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When I think of Donald I also think of the miracle of 'change' and how a person can shift their perspective under the 'right' conditions...I'm also reminded that it's not the actual person/being, (the aggregates) it's the "behaviour" that arises from the causes and conditions...
Miracles do happen and are happening all the time... "Anicca" and the impermanent nature of all things (including human nature)
'It’s OK to freak out, grieve, and vent for a while. Hold each others’ hands. Then we can get back to work, as always, for the good.' - Norman Fischer
'So please, stop and look deeply, and let’s work together in not building a contentious future, but a generative one. And let’s not pretend we know, but be open and learn; let’s bear witness to what is happening in our country, in our world, and take wise, compassionate, and courageous responsibility. Let’s reach through differences, listen deeply, and “give no fear.”
Here are the four great vows of the Bodhisattvas in community:
Creations are numberless, we vow to free them.
Delusions are inexhaustible, we vow to transform them.
Reality is Boundless, we vow to perceive it.
The awakened way is unsurpassable, we vow to embody it.
In view that circumstances can't be changed, this is a time to brace ourselves for the best and not give in to thoughts of despondency.
Personally, I have meditated double, done several rounds of mala and snuggled up in the couch with some awesome Dharma books and several mugs of green tea.
I don't bother to watch the news any more, but limit myself to change my tiny lot in the world.
Hopefully all that positive energy of us all working together can make a difference one day.
Like any shock, it's important to talk through our emotions of grief and anger and fear. This is a fantastic safe place to do that. Once we get centered again, then we can let go of the tension and remember to breathe.
I was more upset and angry yesterday than I was the previous day, but today is better. Extra taking care of myself, time outside, time with loved ones. Sent many messages to friends who need extra support. Lavender tea, healthy food, extra meditation, restoration yoga.
He's apparently no longer seeking a full repeal of Obamacare. There are things he realized, after meeting with Obama, that need to remain, but also that things needs to be fixed. I agree with that. We will see what he brings to the table. He looked scared to death when he met with Obama and hopefully it's settling in what he's about to take on and his responsibilities. I am waiting for him to step up and say something about the things going on in his name.
That and the Mexico wall were 2 of his biggest campaign promises and already one has changed. We'll see what happens when his fans find out the wall won't become a reality and is really just a euphemism for fixing gaps in immigration rather than stopping it and building walls to keep every non-American, non-Christian out.
I sent a message to a close friend and he said "As a gay man, I am horrified. Election night was one of the worst nights in a long time. But it's like a car accident, as horrified as you are you kind of want to see what happens next while praying no one gets hurt."
1
personDon't believe everything you thinkThe liminal spaceVeteran
edited November 2016
@karasti said:
He looked scared to death when he met with Obama and hopefully it's settling in what he's about to take on and his responsibilities. I am waiting for him to step up and say something about the things going on in his name.
I may be seeing what I want to see but I think I've noticed things in his body language and demeanor that says he realizes this isn't a game anymore and the weight and responsibility of what he got himself into is sinking in. Fingers crossed actually being president causes him to grow up in a hurry.
Also, it is really scary hearing about some of the aggressive racial incidents that are being reported in the name of Trump. Hopefully their moment in the sun will now let us see the racism that does exist so we can stamp it out.
@karasti said:
He looked scared to death when he met with Obama and hopefully it's settling in what he's about to take on and his responsibilities. I am waiting for him to step up and say something about the things going on in his name.
I may be seeing what I want to see but I think I've noticed things in his body language and demeanor that says he realizes this isn't a game anymore and the weight and responsibility of what he got himself into is sinking in. Fingers crossed actually being president causes him to grow up in a hurry.
Also, it is really scary hearing about some of the aggressive racial incidents that are being reported in the name of Trump. Hopefully their moment in the sun will now let us see the racism that does exist so we can stamp it out.
Yeah, I myself wondered if he ever expected to win. And the racial incidents are VERY alarming! It's not just the incidents per se. It's the mentality behind them; those people are assuming that the police will allow hate crimes with impunity, and that the judicial system will be "theirs" and on their side, as well. That's what's more alarming.
BTW, does anyone know if any of those perpetrators were arrested? Hate crimes incur a harsher sentence.
We used the vote. Hillary got the majority of those votes. So much for that.
I'm rediscovering the healing power of cheeseburgers, fried chicken and lots and lots of wine. Before this election, I was a vegan that almost never drank. Whatever it takes to get a little space from the darkness. I happily found a kitchen towel that was buried in the bottom of a drawer that says "Give me coffee to change the things I can and wine for the things I can't". Nice mantra.
Actually, I am pretty much over the escaping (and the cows and chickens are very happy about that). While still shocked and sad, life is about change, and hanging onto what once was is a good way to suffer. Do I know what my next move will be? Not at all, but I have decided that the best decision is to make no decision. I have some plans and one particular thing I started, but overall I am just standing pat until I process everything. I suspect that in the end we can best deal w/ this catastrophe by remaining as calm as possible and using mindfulness as much as possible. It does help, and not just in my personal life.
There's also wisdom in getting really, really mad and experiencing what we feel at our deepest levels so that we can let go of it and move on. If we don't get fully in touch w/ the anger that I am sure all of us are feeling, we carry it around w/ us all the time. Nothing like a good laugh too, and going to hear some live music is healing. Does that change the situation? No, it changes me, at least temporarily. I have very, very little control about the situation we are in. There's hate, racism, anger, and violence everywhere, as much as we don't want to hear that. Unless I moved to a tiny desert island or surrounded myself w/ cats, which is actually not a bad idea, what is going down is going down in all places to one extent or another. This is what happens when ego runs the world.
For myself, one of the most frustrating things is that you can't tell who is who. In the 60's and 70's you knew who your "tribe" was right away. The hair, the clothes, the smoke, the music. Now Trump supporters look just like the liberals! I guess in a way that may be good, but I much prefer the old way. You knew where you stood w/ just a glance. There were NO long haired, pot smoking, Rolling Stones listening, pro war, pro establishment people back then. Now everyone wears a T-shirt, a baseball cap and has cut their hair short. Maybe that's telling....a society that stresses conformity is more fascist. Even if we THINK we made these decisions to dress and look as we do, society actually made those decisions for us. Most of us just don't want to stand out and look different, while years ago we reveled in it.
He needs to address this stuff. He can't not know it's happening. I'm working on just being present, as usual. I'm not going to look into january or 2 or 4 years from now to assume life will have taken a horrifically tragic turn. he's already down an about face on several of his campaign promises. I hope there are more so he ends up more middle road. Sounds familiar, lol. For now, I want to see him address the issues going on and help assure the people. That's his job. Obama did well with that aspect. Trump has big shoes to fill.
@karasti said:
He needs to address this stuff. He can't not know it's happening. I'm working on just being present, as usual. I'm not going to look into january or 2 or 4 years from now to assume life will have taken a horrifically tragic turn. he's already down an about face on several of his campaign promises. I hope there are more so he ends up more middle road. Sounds familiar, lol. For now, I want to see him address the issues going on and help assure the people. That's his job. Obama did well with that aspect. Trump has big shoes to fill.
I may be reading too much into it, but I think I'm seeing that in him. He appears to know that now that he's somehow gotten himself elected president, he needs to do some very fast growing up. Inauguration day is really, really soon. He immediately started, in his victory speech, to try to reassure the rest of the planet that he isn't the insane loon his campaign rhetoric would indicate. But he needs to address social issues at home too.
One of his advisers or campaign people (?) was asked about it today and said his campaign stuff was all "election talk" just like his conversations were "locker room talk." I have no doubt that is true, as it is true for most politicians. But there is usually some truth in all of that, too. And just because it happens doesn't mean it is ok. I am curious to see what happens, but I am trying to be cautious as I don't want to suddenly believe he's not so bad after the campaign he ran. He said, and did some truly awful stuff, and if he did it all in the name of getting elected and it wasn't' true, I don't know if that makes it better or not. Especially after he focused so much on how crooked and lying Hillary was. I was highly disappointed in the entire election season, since all they did was fight each other in horrible ways, barely addressed issues, mostly didn't address the citizens, and then they both come out on election night all civil and cooperative. I'd rather that than the alternative, but still. Why can't they bring that persona and those speeches to the whole election?
I hope for our country's sake that he's not as bad as he lead us to believe. But that people behave that way to get elected...and it works...I don't even know what to do with that.
