuals, you are FAR from the other shore you chant about.
Anyway.. Rant ends
Today, we continue the ongoing movement to the understanding and reality that everyone, regardless of "social standing", sex, age, ethnicity or belief, is worthy of respect. From the Buddhist standpoint, we say that everyone possesses the Ninth conscience aka Buddha. Hence all, in that regard, are equal.
Of course, we also possess all the other conditions (worlds). What our process of awakening to our Buddha nature, emerging from our fog of ignorance is the practice of the Way. This emergence is what is referred to as achieving Nirvana or Enlightenment or "becoming" a Buddha. This is so simple yet so difficult and so necessary.
When a Buddhist condemns the selfishness, deceit, and bigotry of a person, it is the condemnation of his or her words, deeds and/or actions which devalue and harm others.
A 19th century Japanese buddhist and political activist stated thus: "Hate the action, not the person."
Today, we see the ancients called goddesses and gods as the those functions, (thoughts, actions, words, things) which enable and support us in our efforts and endeavors to better ourselves, to seeking to awaken as persons and in out lives. Devils and demons are the functions that block, obstruct, hinder, and weaken our endeavors and lead us to the darkness and push us toward the worlds of anger, animality, hunger, hell.
Peace to all
At the Buddhist centre I attend are several female leaders. My Green Tara Empowerment and Avolekiteshvara Empowerment were under Buddhist nun Kelsang Monlam, the Resident Teacher of Khedrubje Kadampa Buddhist Centre. Which is where I attend.