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What place does surrender have in Buddhism?

KeromeKerome Love, love is mysteryThe Continent Veteran

I think of the major teachings — impermanence, letting go of things, not-self — and then I wonder about surrender. I’ve seen mention in a few places of being in control of yourself, which would point to not surrendering, but at the same time it feels like there is so much letting go going on in that list that surrender kind of feels appropriate. If there is no self, what is there to surrender, even?

But on a practical level, a lot of Buddhist monastics, the people we look to as exemplars of study and practice, seem very together. I seem to ave a hard time sorting out some conflicting messages on this topic.

Carameltail

Comments

  • lobsterlobster Veteran Veteran

    Shoshin[Deleted User]
  • ShoshinShoshin No one in particular Nowhere Special Veteran
    edited September 26

    @Kerome said:
    .If there is no self, what is there to surrender, even?

    I think that one first needs to explore the age old question of "Who or what am I ? "

    I'm under the impression, once there is a realisation ( experiential understanding ) of anatta...then one surrenders one self "atta or atman" to "anatta or anatman" non-self...Well something like that :)


    "I" surrender ....the false sense of a permanently abiding separate self...

    Surrender-let go-drop it.... all eventually lead one to the same realisation...of not twoness...

    lobsterKeromeDavid
  • DavidDavid some guy Veteran

    When I think of surrender I think of the act of giving up that which may no longer serve.

    That covers quite a lot of ground right there but mostly I think of simple awareness where I surrender my anger and other defilements.

    Shoshin
  • ShoshinShoshin No one in particular Nowhere Special Veteran

    What place does surrender have in Buddhism?

    Mind turned outwards lost in its projection =Samsara

    Eventually one surrenders to the other world view....

    Mind turned inwards recognising its true nature =Nirvana

    lobster
  • lobsterlobster Veteran Veteran

    That covers quite a lot of ground right there but mostly I think of simple awareness where I surrender my anger and other defilements.

    Exactly so.
    Good place to start. Conflictive emotions [swearing at nothing myself earlier this evening], karmic loopings serving no one, especially us ...
    We do not hold tightly to these defilements but boy do they demonise our being [speaking for my conflicted self]

    So now can we compassionately forgive, ourselves too?
    You bet ... I mean ... count on it ...

    I surrender to the thee jewels ... eh three jewels ... forgive me ...
    https://tricycle.org/trikedaily/i-take-refuge-buddha/

  • JeffreyJeffrey Veteran Veteran

    Mesmerized by the huge variety of perceptions, which are like the illusory reflections of the moon in water, beings wander endlessly in samsara’s vicious cycle.
    ~ Jigme Lingpa

  • KeromeKerome Love, love is mystery The Continent Veteran

    So... do we never surrender to samsara?

  • JeffreyJeffrey Veteran Veteran

    I think the fitting answer?? is that samsara doesn't provide gain without loss. So then what else is there?

    lobster
  • lobsterlobster Veteran Veteran

    Good answer @Jeffrey

    Samsara is still karmic - as much loss as gain. Awakening transcends loss and gain. It is non-being, unattached to time, place and description.

    In the way @Kerome asks perhaps we might say, ego and being or letting go to our inclinations is just swallowing of samaras subtle expansion ...

  • pegembarapegembara Veteran Veteran
    edited September 30

    Surrender is everything. When you surrender, you are letting go of everything. Your thoughts, opinions, wishes, preferences, loved ones, your very body etc. The result is "peace which passeth all understanding".

    "This is peace, this is exquisite — the resolution of all fabrications, the relinquishment of all acquisitions, the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Nibbana.".

    LET GO(D)

    lobster
  • CarameltailCarameltail Veteran UK Veteran

    We accept reality as what it is, and not fight against its flow. And it includes non attachment to it. We percieve the thoughts and feelings and let them be.
    However that doesn't mean you don't take the chance to change things when you can if it is beneficial. Being aware of reality is to really be in tune with things and letting things manifest in a healthy way. It is to be aware of the bigger picture and not to put yourself away in a box.

    lobster
  • taiyakitaiyaki Veteran Veteran

    The whole premise of Buddhism is pretty much surrender.

    When you take refuge for instance: you take refuge in the Buddha, the Dharma, and the Sangha.

    Mostly we take refuge to ourselves, our opinions, our beliefs and stores, our traumas and our pains, and our desires.

    So Buddhism is asking us to surrender all of that.

    lobsterShoshin
  • ShoshinShoshin No one in particular Nowhere Special Veteran
    edited October 13

    @Kerome said:
    So... do we never surrender to samsara?

    Many people (Buddhist newbe practitioners and non Buddhists) are caught up in self deceit, where a strong sense of the karmic driven self dominates...and as we know Samsara is self generated...hence . .... being a case of the Self Associated Momentum Stopping Awareness's Realised Awakening....

    In other words the stronger the sense of self the more one surrenders to Samsara...The weaker the sense of self the more one surrenders to Nirvana...

    well something along those lines :) ...

    And when it comes to Samsara...we are all in the same boat on the same raft....

    lobster
  • lobsterlobster Veteran Veteran
    edited October 14

    Well said @Shoshin

    Buddhism can be temporarily misconstrued. 😱 Samsara can be accepted as dukkha but to transcend into Nirvana/extinction we have to initially rebel against our tendency to embrace harmful behavour in ourselves and others ... 🦞

    For example my SamSara lobster tendencies to eat sentient fish, seek hedonistic luvliness and generally be undisciplined 🤗 is balanced by a practiced intention to:

    • improve my diet 🥦
    • exercise my many limbs 👣🦵🏼🦶
    • save at least the Mahayana world🕴

    I do not embrace/absorb. 🙏🏽

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