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How does a person qualify to be identified as a Buddhist?
Skeeterkb
Explorer
Are there a core set of principles that all Buddhists agree upon? Does it require membership in a school or group? Where is the line between being interested in and becoming a Buddhist? Does one have to renounce beliefs from outside Buddhism?
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Comments
Yes and No, No, wherever you draw it, not if you don't want to, but, that may be a debatable.
You draw the line. It may be helpful for you to give some thought as to whether you are a religious Buddhist or a philosophical Buddhist.
Hang around. Learn the lingo. Get a kool costume. Brownie points for ritual.
And then, when you decide to be serious...
Practice.
Note the hardly discernible suggestion that 'ritual '...( undefined ) is not 'serious'..
In reality @Skeetrkb several schools of Buddhism consider that ritual properly understood is far more effective than verbalisations when communicating subtle ideas.
But there is no standard way to approach the Buddha's teaching. In the end it is what works for you.
@skeeterkb
Yes as Citta says in some Buddhism the only way to enlightenment is through the blessings of the lineage. That is all the sangha of Buddhas and Bodhisattvas who are carrying you. You have a relationship to your teacher and sangha and Buddha that is called samaya.
"I'm a Buddhist" generally works. I think all forms of Buddhism teach that life is transient and interdependently conditioned, and suffering is mind-made (that's where karma comes in, and skillful karma leads toward peace). Most lay Buddhists accept the Five Precepts, even if they slip up sometimes.
You don't really have to renounce other beliefs. There are Buddhists that are also Christians and Jews (and probably other religions). Buddhism is really about concentrating on your own mind, and your own actions, so it can co-exist with a lot of other beliefs.
good Zen POV. ..
...
To the OP: If the rituals float your raft...go for it. Just remember to take what you've learned ( whatever school/lineage/belief system) and apply it to your everyday interaction in the world.
Seeing as some people around here get away with being all kinds of rigid about The Precepts, my view on what qualifies someone needs to be heard.
Again.
A Buddhist is defined by one thing and one thing only. Refuge. If you take refuge in the Buddha, Dharma, and Sangha, then you are a Buddhist. If you don't take refuge, then you're not a Buddhist.
You can still call yourself a Buddhist, if that's what you want, but remember, taping a handful of feathers to your butt doesn't make you a chicken.
I've said it before...and I'll say it again. There are alot of people that mix it...my current Teacher even wrote a book...but I still don't understand how it can be done... From a theist/one god POV. ...going back and forth from 'out there' to 'in here'
I just try to remember who mixes it and if I'm talking to that person....I keep the advice general. (shrugs) ... I'm not saying it can't be done...I'm saying I don't know HOW it's done.
I agree that it's the refuge. Formal or not..... rituals or not...my vote is the refuge vows.
Hey @Chaz, define "refuge" for newcomer's sakes, and btw your description of what a Buddhist is, to me anyway, hits all the high points across the traditions and 'works'.
I was gonna say wearing a saffron armband with a crimson B on it.
I haven't taken refuge because my teacher is in Wales and I am in USA. I have studied and meditated for 14 years though with 8 of those with my Sangha. I guess I am not a Buddhist haha.
I also know the secret handshake
Taking refuge.
http://www.parami.org/duta/buddhist.htm
(Excellent site talks about it ^ )
Happy practicing!
as my good friend who is a pastry chef once shared with me "Always cook happy"
and welcome, to this funky crossroads replete with shininess and love
IMO, one is a Buddhist if they accept these four truths:
All compounded things are impermanent.
All emotions are pain.
All things have no inherent existence.
Nirvana is beyond concepts.
These truths are known as the four seals.
Different schools within Buddhism have different starting points and different definitions of core values.
But when somebody asks me about "core set of principles" in Buddhism, the Four Noble Truths and the Noble Eightfold Path spring automatically to mind.
And though here on the site nobody will quite agree on that point -we have failed to reach a unanimous agreement several times before- I have just finished a book by HH the Dalai Lama called "The Four Noble Truths," on which he states "The Four Noble Truths are the very foundation of the Buddhist teaching."
He goes as far as to say that "if you don't understand the Four Noble Truths, and if you have not experienced the truth of this teaching personally, it is impossible to practise Buddha Dharma."
The other two basic principles that he makes a point to present when introducing the Buddhist teachings are the interdependent nature of reality (dependent origination), and the principle of non-violence.
"Technically, we become a Buddhist when we decide to take Refuge in the Three Jewels, and when we generate bodhichitta, which is known as compassion, the altruistic mind, or our good heart. The Three Jewels of Buddhism are the Buddha; the Dharma, his teaching; and the Sangha or community of practitioners."
As to membership in a group, becoming a Buddhist or renouncing other beliefs, it's a matter of personal choice, dependent on the degree of your commitment with the doctrine of the Buddha.
If you read, study, see the principles of Buddhism working in your life, and decide that yes, this is your calling, you might want to join a group, take the vows and find that Buddhism happens to complement other beliefs you adhere to, or rather feel that this is your exclusive path.
Some people define themselves a Christian Buddhists or Jewish Buddhists.
