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Not Nice
lobster
Crusty Veteran
How can anybody ... ? 
The situation in Nice (France), inspired by hate fuelled behavour.
What is the Buddhist plan?
0
Comments
Perhaps it is not 'right time" for me to share my view here at this point ....but just maybe if one awaken to Buddhism , one realize he is constantly alone in the journey of his choice of his will in his world ....and all happening / all nature / all action , every moment as he travel in the journey of life ......is all a great source for own realization . Any incident regardless it nature is actually a great source for him realizing his own existence , realizing his nature , realizing his cause of existence .... so in this regards nothing is good or bad , nothing is right or wrong , nothing is true or false .......as Buddhism is a natural process of realization of own existence not determination of knowledge
I would suggest we're dealing with a group of young men overflowing with anger and attachment who don't have much to live for.
This video may help us understand a little more. Or maybe not?
http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2016/07/11/4496297.htm
I think you are right @Bunks, anger and attachment
My feeling is that as ever we can increase in understanding and metta. Thanks for posting the video. 
It just saddens me, and my thoughts are with the victims and their families.
Plan? Nobody told me about a plan. Help the suffering. Don't respond to hate with more hate. Not much of a plan, is it?
If Buddhism had a way to eliminate hate from a society, every Buddhist culture would be a utopia and we'd have been wiped out long ago by our warrior neighbors because haters cherish their hate. It's worse than any drug. We can try to not give people reasons to hate but there will always be those sociopaths out there, the ones who just don't fit in and nurse every little grievance.
Help all beings. Don't respond to hate with hate. It's not much. It's all we have.
Attacks like this have been going on in Europe for at least 10 years, what I'm not clear about is why they have occurred mainly in France during the last 18 months?
Because France has a far more rigid and severe system in place with regard to its legal and social dealings of migrants.
The hands of those who decide to migrate and settle in France are far more tightly bound and their lives much more restricted, and the conditions of their being permitted to live in France, much more demanding.
France is big. It has roughly the same population as the UK, but id considerably larger. Therefore, there is far more place for settlement.
These attacks are by those who have succeeded in living within France, but under the radar, if you will.
Given the amount of unmonitored space and breadth of France, it's easier than one would imagine, to cultivate resentment and organise activities aong those lines.
I was talking to a Buddhist friend yesterday (just general topics, not about the attack in Nice) and I suddenly determined that I have to have a plan. That doesn't mean I have a vast plan as far as solving the problem of migration or war or terrorist attacks. But I have a responsibility to the world to use my mind wisely. Simply because I know how to do so. Many people do not. They are ignorant of how much control they can have of their minds and deeds. Many still believe their emotions and thoughts control them rather than the other way around. But I know better, and I think that's a big responsibility to recognize and accept. I think here, we mostly all know better. And we need to do better on behalf of the world as a result. I'm not saying we are perfect Buddhists, LOL. I'm just saying, we know we have other choices. We know we can retrain our minds. We know there are better places to make decisions from and we know and at least hold a basic understanding of the 4NT and the ENP. Therefore it's our responsibility to uphold those in our daily lives. Including obviously not responding to hate with hate. But in many other ways, too.
-Demonstrate compassion. Inside us all dwell gods and cannibals. What happened in Nice is nothing new. I have no doubt this type of thing has been going on in one form or another since humans started walking upright and probably before then...
My aunt lives in Nice and is understandably outraged by the events of last night.
I have been speaking to her on Fb about Hatred not being appeased by hatred... She responded that it's all very well being loving, but they should be open to that.
I replied, if they respond favourably, everybody wins. If they do NOT respond favourably, they lose and we then know to manifest compassion with Wisdom, not Idiot Compassion....
10 children among the dead, and some surviving children might have been orphaned.
Awful.
I read that another 50 people are in very critical condition. So very sad. I made the mistake of watching one of the videos that auto-played on a news channel. Horrid. Made me sick to my stomach. I'll never understand how some people can have so little disregard for the lives of others, particularly innocent people who've had nothing to do with the things they've experienced in life. We sure can train our mind in some powerful ways, for good or evil.
