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I would not try to kill a fly firstly as they are just too quick and I do not own a utensil that would swat a fly, secondly I try to keep this precept as firmly in my life. I will 'shoe' a fly away from me if it is on my body or my food, but I will not harm it. The question arises though, is a fly a sentient being?
When I lived at WATBUDDHAGODOM temple here in Highland, california I used to go around removing all the fly strips put up to kill flys at the temple, they just thought I was crazy, I think by definition even an ant is a sentient being but obviously there are higher and lower levels of sentient beings, I wouldn't put a dog or cat, or even cow much lower than a human, though. Humans have one huge ego of their self importance, etc.!!!
I used to like fishing, and this could be selective memory or wishful thinking but, the few times I got the opportunity to fish I could never catch anything. I used to get so upset about it. I remember on my honeymoon going on a fishing trip in Cairns in Northern QLD and everyone hooked at least one fish, my wife actually got a small stingray, yet none for me, I used to get stirred about it. Fortunately the fish we returned to the ocean, but I didn't catch one! Now looking back at that, it just seems very spooky. I think this seems quite unlikely, its probably more selective memory than anything else. Having said that I used to squash flies, it was a great challenge to get them before they escaped. Payback time one day to come for that.
First full disclosure. I am an entomologist, and unfortunately I kill a lot of insects in my work. It bothers me, but I don't know how to get around it and still get the information I need. My work is in ecology and conservation, so the ends are good but the means are unpleasant.
That said, I do not kill insects I encounter that are not part of my research. With very few exceptions (yellow jackets and blow flies), insects are welcome in my house. Those that are not welcome are escorted outside.
When I collect insects in the field, I'd rather not see them "suffer" - frantically try to escape, fight with one another, overheat, etc so I take some pains to dispatch them quickly and humanely. That's probably more helpful to my comfort than theirs.
Long story short. It "bugs" me. But I do the work I do because I really care about them and their preservation. Not an excuse, but hopefully a partial mitigator of bad karma.
No, I don't kill any living creature if I can help it. In other words, I never do it deliberately.
Sentient, as we all surely know, means:
1. Having the power of perception of the senses; conscious. 2. Characterized by sensation & consciousness.
A fly definitely has these attributes.
Read the article below from Science Daily on an experiment that was done with fruit flies. They were put into a chamber where one side was a normal temperature and the other side was uncomfortably hot. They learned to avoid the uncomfortably hot side, and stuck to the other side. Why? Because they were feeling discomfort and they obviously had sensory perception to this, and memory.
Regardless of any article, I, not knowing what animals do or do not feel, would not risk harming any living creature, therefore I don't kill them deliberately. Even when I do by accident (accidentally stepping on an ant, etc,) I feel remorse and bring him to a woodsy place and apologize and wish him well in his afterlife/next life if he has one.
Maybe I am humoring myself and doing this for nothing; maybe not. But I try to practice compassion for all earth's creatures and so no, I would never deliberately harm a living creature. I didn't create its' life and so I don't think I have the right to take it.
That's just my personal perspective on it, but I do not debate anyone else's feelings on the matter either, as it is all our personal choice as individuals.
generally i don't want to kill or harm anything, but if i had to i would kill ten million flies! by the very fact of my existence, i kill many beings, yet with this awareness i do not wish to quit existing. besides, what are these little beings doing, being so little and easily killable?
We all have different views. To me non killing is to desire to harm no one, not even an insect. But along with that I also have a desire to protect myself. Ticks cause tick fever. My husband and I have had it twice, and so I protect my animals from ticks, even myself. If a tick gets on me, I will pull it off. I do not like killing it, but I do.
We have grubs in our lawn, but we do not kill them. Japanese beetles cover our fruit trees, bushes, plants; I do not kill them.
Flies get in the house, and if I am cooking and have to set stuff out, I may kill them to protect the food. I read to put water in a baggie with a few pennies and place it on the door post outside and the flies won't come inside. We do that and had very few this year. Does it really work? Who knows? Ants get on the counter, and we try to keep things clean so they won't show up. I read to plant mint outside the kitchen window and have plans this year to do it.
Spiders are allowed in the house and taken outside when necessary. If they are brown recluse or black widows, they are killed. If they are jumping spiders they are adored and allowed to remain inside. If they are tarantulas or wolf spiders, they go out, but not without nervously getting them in a jar. Ugly mole crickets are also taken outside.
We had to have our house treated for brown recluse. I hated doing it. I once sprayed our entire yard for ticks, and now I only spray the wooded area. I don't like how other insects are killed in the process. I love most insects, and the year that we sprayed the yard, we stopped seeing walking sticks and fireflies. I won't even spray the back anymore unless we begin getting ticks on us. This last year fire flies once again appeared in our yard.
I was once at a monastery and told a monk that a black widow was in the bathroom behind the women's toilet bowl. The next week when I arrived it was gone. I knew they just removed it, but they left the egg sack. I saw in my mind's eyes many baby widows hatching and crawling on one of us women. I destroyed the sack. Was I wrong? Perhaps, but maybe it was good karma to protect others from being bitten. Perhaps, as the monks would have said, "If they got bitten it was their karma." But I always believe that it could be my karma to protect others from being harmed.
I don't know. I just know that I don't like killing, and my husband was the one who finally became fed up with the ants on our counter and began killing them. It is very hard to keep a spotless kitchen.