DJ tRump the rapper, is the last pResident Evil. I find hymn funny. His hair is funny, his swagger is funny, his unworkable manifestation is funny. He has made history. The first AfricanImmigrant non native American gangsta sociopath to be laffed into the oval office. Export him back to Scotland or his consorts Slovenia (wherever that is).
Nicola Sturgeon, the well known bonny fish and Empress of Scottishland (part of Europe allegedly), will grab him by the genitalia and lead him straight into golfing retirement ...
I find that I have no idea what the truth is. Not that we ever truly know, but possibilities of how Trump will govern run the gamut. I hope for the best for obvious reasons. I hope he fixes some of our bigger problems and leaves the other stuff he talked about alone. But he hurt and frightened a lot of people with his "campaign rhetoric" and people aren't just going to forgive him overnight because he said it was election talk. He hasn't even acknowledged that what he said was wrong and apologized to those people. I know a lot of people are calling for his impeachment, and with his civil trials, it is possible. However, then Mike Pence will take over and I'd rather have Trump. But Mike Pence is truly scary in his religious beliefs. I would not want him leading the country. Now that Trump is in, I hope nothing happens to allow Pence to take over.
@Vastmind said:
Yes, what Dakini said. The mentality!
The KKK has started planning victory parades here and in NC.
The public cheers/signs of 'white power' is everywhere right now...college and high school games, even.
When is he going to address this? Will he? If he doesn't...what then?
This shit is serious.
Scary stuff! I wonder if there will be a public response. In the past, neo-Nazi parades have been met with crowd of protesters/hecklers. That's important, to send a message.
@karasti said:
I find that I have no idea what the truth is. Not that we ever truly know, but possibilities of how Trump will govern run the gamut. I hope for the best for obvious reasons. I hope he fixes some of our bigger problems and leaves the other stuff he talked about alone. But he hurt and frightened a lot of people with his "campaign rhetoric" and people aren't just going to forgive him overnight because he said it was election talk. He hasn't even acknowledged that what he said was wrong and apologized to those people. I know a lot of people are calling for his impeachment, and with his civil trials, it is possible. However, then Mike Pence will take over and I'd rather have Trump. But Mike Pence is truly scary in his religious beliefs. I would not want him leading the country. Now that Trump is in, I hope nothing happens to allow Pence to take over.
I don't know anything about Mike Pence's religious beliefs. I don't know anything about him at all. Could you elaborate, briefly? (Not too much detail, or it could ruin my Sunday morning, lol)
DJ tRump the rapper, is the last pResident Evil. I find hymn funny. His hair is funny, his swagger is funny, his unworkable manifestation is funny. He has made history. The first AfricanImmigrant non native American gangsta sociopath to be laffed into the oval office. Export him back to Scotland or his consorts Slovenia (wherever that is).
Nicola Sturgeon, the well known bonny fish and Empress of Scottishland (part of Europe allegedly), will grab him by the genitalia and lead him straight into golfing retirement ...
I don't think jokes about grabbing people in the unmentionables is funny, in view of the fact that school boys have been grabbing girls there, and saying, "If a President can do it, I can!" This is sexual assault. I hope those boys were given a "time out" from school for a few days, but IMO the police should have been called, and charges filed. It is not a casual matter.
@Dakini He doesn't believe in evolution and gave a big speech in the House to demand creationism in schools. He signed a bill into law last year allowing businesses to discriminate against LGBT people based on religious beliefs. Wants to scrap Roe v Wade. Voted against almost every environment law put up to congress. Voted for a law that would have allowed illegal immigrants seeking medical care to be detained at the hospital. He is basically against everything that we have done to move forward for civil and equal rights for minorities. There's a lot more, but you can of course find them without me ruining your day by typing them all out, LOL.
I have a gut feeling that I need to go a state that is run by Democrats. Right now I'm in St Pete, which is one of the few liberal places in Florida, but the county we are in went solidly for Trump. I am seeing a lot more aggressiveness and smugness in people here. It's cold in New Mexico now, so I may wait till fall, put a tenant in my place, and go see if it is where I now need to be. Or I may do a little work on the place now and rent it out while the snowbird season is just starting and just brave the cold in Albuquerque. I am not sure.
I think there is a lot of denial about the repercussions of this New Regime taking over the Federal government at all levels, and I don't understand why. It is what it is, and they plan on doing exactly what they said they would do. All the right wing lunatics that supported his candidacy are going to be feeling emboldened to act out now, and I foresee something very bad happening in America. Why wouldn't it is the question? Simple cause and effect at work.
At today's lunch at my Shambhala sangha after our meditation there was absolutely no mention of the election from anyone, and people just seem to be treating it as if nothing happened, which I think is a big mistake. But then almost to a person they are all white and upper middle class folks, and this is basically how it was at the Zen centers that I went to over the course of 20 years. They won't feel the discrimination and fear that minorities feel.
Not to compare this to what the Dali Lama fled from in Tibet, but it could be eerily similar here if someone is the "wrong" color, the wrong sexual persuasion, or speaks out and says the wrong thing. These people do not brook argument or other people's views, and you cannot reason w/ them. Ryan appears even more scary than Pence. How do you think they will feel about a bunch of liberal "godless" Buddhists? Even the Dali Lama was prevented from speaking to Congress by right wing Southern Christian fundamentalists during Obama's tenure. They claimed he was a god less devil worshiper. You can't make this stuff up.
OMG, what a horrible train wreck! The US is already the laughing stock of the world when the topic of creationism in education comes up. I was half kidding when I posted on another forum that soon, evolution will be kicked out of the curriculum in favor of creationism. I had no idea there was a very real possibility that would happen!
I'm left bewildered as to how a modern society could flip back and forth from progressing toward an enlightened, equality and human rights-based citizenry to a medieval, repressive, witch-hunting polity. Is this 2016, or is it 1250, during the Crusades?
I don't think people are in denial. As the well known Buddhist saying goes: If you can do something, do it. If you can't, don't waste your time worrying. NO one knows where this is going to go. No one I know is accepting it. But stepping back and watching with caution, hopeful but expecting nothing. We don't know what the repercussions will be, he's going back on his promises every day. As far as the election results, we can only wait and see. We cannot control anything but our own actions and reactions. People not panicking isn't a sign of denial or resignation. But a realization of what we can actually have a voice in and make a difference in. And that we cannot respond to something that hasn't happened yet. Everyone wants Trump impeached. Pence is worse. Don't hope for that route.
Well at least one of the 2 appointments today is beyond concerning. Sigh. Many calling it an emergency but again, what can we do? I wonder what the typical non-tea party republican thinks of Bannon. Ugh.
For the record...and to be fair...the NC GOP has responded to the KKK parade:
'"We are disgusted and condemn this extremist ideology and associated actions in the strongest possible terms," NC GOP Chairman Robin Hayes said in a statement provided to CNN. "These acts and thought processes are no reflection of the heartbeat of this great country and are counter to the efforts to make America great again. We stand with the Democratic Party in calling these out-of-state troublemakers to go home."
And....
'Trump's campaign quickly condemned the parade, saying, "Mr. Trump and his team continue to disavow these groups and individuals and strongly condemn their message of hate," according to Trump's spokeswoman, Hope Hicks.'
That's not good enough for me. Not a spokesperson/statement. He needs to stand up and say it himself. Own it.
3
federicaSeeker of the clear blue sky...Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubtModerator
He chose a man who admits he is one of the alt-right leaders and who is an admitted anti-Semite and otherwise. He's the CEO of Breitbart which is like Fox News on crack. I am not impressed with that selection at all, but that backround info (that I have see so far) comes from Shaun King who generally does his homework but is fairly biased as well. Priebus seems to be a bit more middle of the road. But Steve Barron may be reason for concern considering he got one of the top jobs and will be advising Trump.
Trump needs to get on tv and talk to the people. He didn't do it during the debates, and he's not doing it now. Really, him, Obama and Hillary should all do it as a group.
Did anyone watch the 60mins interview? I thought it was on now but I think I missed it and got the time zones wrong. This is from an article about it. So Trump says he'll stand up and tell people to stop it. It came across to me as "you are ruining my claim to make us great again. Staaaaahp it!"
Trump said he's seen "a very small amount" -- including "one or two instances" -- of racial slurs being directed at minorities, particularly in largely white schools, since his election.
"I would say don't do it, that's terrible, because I'm going to bring this country together," Trump said.
Told that Latinos and Muslims are facing harassment, he said: "I am so saddened to hear that. And I say, 'Stop it.' If it -- if it helps, I will say this, and I will say right to the cameras: 'Stop it.'"