Personally, I can't quite see how you can make the Buddhist/theistic religion-mix work for you, but you can try.
A lot of times the four noble truths are disguised in instructions for life. For example my teachers husband wrote a book about them Never Turn Away but he never says 1 suffering 2 cause 3 cessation 4 path. You can find it if you are looking for instance he says 'xx' is cessation. But it is not like a sutra using repition. Instead it asks you to find his teachings in real life with more natural to us useage of language. He focuses more on the effect of our hearts and our learning rather than a conceptual understanding of the 4NT. I fail at explaining.
Each Buddhist has their own view, and each tradition has its own criteria.
According to the Pali Canon, the textual basis for Theravada, for example, a lay follower is one who's gone to the Buddha, Dhamma, and Sangha for refuge [as guides], and is committed to the practice according to the Dhamma. And a virtuous lay follower is one who "abstains from destroying living beings; abstains from taking what is not given; abstains from sexual misconduct; abstains from lying; and abstains from wine, liquor and intoxicants that are causes for heedlessness" (AN 8.25).
So anyone who takes the Buddha, his teachings (Dhamma), and those who have 'practiced well' (Sangha) as guides and makes an internal commitment to put the teachings themselves into practice is by definition a Buddhist lay follower.
This 'going for refuge' can be an externally or internally made commitment. One can go through all the external motions of going to a temple and formally taking the three refuges and receiving the precepts, or one can even do it in front of a Buddha statue at home if they so choose, but neither's really a requirement. It's the underlying intention that truly matters.
Ultimately, though, it's really up to you whether you feel comfortable calling yourself a Buddhist or just someone interested in certain aspects of Buddhism.
"Refuge" is seen as a place of shelter or protection.
In the context of being a Buddhist it can be a ritual one undergoes. I've never met someone who didn't think their participation was anything less than a wonderful and powerful experience. However, it's not necessary. What's important is taking refuge - a real and honest commitment to the Buddha, Dharma, and Sangha as a refuge.
Then, of course, theres the Super Secret Vajra Decoder Ring .......
[lobster wracks his brain for commonality] N o o o o o . . . maybe something about compassion . . . perhaps . . .
Well you could start and finish as a 'non-Buddhist', which might involve joining or participating . . .
Becoming eh? A required arising? Perhaps.
As if we bring nothing to the table . . . beliefs even in dharma gradually fall to gnosis and the experiential
To the Buddha for refuge I go
To the Dharma for refuge I go
To the Sangha for refuge I go
Mr Cushion is nonplussed. Might be one of those 'Non-Buddhists' . . .
Decoder ring and handshake details to follow . . .
4 Noble truths.
Believe in karma and that Buddha's teaching is able to end all suffering.
A broad question to start with. So a broad answer is required. I will try my best.
I think there are two fundamental "must have" constitutes you as a Buddhist.
1) Believe in Buddha
2) Believe in Buddha's teachings
One must satisfy both to qualify as a Buddhist. I hear you say; Hold on, I get the first, but how we know the Buddha's teachings? To make matters more complex, there are many flavors of Buddhist teachings to shop for. Well, basically there are only two types of main branches;
1) Theravada
2) Mahayana
Mahayana said to be a branch heavily modified and influenced by different east Asian cultures thus many sub flavors (such as Zen) exists today. Theravada, on the other-hand thrived in south-east-Asian countries and often considered to practice the original Tripitaka, as written down in Sri Lanka, some two thousand years ago. There is a third sector, called vajrayana which was spread in east india.
So if you choose to follow on set of teachings, then you satisfy the basic requirements to become a stereotype Buddhist.
In lack of either, you can hardly become a Buddhist, due to the simple fact that wonder or hitchhiking wont necessarily make you a Olympiad.
That's one view.
Even though I have taken refuge, for me the defining moment of "I'm a Buddhist" came when I was able to make the claim, and answer at least some basic questions to those who will ask "oh? What does that mean? What do you believe?" Prior to that, I wasn't sure how to answer the question at all, and it made me feel like I wasn't "there" enough to say I was a Buddhist. But everyone experiences different.
Initially, it was like winning a house. Someone gives you the key and you wander around in wonder thinking "wow, this is my house!" Now I live here. It's home.
If you are Christian or a Muslim, you have prerequisites to become one. Such as baptism, going to church, wear a cross, believe in god, circumcision, worship 5 times a day, go to the mosque etc. Failing to do so have adverse consequane from the respective church or mosque.
But for a Buddhist, there are no such requirements. You can choose to go to the temple, choose to worship Buddhist statue, or even left your own devices on breaking 5 Precepts (abstain from; taking the lives of living beings, taking that which is not given, sexual misconduct, telling falsehoods, distilled and fermented intoxicants), which in principle makes a Buddhist a Buddhist.
One can argue Buddhism is either a religion or a philosophy. Buddhism is everybody's, so its your right customize to fit, still calling a Buddhist. That's what basically happed in the Mahayana Tradition, and to a lesser part Theravada Tradition over time.
What we said and done, a Buddhist is not a person who struck by a lightning and become enlightened. Nor is a person who accidentally happen to enlighten by reading or experimenting on something else.