It seems the perpetrator worked on his own. He was known to the local Police as a petty criminal, thief and vandal, and had separated from his partner, due to Domestic Violence. He had three children, but was a loner, rarely responded to others when greeted and worked as a delivery driver. All the weapons found in the truck were fake and unusable. Which leads those investigating, to wonder exactly how strong his connection to any Jihadist group actually was.
The bottom line seems to be that this Tunisian Frenchman just decided to wreak havoc and carnage, and indeed turned out to be more successful than any bomb attacks on European soil have hitherto been.
Just beyond understanding....
I would probably only say this to dharma brothers and sisters, as I hope you'll understand without responding with emotional and anonymous judgment: The killer suffered.
I mention this not as an excuse or indication that his suffering was in any way greater than the suffering he caused. I mention it not to detract from the innocent victims - children, families, communities. I mention it b/c it's something I'm working on in my practice. There has been a lot of killing in the news recently. It starts with the killer; he suffers. I believe I must be aware of suffering - my own and other's - to transform it. This had much less to do with any ideology than with this man's suffering.
Excerpted from Thich Nhat Hanh's poem, "Please Call Me By My True Names:"
"I am the twelve-year-old girl,
refugee on a small boat,
who throws herself into the ocean
after being raped by a sea pirate.
And I am the pirate,
my heart not yet capable
of seeing and loving."
Prayers and metta to all the victims of dukkha.
Our politicians are already off and running with the "See? People who want to do bad things will! Where is Obama speaking out against trucks?" Sigh. It's amazing how fast we move to games and blame before they've even named victims.
Yes, it's the "people will kill other people using bombs and knifes and such so it's useless to ban assault rifles" argument. Of course the argument is not built on logic, or we could simply point out that a man with an assault rifle and a bag of clips can kill a lot more than 70 people and won't have to wait until they're all crowded onto a street. It's also easy to keep trucks being used to kill people by just putting some temporary cement barriers on the street, even if they have the truck. You can't keep someone from walking into a crowd with a gun under their jacket once they have the weapon and ammo.
But as I said, it's not logical. It's the mind grasping at whatever it needs to defend its emotions.
Thanks guys
As an angry person, I find emotional outbursts of this magnitude difficult to comprehend. Of course our first responses are outrage, incomprehension, empathy for the victims etc. However as some have wisely counselled, we can at least aspire to our ideals of comprehending even the perpetrators suffering ...
... emotional stability and looking beyond our natural first responses is one of the side effects of practice.
We does haz plan!
I love having you here, @lobster
To sit .....
To sit = Bullshit.
There are countless thousands of people round the world holding vigils, lighting candles and reciting prayers all fo which have absolutely zero effect on the pertinent perpetrators, who probably sit there laughing, rubbing their hands in glee and asking "seriously? Is that all you got!?"
While Politicians and Governments spout platitudes and commiserations, while doing little else, sitting - and all it entails - is wonderful in theory, but absolutely pointless. If that's all that is done.
We need a healthy combination of @kerome's wholesome advice, with some seriously Wise ass-kicking. Omitting the retaliatory violence, of course.
Indeed, sitting and prayer and thoughts will not solve the problems. BUT they can lead to wiser decision-making and reaction. Just in very small moments in my daily life, stopping to take deep breaths has an immediate effect on how I feel and my ability to calm my emotions and thus my reaction. Most people can benefit from that, at least. Not that it'll solve huge world problems. But it at least can help prevent more problems.
This guy makes some interesting points...
What would you do that the authorities are not already doing? Is there any way we can help the families and victims that aren't already being done? We can run around and make noise, but this has as much to do with ISIS in this case as that massacre in the gay club. It's one sick, angry person who wants to see people die.