^^. Telling people 'not to be naughty' or shoot their mouth off, clearly works. Not.
Now what Trumpy? LOL
In the UK as Mr Brexit Farage's political 'party' dissolves into the joke it always was, he still pretends ... the grown ups now have to mend the mess ...
In a similar way America is in a holding period. Where a mouth with hair is realised as no solution ...
Don't you know the people lighting things on fire, teaching their kids to hate other kids, and graffiting hate messages sit down after dinner to watch 60 minutes?
He also said he might not get an investigator for Clinton because the Clintons are very nice people. What? He was friends with them a very long time. He was a democrat for a long time. I'm not sure what kind of a Frankenstein he is.
I went to my sangha meeting today for the first time in several weeks-busy with kids on the weekends lately our hosts were gone traveling. i am so glad I went. We practiced tonglen together, which was lovely. We had a good, civil discussion. There were a lot of tears over sharing experiences, including our host losing a very good friend to a difference in politics. We listened to this. Hopefully the link works. It is very good. By a teacher from the US who was in Spain the day after the election. Worth a listen, not too long. Maybe 15 minutes or so. Click the play button on the black bar at the top. Turn it up a fair bit, it's on the quiet side
@karasti said:
Don't you know the people lighting things on fire, teaching their kids to hate other kids, and graffiting hate messages sit down after dinner to watch 60 minutes?
He also said he might not get an investigator for Clinton because the Clintons are very nice people. What? He was friends with them a very long time. He was a democrat for a long time. I'm not sure what kind of a Frankenstein he is.
Yeah, in Michael Moore's Trumpland film, he has a couple of clips of Trump saying very nice things about Hillary. During the Lewinsky scandal, someone, or maybe some comedy show (Jay Leno?), IDK, pulled a gag, and asked Trump if he'd date Hillary after the (assumed) divorce. He gave a long answer about how she'll hang in there, she's tough, and she's faithful and devoted to Bill, and they'll survive. She'll do fine, she'll stick with him, he said. And on another occasion, he was asked closer to the early part of the campaign, to say something nice about her. And he said she's a fighter, she doesn't give up.
So it seems that he actually likes her, and has known her fairly well for a long time. So I'm not surprised that it came out in the interview that he's been friends with the Clintons since back in their day, if not before.
I missed the show. I hope to catch it when they put it up on youtube.
I'm starting to wonder if he mistook the campaign for another reality show, and that all the bluster and outrageousness was for the cameras, as if the campaign were staged, just entertainment. If that's how he was aiming it, I think he really did the country a disservice. Look at all the ugly forces that performance unleashed. It was a stupid, irresponsible thing to do. Except it got him votes. Shameless. Anything to sell his brand.
3
JeroenLuminous beings are we, not this crude matterNetherlandsVeteran
That was the impression I got from the election as well - that he was playing to the crowd, and that his promises weren't worth the paper they were written on. The problem is, the public actually liked his empty words, and he will likely now be shown up as a bit of a hollow sham where a lot of the public thought they were getting a man of action.
This article in the Independent may get a lot of play...
To go from the divisive, extreme figure that he portrayed himself as during the election to a unifying president is quite a switch, and the kind of people he is appointing are certainly not helping matters.
I've been wondering why I haven't seen much in the way of real concern or any concrete plans of action about the Trump win in my Shambhala sangha until yesterday I read of a term that makes sense.......latte liberals!
Yeah, my sangha did the tonglen thing too, and there was a certain amount of requisite hand wringing and complaining. I left in disgust at this point. My Zen training just won't put up w/ all the whining. The group, to a person, is really all about talking and not doing, and I want to see some doing because talk is cheap and easy and doesn't cost anything in terms of risk or commitment. Same w/ sitting on a cushion doing tonglen meditation. I am sorry, but to me this is just phoniness and for a feel good sort of showing of solidarity (that's what I saw, I have no idea what is going on anywhere else except where it is happening in front of my own eyes).
I left another time when one of the senior teachers made a statement after our meditation. It was after there had been protests due to a white officer killing yet another unarmed black man, and she said "when we look deep inside ourselves we understand that white people are just afraid of black people". I looked at my wife, who was the only black face in a sea of white, and thought, that's totally missing the point here isn't it? No one is afraid of Linda, and if someone is automatically afraid of someone because of the color of their skin, that is prejudicial and racist. I just do not get these well off, monied whites that mainly populate American Buddhist places.
Waking up today, there was the same depressing feeling that has been there since Wednesday, and a sense that no matter what we do, something has fundamentally changed in this country. Just yesterday at the ck out counter of a particularly upscale and yuppie Publix grocery store, the guy at the register asked me automatically "how are you doing?' and I truthfully answered "Well, after Wednesday morning, that question has taken on new meaning hasn't it? So I'm just not gonna say nuthin" . That's all I said, and the guy behind me w/ the Oakley sunglasses propped up on his required baseball cap stood back in order to distance himself from me and just stared w/ his arms crossed in a very hateful way. No one can tell me that the people that support Donald Trump are kind or reasonable people, they are what they are.
If you are so bent on action, then why are waiting for someone else to tell you what to do? Perhaps no one is forming actions because there IS nothing to do just now. Things are coming together, depending where you look. But whining that no one is doing anything is whining just the same.
Tonglen is about changing the attitude/energy/whatever in ourselves so our actions in the world are more focused on helping rather than hurting. It's not some sort of voodoo magic from The Green Mile. If you are unhappy and in disagreement with the Shambhala ways, why don't you leave instead of whining? You just seem to be complaining a lot about others complaining. People are commiserating and sharing right now, trying to understand what is going on and where to go. Just few answers are available. It's only been a week. Everyone will grieve and go through the process of understanding and coming to action differently than you. You don't get to tell them they are wrong.
Just as much as i put responsibility on the DNC for what happened with the democrats, some of that blame on Trump's side goes to the RNC. Many of them would have supported a better candidate but that's not what they got. Just like DNC gave us Clinton. I don't believe in her warmongering, lying ways. But I voted for her anyhow. My father in law is not a hateful, homophobic, racist man. But he voted for Trump anyways. Obviously I wish he wouldn't have, but his conservatism runs as deep in him as my liberalism does in me, and there was as much chance he'd vote for Clinton as there was I'd vote for Trump. Our parties pitted us against each other and put MANY of us in a position of voting for a horrible candidate just in an attempt to keep another horrible candidate out. Perhaps it would have been more responsible NOT to vote. But that is hardly what we are led to believe about our voting rights and anyone who doesn't vote is basically shamed. So we're given a message that we're better off voting for a bad candidate than not voting at all.
The thing is, @smarino Trump didn't create these people. He behaved in a way that allowed them to think their harmful thoughts and actions were ok. He has immense responsibility in that. But we needed to know we had so many of these people to deal with before we could move forward. As a friend of mine says, taking a step (or more) backwards really sucks. but, it's by stepping back that we get a better view and can gain perspective before we can move meaningfully forward.
2
personDon't believe everything you thinkThe liminal spaceVeteran
@karasti said:
As a friend of mine says, taking a step (or more) backwards really sucks. but, it's by stepping back that we get a better view and can gain perspective before we can move meaningfully forward.
Reminds me of the Martin Luther King Jr quote, "The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends towards justice."
Progress isn't always a straight line. The two party system sets up a dynamic of power swinging back and forth. In some ways I think that is a good and healthy thing too. I don't think either side is perfect with a flawless ideology that if endlessly put in place means utopia. Too much communalism and the value of the individual is lost, too much individualism and the value of the community is lost.
4
personDon't believe everything you thinkThe liminal spaceVeteran
Politics is really one of those issues that pushes our buttons and causes us to loose perspective.
@smarino Here's some advice from a forum post I came across recently that might help
In my experience, anger that is directed toward another is nearly always simply another form of fear. Something has "offended" or threatened some part of our ego and it is reacting to that. When I am in a meditative state on a cushion or out and about in mindfulness, it's hard to imagine being angry. Things are only what they are, and there is no opportunity for anger in that realm. Only when my ego comes into play is anger going to be there. My ego seems to be all about fear.
If it's anger at myself, it can be useful in motivating me to change my behavior. Many, many times I have felt that anger toward someone else was justified, but when I cooled down later I realized that it didn't need to play out that way.
It's dangerous to have pat answers or fixed ideas on this or anything else though. If someone were to grab my finger and repeatedly force it into a fire I would feel anger at them, and I don't really see where that would not be unjustified. Every situation is unique. Even if it has happened a thousand times before, it is still the first time that particular situation has occurred. So we should always do what is appropriate at that particular moment in time, and I could see how anger might theoretically be appropriate in certain situations. Like most of life's challenges, it just depends. It's situational, not fixed.