We had lots of mice, so I got a live trap and took the mice to the river. And then I wondered if I had separated any mouse from its babies because maybe they were nursing? And how does a mouse feel to be taken away from its home? We haven't seen a mouse in a very long time because we have 9 feral cats that we feed that hang out and kill mice and sometimes birds. The feral cats are all neutered, and while I don't like their habits; they are only doing what is natural to them. And I don't believe that any animal incurs bad karma from killing to eat because it doesn't have the capacity to understand karma.
Comments
Cheers, WK
Do you suppose God could be new too at some point of time?
Did Buddha say what will become of man in future?
Dear ThailandTom,
If a fly is not a sentient being, we could swat it without a bat of the eyelid?
Dear rainbowwarrior,
Thanks. You know where to find me!
Dear former monk John,
There must be a lot of flies in that temple. If only they keep the place clean…
Dear Whoknows,
I wonder how payback time is like. I wonder if we get squashed back.
That said, I do not kill insects I encounter that are not part of my research. With very few exceptions (yellow jackets and blow flies), insects are welcome in my house. Those that are not welcome are escorted outside.
When I collect insects in the field, I'd rather not see them "suffer" - frantically try to escape, fight with one another, overheat, etc so I take some pains to dispatch them quickly and humanely. That's probably more helpful to my comfort than theirs.
Long story short. It "bugs" me. But I do the work I do because I really care about them and their preservation. Not an excuse, but hopefully a partial mitigator of bad karma.
Some people do it with a good intention.
Dear darjeeling,
There are jobs that are not recommended for Buddhists, I think. An ecologist should not be one of them, I hope.
Sentient, as we all surely know, means:
1. Having the power of perception of the senses; conscious.
2. Characterized by sensation & consciousness.
A fly definitely has these attributes.
Read the article below from Science Daily on an experiment that was done with fruit flies. They were put into a chamber where one side was a normal temperature and the other side was uncomfortably hot. They learned to avoid the uncomfortably hot side, and stuck to the other side. Why? Because they were feeling discomfort and they obviously had sensory perception to this, and memory.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/03/080324173545.htm
Regardless of any article, I, not knowing what animals do or do not feel, would not risk harming any living creature, therefore I don't kill them deliberately. Even when I do by accident (accidentally stepping on an ant, etc,) I feel remorse and bring him to a woodsy place and apologize and wish him well in his afterlife/next life if he has one.
Maybe I am humoring myself and doing this for nothing; maybe not. But I try to practice compassion for all earth's creatures and so no, I would never deliberately harm a living creature. I didn't create its' life and so I don't think I have the right to take it.
That's just my personal perspective on it, but I do not debate anyone else's feelings on the matter either, as it is all our personal choice as individuals.
Thanks! Yesterday, I removed a caterpillar from a plant and threw it elsewhere. It is alive then but I wonder now if it is now.
Dear komm,
When will it be when you have to kill ten million flies?
We have grubs in our lawn, but we do not kill them. Japanese beetles cover our fruit trees, bushes, plants; I do not kill them.
Flies get in the house, and if I am cooking and have to set stuff out, I may kill them to protect the food. I read to put water in a baggie with a few pennies and place it on the door post outside and the flies won't come inside. We do that and had very few this year. Does it really work? Who knows? Ants get on the counter, and we try to keep things clean so they won't show up. I read to plant mint outside the kitchen window and have plans this year to do it.
Spiders are allowed in the house and taken outside when necessary. If they are brown recluse or black widows, they are killed. If they are jumping spiders they are adored and allowed to remain inside. If they are tarantulas or wolf spiders, they go out, but not without nervously getting them in a jar. Ugly mole crickets are also taken outside.
We had to have our house treated for brown recluse. I hated doing it. I once sprayed our entire yard for ticks, and now I only spray the wooded area. I don't like how other insects are killed in the process. I love most insects, and the year that we sprayed the yard, we stopped seeing walking sticks and fireflies. I won't even spray the back anymore unless we begin getting ticks on us. This last year fire flies once again appeared in our yard.
I was once at a monastery and told a monk that a black widow was in the bathroom behind the women's toilet bowl. The next week when I arrived it was gone. I knew they just removed it, but they left the egg sack. I saw in my mind's eyes many baby widows hatching and crawling on one of us women. I destroyed the sack. Was I wrong? Perhaps, but maybe it was good karma to protect others from being bitten. Perhaps, as the monks would have said, "If they got bitten it was their karma." But I always believe that it could be my karma to protect others from being harmed.
I don't know. I just know that I don't like killing, and my husband was the one who finally became fed up with the ants on our counter and began killing them. It is very hard to keep a spotless kitchen.
We had lots of mice, so I got a live trap and took the mice to the river. And then I wondered if I had separated any mouse from its babies because maybe they were nursing? And how does a mouse feel to be taken away from its home? We haven't seen a mouse in a very long time because we have 9 feral cats that we feed that hang out and kill mice and sometimes birds. The feral cats are all neutered, and while I don't like their habits; they are only doing what is natural to them. And I don't believe that any animal incurs bad karma from killing to eat because it doesn't have the capacity to understand karma.
It's all small insects and animals. Nothing said of humans?
Cheers, WK
any organism that can transmit diseases because of its lifestyle is "fair game" in my book; that includes flies, cocoroaches, mosquitos and rats.
For all we know, it could be the other way round. It’s payback time for you daughters! (Joking, too!)
Dear Vincenzi,
What exactly is the difference between precept and a rule? We surely can break both, can’t we?
P
If we wonder, that could mean some are not, or sometimes we are not.
Dear former monk John,
That goes too show some other beings are more sentient than human beings. (serious)
We can be 'unsentient' in many ways.