Whose asses do we kick? The Islamists are already getting their butts kicked with bombs and bullets, but doing a lot of killing of mostly Muslim innocents in the meantime. When there's nothing to do but grieve at the death and suffering, then sit down and see to your own mind.
For you maybe ....But I do understand the frustration that many people are feeling right now...
It helps them find peace of mind, this for many no doubt, provides a buffer zone from what could for some easily become emotional turmoil ....
@lobster asked
My plan...to monitor the mind....
I sit and watch the/my mind... (knowing that any thoughts arising from anger are pointless, they only serve the ego)...I then carry on doing what I always do, ie, pay mindful attention to thoughts, words and deeds...That's how I practice the Dharma....
~Buddhaghosa~ On becoming "Angry"
"“By doing this you are like a man who wants to hit another and picks up a burning ember or excrement in his hand and so first burns himself or makes himself stink.”
Visuddhimagga IX, 23."
The perpetrator of this horrendous act is 'dead' the French police shot him....
Can these lone wolf type attacks be stopped by rules or law enforcement? Nothing seems apparent to me. Somehow these mass random killings entered the zeitgeist and we can't unring that bell.
I feel helpless to change the situation, all I can think to do is develop love and understanding in myself and hopefully spread it to my sphere of influence...
Blah... I keep deleting and rewriting. Everything I come up with seems hollow and impotent.
Reaction=bullshit [oops] ... sorry about that ...
In the action arena and political samsara it is sometimes thought that fuelling the flames and then wondering why burning arises is constantly enacted. It does not work with the crazed, enraged and emotional trolls many of us are familiar with or may even be ... [that would be me incidentally]
As we learn calm, we develop the capacity to be part of the solution.
We live in a world where compassion for others is possible. Some politicians are beginning to understand this. David Cameron's vision of a 'big society', Jeremy Corbin's call for a 'friendlier politics', Donald Trump's call for ... oh wait he is part of the problem ...
We live as ever in dangerous times, some of us in the hell realms of our own or others making. Are we a mediator or a meditator? Are we a calming measure in our respective fields of endeavour?
It may seem the strangest long term plan of all. Increasing the range of compassion to stop the mad elephant Nalagiri
That's it! DARPA needs to get on this immediately. A compassion gun that stops the crazy rampagers in their tracks.
LOL, instead of tear gas ... Ganga gas ...
Instead of sirens, ambient music ... instead of riot gear ... the flower police
I iz such a hippy
The compassion gun fires the Metta Ray?
I haven't followed this story very closely, but there does seem to be a relative absence of discussion and irony that he was shot & killed by the police.
Huh?
Eh?
I could be wrong but I think @Steve_B might be referring to the recent police shootings in the US....
In this instance though, it would seem that the French police did what they were meant to do ie, to 'serve and protect' (be it not very efficiently, according to some members of the French public, who felt that there was not enough security surrounding the event and that it took the police 20 odd minutes to arrive on the scene)
Let's not divert the discussion, @Steve_B .. it would appear that in spite of their tardiness, at least the Police had what most would consider justifiable and legitimate cause, in this case.
Until now it looks like the act of a “lone wolf”, a depressed individual full of undirected rage.
The only thing that I can think of that prevents this kind of behavior is social control. Family, friends and colleagues can prevent us from going berserk when we have problems. Maybe just by listening to us and keeping us company.
Another thing is probably that imitation is a powerful factor. Spree killers imitate the “solution” other spree killers found for their emotional problems. They end both their irrelevance and their life. For some people that’s two birds with one stone.
Pointing out that there are better ways for doing either is important.
Buddhism I think offers a perfectly workable solution, at least for its members. Practice gives meaning and structure to our lives plus - when we are lucky - a sangha that supports us in our practice.
That should prevent us from choosing the spree killer’s path.
The berzekers were the 'special forces' of the viking era. How else can they win at football against England. I think those alleged footballers have been at the flying reindeer piss ...
http://opcoa.st/0Q3qq
Come the Zombie apocalypse, I'll be standing quietly behind them, chanting sweetly. Iz plan!