But still, I think that anger, justified or not, originates from fear. That was the original question..... what is it? I got off track there a bit. For that, I am angry at myself for being inattentive, and also grateful that I caught it :]
Accept the outcome of democracy and get on with it. You can't change it, only live with its consequences and carry on with your own life as best you can.
May seem harsh and I admit I haven't read all the posts above. There's just so much negativity and scaremongering. It was the same here with Brexit; I voted against but accept the majority decision and don't give it a second thought now.
"Get over it" is not an option when the environment is threatened - as are women, gays, South Americans, blacks and muslims, the poor and older people..... WTF is there to get over? It's not a little ouchie that will heal itself -- those will be attacks on actual people, now, in the near future and in the distant future (environment).
What to do? Within the next 3 months find a cause that it is dear to your heart and that you will want to work for, protecting and defending it. This will give you access to a community of like-minded people who will act with other like-minded folks to form a network. It will come together.
Dealing with Trump will be difficult because he is unpredictable and will lie as before, making it all about him, good and bad. None of the issues matter to him, he will want to appeal to his selected crowd for each of his "projects" and will want to gain approval almost at random. He has no conscience since he is a narcissist, and will, as before, spin his comments whichever way - and get away with it because those who should learn about him are not willing to listen.
No point in targeting him, really. Instead, focus on the issues and those inside and outside government who support him/his views, and try to get their ear.
The people in govt will want to be re-elected and cannot side with Trump 100% since he is a flip-flopper and they will have to justify flip-flopping with him. Reasonable Republicans will hopefully voice discent and do what they can to provide damage control.
As for voices from abroad -- you just don't understand how much this hurts. It's like your home has been invaded and you are blindsided by a sinister, cold burst of air that wants to destroy your personal and extended comfort zone and your (already limited) sense of harmony that you have managed to establish. That's why people are upset. If it's not your house, you don't know how it feels - you just see the rationale of what happened. Try empathy.
And beyond that -- sadly, if the US struggles, so does the rest of the world. Don't just sit back and pretend you are removed from the danger. We are going to have climate change deniers in office who will increase fossil fuel consumption. The polar ice will melt and water levels will rise everywhere! Say goodbye to your coast line and big harbor cities - your grandkids will inherit a very painful struggle and huge losses.
Everyone abroad better wake up and join concerned US citizens in reigning in these short-sighted policy makers.
@possibilities said:
"Get over it" is not an option when the environment is threatened - as are women, gays, South Americans, blacks and muslims, the poor and older people..... WTF is there to get over?
I'm having a bad time at work. This morning in my meditation I thought - what will fighting bring? what will egoic reactions bring? - more fighting, more ego. So I decided to own all the hurt and it's amazing. I feel so much more empowered, compassionate, caring. And my feeling is that this is a fundamentally more powerful approach - people can't listen to rage, it just encourages a slam in the face. Love is unbearably human and it touches people much further down.
So, I'd encourage you to start with owning all your feelings - this will clear the mind to see what actions are most helpful. By owning all your feelings, you're releasing the attachment, stickiness, hooked nature of the trance, and this is a contracted space. After you own the hurt, frustration, disappointment, despair etc, then the path forward will become clear.
My thoughts are similar to @possibilities when people keep saying to get over it. This isn't a junior high break up or having to accept your favorite actor didn't win the award. This has the potential to be a life changing thing for a lot of people. I know people right now who are afraid to leave their houses. I have friends who have been victims of attacks (most of them nonviolent but every bit invasive).
However, as is always the case, recognizing what we can and cannot do is key. It doesn't mean, (and I don't think @federica meant it this way) to pretend nothing is happening. It means let go of what you cannot control. And then focus on where you can be of assistance. Do something where you can. Don't just sit pissed off about what you can't. It's hard to do that right now because there simply isn't a lot to be done. But you can reach out to threatened communities and ask how you can help. You can support people you know feel concerned. You can keep on your own politicians and make sure they speak up. We can't do much, but some of them can and they are much more likely to do so when they hear from a persistent flow of their constituents. Do what you can. Leave the rest. There is nothing else that can be done. Sitting and wallowing in anger isn't doing anyone any good and is only increasing the divide as we continue to argue with each other about an event that is OVER.
I agree that the typical confrontational approach should be softened - especially on a one-to-one basis. Conversations that end in frustration and anger are pointless and self-defeating. This is where our Buddhist thought patterns can help to at least point this out and calm situations that would otherwise deteriorate,
Coalition building on any scale will be important - and will have lasting effects into the future. This will neutralize the effects of the opponents tactic (consciously or unconsciously applied) to divide and conquer.
That type of (class)warfare seems to be part of our DNA now and special efforts are needed to recognise and limit the impact of trying to split us up. (This was common knowledge during labor struggles but those have been eliminated with the elimination of unions.)
@SpinyNorman said:
What I find helpful is having days where I don't look at news at all!
I don't watch the news. Most days I don't even read it on the internet.
As far as I can figure out, it's misery or conjecture about misery.
2
personDon't believe everything you thinkThe liminal spaceVeteran
@possibilities said:
I agree that the typical confrontational approach should be softened - especially on a one-to-one basis. Conversations that end in frustration and anger are pointless and self-defeating. This is where our Buddhist thought patterns can help to at least point this out and calm situations that would otherwise deteriorate,
Coalition building on any scale will be important - and will have lasting effects into the future. This will neutralize the effects of the opponents tactic (consciously or unconsciously applied) to divide and conquer.
That type of (class)warfare seems to be part of our DNA now and special efforts are needed to recognise and limit the impact of trying to split us up. (This was common knowledge during labor struggles but those have been eliminated with the elimination of unions.)
Figure out who shares your goals.
The worst thing to me isn't that conservatives are in power it's that we hate each other and can't work together to find a way forward. All the fighting has brought governing almost to a halt so we can't solve our problems.
Each side thinks they have thought it through and come to the best ideas. What we don't see is that what we actually do is start with a moral intuition about the world and then build up the ideas on how to carry that intuition out. One way I've heard it explained is that people are on a continuum of being strict and strong or soft and nurturing, it's about strengths and weaknesses, not right and wrong. In parenting for example people have a style that is more one or the other but in practice both are needed in different circumstances. Politics takes those styles and turns them into hardened identities, so if someone disagrees with your politics it's not an idea they disagree with it is you, yourself they have a problem with.
It's so poisonous and the sides are so entrenched and invested in doing things this way I don't see how to get out of it other than rebuilding from catastrophe. All I can do is work on pulling myself out of the quagmire and maybe show and explain to others. It's not about victory over the other side, it's about loving and understanding the other side and maybe ultimately about realizing there is no other side.
The outrage du jour, ladies and gents, is that a big Trump supporter, a manager of his largest political campaign funds, said on FOX news that he would instate the Muslim registry proposal, starting with those who apply abroad for US visas. To justify this, he cited the WWII internment camps the US forced Japanese Americans to move into, calling this a "precedent" for the Muslim registry proposal. Even the FOX news reporter was appalled.
On Wednesday, Carl Higbie, a spokesperson for the pro-Trump Great America PAC, defended the proposed registry of Muslims by citing World War II Japanese-American internment camps while speaking with Fox News’s Megyn Kelly.
From an article on National Public Radio's Democracy Now! program and website.
And btw, Clinton is ahead of Trump now by 2 million votes and counting, a greater margin than the one by which Kennedy won.
I've seen a lot of people calling for everyone to register, if that happens, as a Muslim. He also outrght lied today, taking credit for his election saving jobs at Kentucky ford plant that was going to move to Mexico. Except it was never going to happen. He said he talked to one of the Ford family members and he said he wouldn't move the plant. But it never happened. I know lying before he even takes office is a good trait in a president. Sigh.
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federicaSeeker of the clear blue sky...Its better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak out and remove all doubtModerator
The frustrating part is not knowing how crazy he and the Republican congress are going to get. The potential is there, mitigated only by the self serving greed of the corporate world that doesn't want chaos to get in the way of their profits. Trump might be immune to the big money lobby industry (and he's not as immune as he acts) but the people in congress certainly aren't.
This gives me new empathy for most of the world's population who try to survive for generations under governments that are much worse off than ours will ever be in our lifetimes. There, a contested election means loyalists shooting at each other.
