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Being fed up with all things spiritual

JeroenJeroen Luminous beings are we, not this crude matterNetherlands Veteran

This morning I woke up with a deep sense of dissatisfaction over all things spiritual. I often do my meditation in the morning, but today I did not feel like it at all. Maybe it was the dream I had (about trying to catch a group of mice and hamsters with my bare hands) but even reading spiritual books made me feel repulsed.

I tried thinking of Papaji, of Nisargadatta, of Osho, and none of it felt like it was of any worth. It was as if in the night there I had communed with some deep part of myself, and it had told me, these things were not proper guides. And there was an emotional reaction on my part, I believed and actually felt something real about this.

Once someone in a similar mood went to see Nisargadatta, and he said it was a valuable state in which deep work could be done. Oh the irony, that a valueless piece of writing should be giving me advice.

DagobahZen

Comments

  • JeroenJeroen Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter Netherlands Veteran

    What do you think it means, this mood? I very rarely have feelings of this type, once every half decade or so, and I think they are significant. A sense of dissatisfaction, repulsion, almost disgust can be a kind of sickness, I think it would be wise to pay attention.

    DagobahZen
  • My first reaction when reading the OP was to say that maybe (!) there is another area of life which warrants your attention at this time, instead of spirituality.

    The other option, which comes to mind now, is that you might have overdone something, such as reading, etc.

    VastmindDagobahZenSuraShine
  • personperson Don't believe everything you think The liminal space Veteran

    Hard to say really, a few thoughts come to mind though.

    Its likely something that has been building up. It could be an emotion from elsewhere in your life that is bleeding over. It says more about your particular relation with spirituality, or these forms of spirituality, than spirituality itself. I've learned from Acceptance and Commitment Therapy and taking cold showers that doing things you find valuable and beneficial even when you don't feel emotionally motivated to do so has value.

    DagobahZen
  • JeroenJeroen Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter Netherlands Veteran

    @person said:
    It could be an emotion from elsewhere in your life that is bleeding over.

    This seems unlikely. My life is about as low-stress as it is possible to get. Apart from the mouse.

    It says more about your particular relation with spirituality, or these forms of spirituality, than spirituality itself.

    It is a purely subjective experience, but it was quite powerful. Good point though that it relates to how I had been approaching spirituality.

    I've learned from Acceptance and Commitment Therapy and taking cold showers that doing things you find valuable and beneficial even when you don't feel emotionally motivated to do so has value.

    It isn’t so much that I wasn’t ’emotionally motivated’, it was like that repulsion, that disgust was making me feel ill just thinking about it.

  • JeroenJeroen Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter Netherlands Veteran

    @how said:
    I think that a meditation practice is a beckoning to the disassembly of our ego based identity.

    Very interesting.

    This dissatisfying mood is your teacher, either as the limit of how far into the deconstruction you are currently prepared to venture into..or the door through which such limitations can be transcended.

    I agree, but I am tempted to see it as an indication that further spirituality in the way I had been approaching it is harmful to me at present. I was thinking of halting all spiritual reading for a good long while.

    I suspect your current dissatisfaction holds the potential of deeper meditative depths beyond what you have yet to have experienced.

    Perhaps. My meditative practice has been quite minimal for a while, just ten minute sessions at irregular intervals, but I have been having energy experiences often and lengthily, sometimes for hours a day, which may be associated with spiritual reading. So we can toss all that into a pot and call it regular spiritual activity.

    Certainly today has been quieter, spiritually, than for a long time.

  • Shoshin1Shoshin1 Veteran
    edited December 2023

    W> @Jeroen said:

    What do you think it means, this mood? I very rarely have feelings of this type, once every half decade or so, and I think they are significant. A sense of dissatisfaction, repulsion, almost disgust can be a kind of sickness, I think it would be wise to pay attention.

    Welcome to Samsara's waves of Dukkha ....This too shall pass...You just need to ride them out....

    Kotishka
  • FosdickFosdick in its eye are mirrored far off mountains Alaska, USA Veteran

    What do you think it means, this mood? I very rarely have feelings of this type, once every half decade or so, and I think they are significant. A sense of dissatisfaction, repulsion, almost disgust can be a kind of sickness, I think it would be wise to pay attention.>

    I am wondering if this might sometimes be related to some of what can happen in the mind just prior to sudden enlightenment. The mundane vs the spiritual : an artificial duality sensed so strongly that there is an emotional reaction against the very existence of this imaginary duality, and if the reaction is powerful enough, then Wham! The mind is propelled into an entirely different plane, a plane where neither exists.

    Very speculative, of course, but something to keep in mind?