Buddhist Enlightenment may be occasionally achieved by anybody without knowing what they were doing, just as a pure accident. But for everybody else, its a dedicated path to be taken, and might take many life-times to achieve. Meditation is the only path, according to Buddhist text.
That's what I'd say happened to Eckhart Tolle. He had a major existential crisis that his mind couldn't deal with, except by seeing the truth.
Even meditation must be done under supervision. Unless you do not know what you are doing, it can make you go crazy. Marie Curie died of aplastic anemia caused by radiation exposure, since nobody happens to found radioactivity before her. Luckily for us, Buddhism and meditation was founded many thousand years ago.
Do you have some references for that?
Yes I do. But do not ask me to give the contact details of those
That's kind of an extreme statement. Certain types of meditation can have ill effects on certain members of the population, yes. That doesn't mean anyone who meditates is at risk for such complications. People who undertake advanced teachings with no previous experience of knowledge or training are at higher risk. Simply sitting and following the breath is unlikely to cause adverse effects in the average person.
Ok, then for all intents and purposes it's unsubstantiated.
@vinlyn
I can give you a hint. First signs of meditation gone wrong is that they think they are enlightened. The fist stage of Anapanasathi (control of breath) meditation is the state of total calmness, which makes you weightless. A teacher is needed there to discuss these stages and not to lure on these focus on the objectives. Its easy to get lost in the wild.
That is a far cry from saying, "...it can make you go crazy."
Something I identify with Buddhism is a little humility, and not thinking I know all the answers.
lol The Buddha must've been crazy then.
If you have time, Google for it.
That's just one indication only. One claim to have a PhD and one showing the certificate is two different things.
I am not sure what you meant to say here. If you need to know more about meditation gone wrong, google for it. Coming from a Buddhist background, grown in such a culture, I have seen many people who proclaim higher consciousness, where as they seems nuts by all norms of society. If you ever been to a meditation practice (a proper one, not the commodity meditation parlous), that's the first thing they warn you about. The harm done by those who do not pay attention to read or follow prior knowledge, does more harm to the Buddhism and to themselves.
Okay, what Buddhist background and culture did you come from?
Do you really want me to put my birth birth certificate on a public forum
put your email here, so I will send you the details....
No one is asking for a birth certificate. But, sure, I'll send you my email address.
I feel there is a commonality. The capacity to listen to the teachings, through literature, personal contact or today the internet. To lessen the effects of 'monkey mind' and its relative 'monkey gibbering' takes practice.
The Christian equivalent is perhaps in part here:
http://biblehub.com/john/3-30.htm
Foundationally, as people pointed out, four noble truths!
Fundamentally, seeing Buddha Shakyamuni as the embodiment of our greatest potential. Proof that the path and the teachings work.
The more you study, the deeper your faith will grow. The deeper your faith, the clearer the teachings will be.
Please bicker not, for it has little to do with how remarkable and fortunate we are to have the opportunity to live and practice in a time of ease and access to the teachings. Rare indeed is our situation! May we put it to truly meaningful use!
First Learn, then question
Start from questions, you will never learn
Kia Ora,
"The most essential method which includes all other methods is to behold the mind- The mind is the root from which all things grow- If you can understand the mind, everything else is included !"
BodhiDharma
By taking refuge in the mind and you can be Buddhist, Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Taoist, everybody or nobody...It matters not to the mind....
Metta Shoshin
But that isn't Buddhist refuge.
If Buddha or Jesus beamed onto the planet right now, chances are, both (and any like them) would be considered crazy by our societal norms. Societal norms are the farthest thing I just myself or others by. I try to judge them by the content of their person, not in comparing them to what society deems normal, since our society is fairly ill as an entity. It's not a valid representation of the whole of humanity by any means.
'He who kisses the joy as it flies,
lives in eternity's sunrise'
>
Please do not make set comments you cannot then back up.
Thanks,
Just to be fair, kavee did send me an email with lots of information. Unfortunately, we had a rather unpleasant conversation...off this site.
The regulations still stands, however fair you're being (and I'm grateful for the clarification).
As for the 'unpleasant conversation..off this site'... that's a matter betwen you guys.
Just as long as it doesn't happen 'on site'....
.
Thank you so much for all the sharing and teaching from the heart in this thread. I feel the love. I have studies to do and experiences yet to ponder. I think at this moment the continuation of my journey offers me the best present label as simply a sojourner. One hindrance is there are no Buddhist teachers/groups closer than a 2 hour drive for me. My meditation, first begun 35 years go is to focus on my breathing and cease all words from my mind... except for an occasional random word that I allow to float away like a leaf in a stream. This leads to a refreshingly serene state. Doesn't seem to make me crazy or crazier than I already am. LOL
If this is on the "meditation gone wrong" thing, then its a horrible act I do if I choose to share the contact details of such. There are often things we experience, discuss and retain from pointing to individuals involved. It is not ethical to ask contact details of individuals in the first place. There are plenty of articles on internet, if you want to read, take it or leave it is entirely up to you.
If you need concrete evidence for everything you pursue, then the world is lot limited to you I am afraid.