@karasti said:
I've seen a lot of people calling for everyone to register, if that happens, as a Muslim. He also outrght lied today, taking credit for his election saving jobs at Kentucky ford plant that was going to move to Mexico. Except it was never going to happen. He said he talked to one of the Ford family members and he said he wouldn't move the plant. But it never happened. I know lying before he even takes office is a good trait in a president. Sigh.
Having scads of Americans register as Muslim would be quite radical, and extremely compassionate and daring; I haven't heard that idea, Karasti. Thanks for sharing.
I discussed this with a friend who said there's an obscure law on the books that allows the gov't to register people by nationality, and that it pre-existed WWII, so it was available to be implemented when the need occurred, but he didn't have more specifics about it. If that's what Higbie was referring to, he did a very poor job of articulating it. Which could mean either he didn't have in-depth knowledge about it, or he just isn't very articulate....or both. Time to do some internet research about this law;
Making false claims about rescuing an industry from moving south is very telling; it means he's already feeling the pressure from his constituency to deliver--to demonstrate results. If this sets a pattern, and if his constituents actually fall for such lies, it could mean he'd be unstoppable for a second term, unless he crashes and burns in some other arena of his job performance.
I saw headlines online saying the international community--the signatories to the Paris accord--will consider the US a "rogue nation", an international pariah, if it withdraws from the environmental treaties. It's embarrassing (not to mention--so irresponsibly destructive of our precious planet): the US will be known as the nut-job nation, suitable only to be the butt of jokes and disgust.
Among other international environmental news, yesterday at the environmental talks in Marrakesh, a representative of the State of California said that if the federal government refuses to sign onto any more agreements, California, along with Oregon and Washington, he expects, will proceed on its own, forging alliances with nations and building on its leadership role at the forefront of environmental standards. Background for our members outside the US; California put strict air quality control measures in place back in the late 1960's, due to an air quality crisis in LA, and since then, has developed the highest standards in the US (and Canada) in industrial and auto emissions control. So in some respects, it sees itself as a standard-setter. Even the last Republican governor, Schwarzenegger, said that as a public servant, he had to abandon his party's policies on the environment and support the public will.
It's encouraging news that some states are prepared to participate in the processes initiated in Paris and other international environmental forums independently of the federal government, if need be. This could get very interesting.
Comments
@person ....good vid! I'm working on the empathy for the matrix next door, hahaha.
I liked his last point of apologizing well.
Thanks everyone for this thread. It has really helped me work through some of my stuff the last couple of days.
"Yesterday is a Memory-Tomorrow is the Unknown-'Now' is the Knowing!"
The answer it would seem is the question....
When I think of Donald I also think of the miracle of 'change' and how a person can shift their perspective under the 'right' conditions...I'm also reminded that it's not the actual person/being, (the aggregates) it's the "behaviour" that arises from the causes and conditions...
Miracles do happen and are happening all the time... "Anicca" and the impermanent nature of all things (including human nature)
Buddhist teachers respond to Trump’s presidential win:
http://www.lionsroar.com/buddhist-teachers-respond-to-news-of-trumps-presidential-win/
'It’s OK to freak out, grieve, and vent for a while. Hold each others’ hands. Then we can get back to work, as always, for the good.' - Norman Fischer
'So please, stop and look deeply, and let’s work together in not building a contentious future, but a generative one. And let’s not pretend we know, but be open and learn; let’s bear witness to what is happening in our country, in our world, and take wise, compassionate, and courageous responsibility. Let’s reach through differences, listen deeply, and “give no fear.”
Here are the four great vows of the Bodhisattvas in community:
Creations are numberless, we vow to free them.
Delusions are inexhaustible, we vow to transform them.
Reality is Boundless, we vow to perceive it.
The awakened way is unsurpassable, we vow to embody it.
…. do not squander life!' --Roshi Joan Halifax
In view that circumstances can't be changed, this is a time to brace ourselves for the best and not give in to thoughts of despondency.
Personally, I have meditated double, done several rounds of mala and snuggled up in the couch with some awesome Dharma books and several mugs of green tea.
I don't bother to watch the news any more, but limit myself to change my tiny lot in the world.
Hopefully all that positive energy of us all working together can make a difference one day.
Like any shock, it's important to talk through our emotions of grief and anger and fear. This is a fantastic safe place to do that. Once we get centered again, then we can let go of the tension and remember to breathe.
I was more upset and angry yesterday than I was the previous day, but today is better. Extra taking care of myself, time outside, time with loved ones. Sent many messages to friends who need extra support. Lavender tea, healthy food, extra meditation, restoration yoga.
His cabinet looks like a nightmare so far, but, there is this.
http://usuncut.com/politics/trump-obamacare-repeal/
He's apparently no longer seeking a full repeal of Obamacare. There are things he realized, after meeting with Obama, that need to remain, but also that things needs to be fixed. I agree with that. We will see what he brings to the table. He looked scared to death when he met with Obama and hopefully it's settling in what he's about to take on and his responsibilities. I am waiting for him to step up and say something about the things going on in his name.
That and the Mexico wall were 2 of his biggest campaign promises and already one has changed. We'll see what happens when his fans find out the wall won't become a reality and is really just a euphemism for fixing gaps in immigration rather than stopping it and building walls to keep every non-American, non-Christian out.
I sent a message to a close friend and he said "As a gay man, I am horrified. Election night was one of the worst nights in a long time. But it's like a car accident, as horrified as you are you kind of want to see what happens next while praying no one gets hurt."
I may be seeing what I want to see but I think I've noticed things in his body language and demeanor that says he realizes this isn't a game anymore and the weight and responsibility of what he got himself into is sinking in. Fingers crossed actually being president causes him to grow up in a hurry.
Also, it is really scary hearing about some of the aggressive racial incidents that are being reported in the name of Trump. Hopefully their moment in the sun will now let us see the racism that does exist so we can stamp it out.
Yeah, I myself wondered if he ever expected to win. And the racial incidents are VERY alarming! It's not just the incidents per se. It's the mentality behind them; those people are assuming that the police will allow hate crimes with impunity, and that the judicial system will be "theirs" and on their side, as well. That's what's more alarming.
BTW, does anyone know if any of those perpetrators were arrested? Hate crimes incur a harsher sentence.
We used the vote. Hillary got the majority of those votes. So much for that.
I'm rediscovering the healing power of cheeseburgers, fried chicken and lots and lots of wine. Before this election, I was a vegan that almost never drank. Whatever it takes to get a little space from the darkness. I happily found a kitchen towel that was buried in the bottom of a drawer that says "Give me coffee to change the things I can and wine for the things I can't". Nice mantra.
Actually, I am pretty much over the escaping (and the cows and chickens are very happy about that). While still shocked and sad, life is about change, and hanging onto what once was is a good way to suffer. Do I know what my next move will be? Not at all, but I have decided that the best decision is to make no decision. I have some plans and one particular thing I started, but overall I am just standing pat until I process everything. I suspect that in the end we can best deal w/ this catastrophe by remaining as calm as possible and using mindfulness as much as possible. It does help, and not just in my personal life.
There's also wisdom in getting really, really mad and experiencing what we feel at our deepest levels so that we can let go of it and move on. If we don't get fully in touch w/ the anger that I am sure all of us are feeling, we carry it around w/ us all the time. Nothing like a good laugh too, and going to hear some live music is healing. Does that change the situation? No, it changes me, at least temporarily. I have very, very little control about the situation we are in. There's hate, racism, anger, and violence everywhere, as much as we don't want to hear that. Unless I moved to a tiny desert island or surrounded myself w/ cats, which is actually not a bad idea, what is going down is going down in all places to one extent or another. This is what happens when ego runs the world.
For myself, one of the most frustrating things is that you can't tell who is who. In the 60's and 70's you knew who your "tribe" was right away. The hair, the clothes, the smoke, the music. Now Trump supporters look just like the liberals! I guess in a way that may be good, but I much prefer the old way. You knew where you stood w/ just a glance. There were NO long haired, pot smoking, Rolling Stones listening, pro war, pro establishment people back then. Now everyone wears a T-shirt, a baseball cap and has cut their hair short. Maybe that's telling....a society that stresses conformity is more fascist. Even if we THINK we made these decisions to dress and look as we do, society actually made those decisions for us. Most of us just don't want to stand out and look different, while years ago we reveled in it.
Yes, what Dakini said. The mentality!
The KKK has started planning victory parades here and in NC.
The public cheers/signs of 'white power' is everywhere right now...college and high school games, even.
When is he going to address this? Will he? If he doesn't...what then?