  • JeroenJeroen Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter Netherlands Veteran

    @Fosdick said:
    I experience something similar from time to time - not a sense of repulsion but a sense that I am just reading the same repetitive thing over and over again, nuanced in various ways, but the same thing nonetheless, and that I need to stop reading it and focus completely on what's going on under my nose - a return to real mindfulness, "not dependent on words and letters"

    Yes, that was definitely an element of it, that all these guru’s whose satsangs I was reading were essentially saying the same thing, that I didn’t need to read it again. For me there wasn’t a sense that I needed to do anything positive, just that I needed to stop looking at spirituality.

  • Steve_BSteve_B Veteran

    Bill Gates has finally succeeded in getting microchips implanted in you. They replicated inside your body and now all acted in unison. It was all part of the plan all along. Now you will start fulfilling your assigned tasks. Your spiritual journey is over. You’re an automaton now.

    We hope you’ll still stay on NB and send reports.

    Or looked at another way, if it wasn’t Bill Gates or drone birds, maybe it was a galactic ripple in the cosmos. Or a microscopic ripple in YOUR cosmos.

    It does seem actually very interesting to suddenly have a new uninvited lens through which to see things. By all means check it out. Besides spirituality there may be other things that will look different now. See where it takes you. Some of the best opportunities are (seemingly) random, sudden.

    KotishkaJeroenShoshin1
  • JeroenJeroen Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter Netherlands Veteran
    edited January 1

    @Steve_B said:
    Bill Gates has finally succeeded in getting microchips implanted in you.

    Yeah it’s certainly more than a little against character. The feeling also vanished after about 15 minutes. The agents of the Matrix have taken me over, obviously. But after ten years of immersing myself in it, the signs couldn’t be more clear. The universe decided to hit me over the head with a big club of emotion.

    I’ve decided to take a break from spirituality — reading, writing, meditation, practice, discussing, Buddhism, guru’s, nonduality, everything. Until further notice.

    I’m hoping @how is right and there will be more to follow.

    We hope you’ll still stay on NB and send reports.

    There is so much on New Buddhist besides the Buddhism that I’ll keep up the morning visits, but I may not contribute as much. An occasional report I can manage though.

  • pegembarapegembara Veteran
    edited January 2

    I think it was Nisargadatta who said something like-

    "You don't actually experience suffering, you are suffering the experiencing."

    Shoshin1lobster
  • lobsterlobster Veteran

    Fed up?
    Good news!
    Still and excited?
    Good news.
    Giving up but still ...

    Or as they say ... "Mind the moves, not the movement" ...

    Have a great day everyone :heartbreak:

    JeroenShoshin1
  • @pegembara said:
    I think it was Nisargadatta who said something like-

    "You don't actually experience suffering, you are suffering the experiencing."

    Which reminds me of ...

    He who fears he shall suffer, already suffers what he fears

    ~Michel de Montaigne~

    lobsterDagobahZen
  • Spiritual and mundane are not separate.
    Your spiritual journey is necessarily interconnected with your day to day real world of just living. Your spiritual practice can be seperated from your mundane, worldly affairs but each will none-the-less affect the other. In melding the mundane, the material, with the spiritual, you grow and advance. In separating mundane from the spiritual, you will reach stalemate.

    lobsterDagobahZenSuraShine
  • JeroenJeroen Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter Netherlands Veteran

    Being honest about it, I dropped the whole concept of religion in any form some time ago. Instead for a few years now I have been searching through the words of those who are held to be enlightened, in a search for truth and freedom. These of course included the Buddha, but also people like Papaji, Osho, UG Krishnamurti, and others.

    It was Osho who said, religion is largely a product of the priests, with only its deepest roots in the resonant concepts of enlightened sages. Therefore, don’t be a Buddhist, but be a Buddha. And if you have to ask ‘how’ that just shows you are still in the clutches of the mind. Just trust that you are a Buddha and let go.

    I was considering freedom a while ago, and I realised one of the great things about the words of the enlightened was that they make you more free. Freedom from conditioning, from illusion, from desire, from clinging, even from the spiritual search itself. Freedom is the natural consequence of letting go of clinging in all its forms.

    What is left in the end is certain core principles, like Love, Truth and Being. These seem to function like rudders guiding your essence.

    SuraShine
  • personperson Don't believe everything you think The liminal space Veteran

    This reminds me of a feeling I've held about spirituality. I've engaged with it at a character level rather than a personality level, if that makes any sense.

    Jeroen
  • JeroenJeroen Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter Netherlands Veteran

    @person said:
    This reminds me of a feeling I've held about spirituality. I've engaged with it at a character level rather than a personality level, if that makes any sense.

    Yes it does, character is a layer deeper than personality which is more superficial. In the same way, engaging with the words of the enlightened is a deeper level than being part of a religion.

    But in a way, that is also a hazard. Taking in a lot of powerful concepts from different sources can be confusing. That means, not taking in too much, taking it lightly where appropriate, meditating on where your personal emphasis lies, are all important.

    For me, freedom from conditioning was a good starting point. Science, materialism, skepticism, the democratic left, eco-activism, Christianity are all prevalent sources of conditioning worth examining closely.

    person
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