This shit is serious.
He needs to address this stuff. He can't not know it's happening. I'm working on just being present, as usual. I'm not going to look into january or 2 or 4 years from now to assume life will have taken a horrifically tragic turn. he's already down an about face on several of his campaign promises. I hope there are more so he ends up more middle road. Sounds familiar, lol. For now, I want to see him address the issues going on and help assure the people. That's his job. Obama did well with that aspect. Trump has big shoes to fill.
I may be reading too much into it, but I think I'm seeing that in him. He appears to know that now that he's somehow gotten himself elected president, he needs to do some very fast growing up. Inauguration day is really, really soon. He immediately started, in his victory speech, to try to reassure the rest of the planet that he isn't the insane loon his campaign rhetoric would indicate. But he needs to address social issues at home too.
One of his advisers or campaign people (?) was asked about it today and said his campaign stuff was all "election talk" just like his conversations were "locker room talk." I have no doubt that is true, as it is true for most politicians. But there is usually some truth in all of that, too. And just because it happens doesn't mean it is ok. I am curious to see what happens, but I am trying to be cautious as I don't want to suddenly believe he's not so bad after the campaign he ran. He said, and did some truly awful stuff, and if he did it all in the name of getting elected and it wasn't' true, I don't know if that makes it better or not. Especially after he focused so much on how crooked and lying Hillary was. I was highly disappointed in the entire election season, since all they did was fight each other in horrible ways, barely addressed issues, mostly didn't address the citizens, and then they both come out on election night all civil and cooperative. I'd rather that than the alternative, but still. Why can't they bring that persona and those speeches to the whole election?
I hope for our country's sake that he's not as bad as he lead us to believe. But that people behave that way to get elected...and it works...I don't even know what to do with that.
^^. I do.
Use it too.
DJ tRump the rapper, is the last pResident Evil. I find hymn funny. His hair is funny, his swagger is funny, his unworkable manifestation is funny. He has made history. The first African Immigrant non native American gangsta sociopath to be laffed into the oval office. Export him back to Scotland or his consorts Slovenia (wherever that is).
Nicola Sturgeon, the well known bonny fish and Empress of Scottishland (part of Europe allegedly), will grab him by the genitalia and lead him straight into golfing retirement ...
I find that I have no idea what the truth is. Not that we ever truly know, but possibilities of how Trump will govern run the gamut. I hope for the best for obvious reasons. I hope he fixes some of our bigger problems and leaves the other stuff he talked about alone. But he hurt and frightened a lot of people with his "campaign rhetoric" and people aren't just going to forgive him overnight because he said it was election talk. He hasn't even acknowledged that what he said was wrong and apologized to those people. I know a lot of people are calling for his impeachment, and with his civil trials, it is possible. However, then Mike Pence will take over and I'd rather have Trump. But Mike Pence is truly scary in his religious beliefs. I would not want him leading the country. Now that Trump is in, I hope nothing happens to allow Pence to take over.
Scary stuff! I wonder if there will be a public response. In the past, neo-Nazi parades have been met with crowd of protesters/hecklers. That's important, to send a message.
I don't know anything about Mike Pence's religious beliefs. I don't know anything about him at all. Could you elaborate, briefly? (Not too much detail, or it could ruin my Sunday morning, lol)
I don't think jokes about grabbing people in the unmentionables is funny, in view of the fact that school boys have been grabbing girls there, and saying, "If a President can do it, I can!" This is sexual assault. I hope those boys were given a "time out" from school for a few days, but IMO the police should have been called, and charges filed. It is not a casual matter.
@Dakini He doesn't believe in evolution and gave a big speech in the House to demand creationism in schools. He signed a bill into law last year allowing businesses to discriminate against LGBT people based on religious beliefs. Wants to scrap Roe v Wade. Voted against almost every environment law put up to congress. Voted for a law that would have allowed illegal immigrants seeking medical care to be detained at the hospital. He is basically against everything that we have done to move forward for civil and equal rights for minorities. There's a lot more, but you can of course find them without me ruining your day by typing them all out, LOL.
I have a gut feeling that I need to go a state that is run by Democrats. Right now I'm in St Pete, which is one of the few liberal places in Florida, but the county we are in went solidly for Trump. I am seeing a lot more aggressiveness and smugness in people here. It's cold in New Mexico now, so I may wait till fall, put a tenant in my place, and go see if it is where I now need to be. Or I may do a little work on the place now and rent it out while the snowbird season is just starting and just brave the cold in Albuquerque. I am not sure.
I think there is a lot of denial about the repercussions of this New Regime taking over the Federal government at all levels, and I don't understand why. It is what it is, and they plan on doing exactly what they said they would do. All the right wing lunatics that supported his candidacy are going to be feeling emboldened to act out now, and I foresee something very bad happening in America. Why wouldn't it is the question? Simple cause and effect at work.
At today's lunch at my Shambhala sangha after our meditation there was absolutely no mention of the election from anyone, and people just seem to be treating it as if nothing happened, which I think is a big mistake. But then almost to a person they are all white and upper middle class folks, and this is basically how it was at the Zen centers that I went to over the course of 20 years. They won't feel the discrimination and fear that minorities feel.
Not to compare this to what the Dali Lama fled from in Tibet, but it could be eerily similar here if someone is the "wrong" color, the wrong sexual persuasion, or speaks out and says the wrong thing. These people do not brook argument or other people's views, and you cannot reason w/ them. Ryan appears even more scary than Pence. How do you think they will feel about a bunch of liberal "godless" Buddhists? Even the Dali Lama was prevented from speaking to Congress by right wing Southern Christian fundamentalists during Obama's tenure. They claimed he was a god less devil worshiper. You can't make this stuff up.
OMG, what a horrible train wreck! The US is already the laughing stock of the world when the topic of creationism in education comes up. I was half kidding when I posted on another forum that soon, evolution will be kicked out of the curriculum in favor of creationism. I had no idea there was a very real possibility that would happen!
I'm left bewildered as to how a modern society could flip back and forth from progressing toward an enlightened, equality and human rights-based citizenry to a medieval, repressive, witch-hunting polity. Is this 2016, or is it 1250, during the Crusades?
I don't think people are in denial. As the well known Buddhist saying goes: If you can do something, do it. If you can't, don't waste your time worrying. NO one knows where this is going to go. No one I know is accepting it. But stepping back and watching with caution, hopeful but expecting nothing. We don't know what the repercussions will be, he's going back on his promises every day. As far as the election results, we can only wait and see. We cannot control anything but our own actions and reactions. People not panicking isn't a sign of denial or resignation. But a realization of what we can actually have a voice in and make a difference in. And that we cannot respond to something that hasn't happened yet. Everyone wants Trump impeached. Pence is worse. Don't hope for that route.
Well at least one of the 2 appointments today is beyond concerning. Sigh. Many calling it an emergency but again, what can we do? I wonder what the typical non-tea party republican thinks of Bannon. Ugh.
For the record...and to be fair...the NC GOP has responded to the KKK parade:
'"We are disgusted and condemn this extremist ideology and associated actions in the strongest possible terms," NC GOP Chairman Robin Hayes said in a statement provided to CNN. "These acts and thought processes are no reflection of the heartbeat of this great country and are counter to the efforts to make America great again. We stand with the Democratic Party in calling these out-of-state troublemakers to go home."
And....
'Trump's campaign quickly condemned the parade, saying, "Mr. Trump and his team continue to disavow these groups and individuals and strongly condemn their message of hate," according to Trump's spokeswoman, Hope Hicks.'
That's not good enough for me. Not a spokesperson/statement. He needs to stand up and say it himself. Own it.
He might be busy choosing chintz wallpaper....
He chose a man who admits he is one of the alt-right leaders and who is an admitted anti-Semite and otherwise. He's the CEO of Breitbart which is like Fox News on crack. I am not impressed with that selection at all, but that backround info (that I have see so far) comes from Shaun King who generally does his homework but is fairly biased as well. Priebus seems to be a bit more middle of the road. But Steve Barron may be reason for concern considering he got one of the top jobs and will be advising Trump.
Trump needs to get on tv and talk to the people. He didn't do it during the debates, and he's not doing it now. Really, him, Obama and Hillary should all do it as a group.
Did anyone watch the 60mins interview? I thought it was on now but I think I missed it and got the time zones wrong. This is from an article about it. So Trump says he'll stand up and tell people to stop it. It came across to me as "you are ruining my claim to make us great again. Staaaaahp it!"
Trump said he's seen "a very small amount" -- including "one or two instances" -- of racial slurs being directed at minorities, particularly in largely white schools, since his election.
"I would say don't do it, that's terrible, because I'm going to bring this country together," Trump said.
Told that Latinos and Muslims are facing harassment, he said: "I am so saddened to hear that. And I say, 'Stop it.' If it -- if it helps, I will say this, and I will say right to the cameras: 'Stop it.'"
^^. Telling people 'not to be naughty' or shoot their mouth off, clearly works. Not.
Now what Trumpy? LOL
In the UK as Mr Brexit Farage's political 'party' dissolves into the joke it always was, he still pretends ... the grown ups now have to mend the mess ...
In a similar way America is in a holding period. Where a mouth with hair is realised as no solution ...
Don't you know the people lighting things on fire, teaching their kids to hate other kids, and graffiting hate messages sit down after dinner to watch 60 minutes?
He also said he might not get an investigator for Clinton because the Clintons are very nice people. What? He was friends with them a very long time. He was a democrat for a long time. I'm not sure what kind of a Frankenstein he is.
I went to my sangha meeting today for the first time in several weeks-busy with kids on the weekends lately our hosts were gone traveling. i am so glad I went. We practiced tonglen together, which was lovely. We had a good, civil discussion. There were a lot of tears over sharing experiences, including our host losing a very good friend to a difference in politics. We listened to this. Hopefully the link works. It is very good. By a teacher from the US who was in Spain the day after the election. Worth a listen, not too long. Maybe 15 minutes or so. Click the play button on the black bar at the top. Turn it up a fair bit, it's on the quiet side
http://media.sbinstitute.com/courses/alan-gave-a-talk-about-the-result-of-the-us-election/alan-s-talk-on-the-results-of-the-us-election/
Yeah, in Michael Moore's Trumpland film, he has a couple of clips of Trump saying very nice things about Hillary. During the Lewinsky scandal, someone, or maybe some comedy show (Jay Leno?), IDK, pulled a gag, and asked Trump if he'd date Hillary after the (assumed) divorce. He gave a long answer about how she'll hang in there, she's tough, and she's faithful and devoted to Bill, and they'll survive. She'll do fine, she'll stick with him, he said. And on another occasion, he was asked closer to the early part of the campaign, to say something nice about her. And he said she's a fighter, she doesn't give up.
So it seems that he actually likes her, and has known her fairly well for a long time. So I'm not surprised that it came out in the interview that he's been friends with the Clintons since back in their day, if not before.
I missed the show. I hope to catch it when they put it up on youtube.
I'm starting to wonder if he mistook the campaign for another reality show, and that all the bluster and outrageousness was for the cameras, as if the campaign were staged, just entertainment. If that's how he was aiming it, I think he really did the country a disservice. Look at all the ugly forces that performance unleashed. It was a stupid, irresponsible thing to do. Except it got him votes. Shameless. Anything to sell his brand.
That was the impression I got from the election as well - that he was playing to the crowd, and that his promises weren't worth the paper they were written on. The problem is, the public actually liked his empty words, and he will likely now be shown up as a bit of a hollow sham where a lot of the public thought they were getting a man of action.
This article in the Independent may get a lot of play...
Nine times Donald Trump betrayed voters
To go from the divisive, extreme figure that he portrayed himself as during the election to a unifying president is quite a switch, and the kind of people he is appointing are certainly not helping matters.
I've been wondering why I haven't seen much in the way of real concern or any concrete plans of action about the Trump win in my Shambhala sangha until yesterday I read of a term that makes sense.......latte liberals!
Yeah, my sangha did the tonglen thing too, and there was a certain amount of requisite hand wringing and complaining. I left in disgust at this point. My Zen training just won't put up w/ all the whining. The group, to a person, is really all about talking and not doing, and I want to see some doing because talk is cheap and easy and doesn't cost anything in terms of risk or commitment. Same w/ sitting on a cushion doing tonglen meditation. I am sorry, but to me this is just phoniness and for a feel good sort of showing of solidarity (that's what I saw, I have no idea what is going on anywhere else except where it is happening in front of my own eyes).
I left another time when one of the senior teachers made a statement after our meditation. It was after there had been protests due to a white officer killing yet another unarmed black man, and she said "when we look deep inside ourselves we understand that white people are just afraid of black people". I looked at my wife, who was the only black face in a sea of white, and thought, that's totally missing the point here isn't it? No one is afraid of Linda, and if someone is automatically afraid of someone because of the color of their skin, that is prejudicial and racist. I just do not get these well off, monied whites that mainly populate American Buddhist places.
Waking up today, there was the same depressing feeling that has been there since Wednesday, and a sense that no matter what we do, something has fundamentally changed in this country. Just yesterday at the ck out counter of a particularly upscale and yuppie Publix grocery store, the guy at the register asked me automatically "how are you doing?' and I truthfully answered "Well, after Wednesday morning, that question has taken on new meaning hasn't it? So I'm just not gonna say nuthin" . That's all I said, and the guy behind me w/ the Oakley sunglasses propped up on his required baseball cap stood back in order to distance himself from me and just stared w/ his arms crossed in a very hateful way. No one can tell me that the people that support Donald Trump are kind or reasonable people, they are what they are.
If you are so bent on action, then why are waiting for someone else to tell you what to do? Perhaps no one is forming actions because there IS nothing to do just now. Things are coming together, depending where you look. But whining that no one is doing anything is whining just the same.
Tonglen is about changing the attitude/energy/whatever in ourselves so our actions in the world are more focused on helping rather than hurting. It's not some sort of voodoo magic from The Green Mile. If you are unhappy and in disagreement with the Shambhala ways, why don't you leave instead of whining? You just seem to be complaining a lot about others complaining. People are commiserating and sharing right now, trying to understand what is going on and where to go. Just few answers are available. It's only been a week. Everyone will grieve and go through the process of understanding and coming to action differently than you. You don't get to tell them they are wrong.
Just as much as i put responsibility on the DNC for what happened with the democrats, some of that blame on Trump's side goes to the RNC. Many of them would have supported a better candidate but that's not what they got. Just like DNC gave us Clinton. I don't believe in her warmongering, lying ways. But I voted for her anyhow. My father in law is not a hateful, homophobic, racist man. But he voted for Trump anyways. Obviously I wish he wouldn't have, but his conservatism runs as deep in him as my liberalism does in me, and there was as much chance he'd vote for Clinton as there was I'd vote for Trump. Our parties pitted us against each other and put MANY of us in a position of voting for a horrible candidate just in an attempt to keep another horrible candidate out. Perhaps it would have been more responsible NOT to vote. But that is hardly what we are led to believe about our voting rights and anyone who doesn't vote is basically shamed. So we're given a message that we're better off voting for a bad candidate than not voting at all.
The thing is, @smarino Trump didn't create these people. He behaved in a way that allowed them to think their harmful thoughts and actions were ok. He has immense responsibility in that. But we needed to know we had so many of these people to deal with before we could move forward. As a friend of mine says, taking a step (or more) backwards really sucks. but, it's by stepping back that we get a better view and can gain perspective before we can move meaningfully forward.
Reminds me of the Martin Luther King Jr quote, "The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends towards justice."
Progress isn't always a straight line. The two party system sets up a dynamic of power swinging back and forth. In some ways I think that is a good and healthy thing too. I don't think either side is perfect with a flawless ideology that if endlessly put in place means utopia. Too much communalism and the value of the individual is lost, too much individualism and the value of the community is lost.
Politics is really one of those issues that pushes our buttons and causes us to loose perspective.
@smarino Here's some advice from a forum post I came across recently that might help
As an outsider looking in...
Accept the outcome of democracy and get on with it. You can't change it, only live with its consequences and carry on with your own life as best you can.
May seem harsh and I admit I haven't read all the posts above. There's just so much negativity and scaremongering. It was the same here with Brexit; I voted against but accept the majority decision and don't give it a second thought now.
"Get over it" is not an option when the environment is threatened - as are women, gays, South Americans, blacks and muslims, the poor and older people..... WTF is there to get over? It's not a little ouchie that will heal itself -- those will be attacks on actual people, now, in the near future and in the distant future (environment).
What to do? Within the next 3 months find a cause that it is dear to your heart and that you will want to work for, protecting and defending it. This will give you access to a community of like-minded people who will act with other like-minded folks to form a network. It will come together.
Dealing with Trump will be difficult because he is unpredictable and will lie as before, making it all about him, good and bad. None of the issues matter to him, he will want to appeal to his selected crowd for each of his "projects" and will want to gain approval almost at random. He has no conscience since he is a narcissist, and will, as before, spin his comments whichever way - and get away with it because those who should learn about him are not willing to listen.
No point in targeting him, really. Instead, focus on the issues and those inside and outside government who support him/his views, and try to get their ear.
The people in govt will want to be re-elected and cannot side with Trump 100% since he is a flip-flopper and they will have to justify flip-flopping with him. Reasonable Republicans will hopefully voice discent and do what they can to provide damage control.
As for voices from abroad -- you just don't understand how much this hurts. It's like your home has been invaded and you are blindsided by a sinister, cold burst of air that wants to destroy your personal and extended comfort zone and your (already limited) sense of harmony that you have managed to establish. That's why people are upset. If it's not your house, you don't know how it feels - you just see the rationale of what happened. Try empathy.
And beyond that -- sadly, if the US struggles, so does the rest of the world. Don't just sit back and pretend you are removed from the danger. We are going to have climate change deniers in office who will increase fossil fuel consumption. The polar ice will melt and water levels will rise everywhere! Say goodbye to your coast line and big harbor cities - your grandkids will inherit a very painful struggle and huge losses.
Everyone abroad better wake up and join concerned US citizens in reigning in these short-sighted policy makers.
I'm having a bad time at work. This morning in my meditation I thought - what will fighting bring? what will egoic reactions bring? - more fighting, more ego. So I decided to own all the hurt and it's amazing. I feel so much more empowered, compassionate, caring. And my feeling is that this is a fundamentally more powerful approach - people can't listen to rage, it just encourages a slam in the face. Love is unbearably human and it touches people much further down.
So, I'd encourage you to start with owning all your feelings - this will clear the mind to see what actions are most helpful. By owning all your feelings, you're releasing the attachment, stickiness, hooked nature of the trance, and this is a contracted space. After you own the hurt, frustration, disappointment, despair etc, then the path forward will become clear.
Good luck!
What I find helpful is having days where I don't look at news at all!
My thoughts are similar to @possibilities when people keep saying to get over it. This isn't a junior high break up or having to accept your favorite actor didn't win the award. This has the potential to be a life changing thing for a lot of people. I know people right now who are afraid to leave their houses. I have friends who have been victims of attacks (most of them nonviolent but every bit invasive).
However, as is always the case, recognizing what we can and cannot do is key. It doesn't mean, (and I don't think @federica meant it this way) to pretend nothing is happening. It means let go of what you cannot control. And then focus on where you can be of assistance. Do something where you can. Don't just sit pissed off about what you can't. It's hard to do that right now because there simply isn't a lot to be done. But you can reach out to threatened communities and ask how you can help. You can support people you know feel concerned. You can keep on your own politicians and make sure they speak up. We can't do much, but some of them can and they are much more likely to do so when they hear from a persistent flow of their constituents. Do what you can. Leave the rest. There is nothing else that can be done. Sitting and wallowing in anger isn't doing anyone any good and is only increasing the divide as we continue to argue with each other about an event that is OVER.
I agree that the typical confrontational approach should be softened - especially on a one-to-one basis. Conversations that end in frustration and anger are pointless and self-defeating. This is where our Buddhist thought patterns can help to at least point this out and calm situations that would otherwise deteriorate,
Coalition building on any scale will be important - and will have lasting effects into the future. This will neutralize the effects of the opponents tactic (consciously or unconsciously applied) to divide and conquer.
That type of (class)warfare seems to be part of our DNA now and special efforts are needed to recognise and limit the impact of trying to split us up. (This was common knowledge during labor struggles but those have been eliminated with the elimination of unions.)
Figure out who shares your goals.
I don't watch the news. Most days I don't even read it on the internet.
As far as I can figure out, it's misery or conjecture about misery.
The worst thing to me isn't that conservatives are in power it's that we hate each other and can't work together to find a way forward. All the fighting has brought governing almost to a halt so we can't solve our problems.
Each side thinks they have thought it through and come to the best ideas. What we don't see is that what we actually do is start with a moral intuition about the world and then build up the ideas on how to carry that intuition out. One way I've heard it explained is that people are on a continuum of being strict and strong or soft and nurturing, it's about strengths and weaknesses, not right and wrong. In parenting for example people have a style that is more one or the other but in practice both are needed in different circumstances. Politics takes those styles and turns them into hardened identities, so if someone disagrees with your politics it's not an idea they disagree with it is you, yourself they have a problem with.
It's so poisonous and the sides are so entrenched and invested in doing things this way I don't see how to get out of it other than rebuilding from catastrophe. All I can do is work on pulling myself out of the quagmire and maybe show and explain to others. It's not about victory over the other side, it's about loving and understanding the other side and maybe ultimately about realizing there is no other side.
The outrage du jour, ladies and gents, is that a big Trump supporter, a manager of his largest political campaign funds, said on FOX news that he would instate the Muslim registry proposal, starting with those who apply abroad for US visas. To justify this, he cited the WWII internment camps the US forced Japanese Americans to move into, calling this a "precedent" for the Muslim registry proposal. Even the FOX news reporter was appalled.
On Wednesday, Carl Higbie, a spokesperson for the pro-Trump Great America PAC, defended the proposed registry of Muslims by citing World War II Japanese-American internment camps while speaking with Fox News’s Megyn Kelly.
From an article on National Public Radio's Democracy Now! program and website.
And btw, Clinton is ahead of Trump now by 2 million votes and counting, a greater margin than the one by which Kennedy won.
I've seen a lot of people calling for everyone to register, if that happens, as a Muslim. He also outrght lied today, taking credit for his election saving jobs at Kentucky ford plant that was going to move to Mexico. Except it was never going to happen. He said he talked to one of the Ford family members and he said he wouldn't move the plant. But it never happened. I know lying before he even takes office is a good trait in a president. Sigh.
Ditto (I sound like Patrick Swayze/Whoopi Goldberg...!).
The frustrating part is not knowing how crazy he and the Republican congress are going to get. The potential is there, mitigated only by the self serving greed of the corporate world that doesn't want chaos to get in the way of their profits. Trump might be immune to the big money lobby industry (and he's not as immune as he acts) but the people in congress certainly aren't.
This gives me new empathy for most of the world's population who try to survive for generations under governments that are much worse off than ours will ever be in our lifetimes. There, a contested election means loyalists shooting at each other.
Having scads of Americans register as Muslim would be quite radical, and extremely compassionate and daring; I haven't heard that idea, Karasti. Thanks for sharing.
I discussed this with a friend who said there's an obscure law on the books that allows the gov't to register people by nationality, and that it pre-existed WWII, so it was available to be implemented when the need occurred, but he didn't have more specifics about it. If that's what Higbie was referring to, he did a very poor job of articulating it. Which could mean either he didn't have in-depth knowledge about it, or he just isn't very articulate....or both. Time to do some internet research about this law;
Making false claims about rescuing an industry from moving south is very telling; it means he's already feeling the pressure from his constituency to deliver--to demonstrate results. If this sets a pattern, and if his constituents actually fall for such lies, it could mean he'd be unstoppable for a second term, unless he crashes and burns in some other arena of his job performance.
I saw headlines online saying the international community--the signatories to the Paris accord--will consider the US a "rogue nation", an international pariah, if it withdraws from the environmental treaties. It's embarrassing (not to mention--so irresponsibly destructive of our precious planet): the US will be known as the nut-job nation, suitable only to be the butt of jokes and disgust.
Among other international environmental news, yesterday at the environmental talks in Marrakesh, a representative of the State of California said that if the federal government refuses to sign onto any more agreements, California, along with Oregon and Washington, he expects, will proceed on its own, forging alliances with nations and building on its leadership role at the forefront of environmental standards. Background for our members outside the US; California put strict air quality control measures in place back in the late 1960's, due to an air quality crisis in LA, and since then, has developed the highest standards in the US (and Canada) in industrial and auto emissions control. So in some respects, it sees itself as a standard-setter. Even the last Republican governor, Schwarzenegger, said that as a public servant, he had to abandon his party's policies on the environment and support the public will.
It's encouraging news that some states are prepared to participate in the processes initiated in Paris and other international environmental forums independently of the federal government, if need be. This could get very interesting.
@Dakini I'm not sure if it would actually work or not, it would depend how they rolled out such a program, but here's an article about it
http://indianexpress.com/article/world/world-news/thousands-of-americans-pledge-online-to-side-with-muslims-amid-talk-of-registry-4383512/