[ahem]
Well said @zenff, hard as it is, disturbed and disturbing individuals need compassion BEFORE they get in a lorry or a state.
May all BE WELL
OM MANI PEME HUM
I just don't have an answer.
Perhaps there is no answer.
Maybe we just have to accept that there is going to be the occasional nutcase in our society who is going to randomly kill numerous people then themselves.
You ask, we provide (after we wake up and drink our coffee...)
The forces of compassion may be bolstered by a global outpouring of fellowship, but I think the real battlefield is in creating a kind, accessible, egalitarian society where people's suffering and problems are acknowledged, and where these 'lone wolves' can go to wiser members of their communities to talk through their problems.
The genie of terrorism being out of the bottle is just a shorthand for saying that in radical circles it has become accepted that this kind of violence is a justifiable response to people's internal anger. An angry man who wouldnt normally hurt a fly goes onto the Internet, perhaps gets radicalised, his anger stoked and promised 40 virgins in the afterlife if he goes out and kills random people. Some people seem to have lost the innate respect for life...
It happens less in close-knit communities where people feel they can call on eachother, I think. And that is key. How do you encourage people to connect, to come together, to reach out to the members of their community who are in pain?
Perhaps in Western Europe we haven't done enough, people come and settle but on a local level there often aren't integration initiatives. There may be a beer festival where muslims don't participate, but do we provide room for a coffee festival where Muslims can take a leading role and show something to the community?
Well said @Kerome - do we need radical dharma? Nice retreats on Tunisian beaches with coffee drinking anger merchants, lying mad mullah Islamists and other hot heads?
I think plan iz on its way ...
Radical dharma is a good way of putting it
Buddhists running Guantanamo Bay, lol. But seriously it is not Buddhism itself that is the most important thing here, but the lessons buddhism has to teach. I think getting most of western society to accept Buddhism would be a very tough sell, but the lessons of interdependence and suffering are much more likely to go in, along with mindfulness. It's like Buddhism is teaching a society, not a person, by allowing it to one piece at a time accept the lessons.
But the response of western governments so far is typical, concentrating on security and not on outreach, fighting through the police apparatus rather than non-fighting through engaged hearts and minds.
The awful thing is that in some parts of the world these atrocities are becoming the norm, something expected, almost routine.
Radical 'dharma' was part of the 'First Earth Battalions' radical new age manual commissioned by the US military (yes really)
http://opcoa.st/0Qc99
It is the basis of the fictional but based on fact book and film, 'The Men who Stare at Goats' ( one of my hobbies incidentally
)
I consider the First Earth Manual the nascent exploration of a new kind of warfare for 'hearts and souls'. For obvious reasons new age ideology can not be solely in the hands of military strategists. Though no doubt the alternative intelligence community have moved far beyond these initial efforts ...
Those of us at the extreme edges of religion know 'crazy'. We know it in ourselves, in our society, in our sangha. We also have a plan ... 'Be Kind'.
That perfectly fits something I have been pondering the past week or so. Our emotional reaction to something doesn't depend on the body count or reason behind the tragedy, but rather or not it fits into our expectations of how a normal world operates. We're perfectly capable of hearing about dozens or even hundreds killed somewhere, shugging, making a few polite comments about how tragic, and going on with our lives.
One perfect example, the recent coup attempt in Turkey. At least 90 people were killed in one night from a small group of soldiers and officers trying to take over the government. As many or more than the people in the streets at Nice. Yet the world reacted in shock and dismay from one and shrugged over the other. The difference is, we expect people to be killed when they try to take over a government by force. It doesn't shock us. It fits into how we expect a "normal" world to work. Business as usual.
But people partying in the street are not supposed to be killed by a lunatic in a truck with a grudge against the world. That's not how the world is supposed to work. But, if it happens often enough it starts becoming the norm. Typhoons hit Bangledesh and other impoverished nations every year, killing thousands, but that's the normal and expected thing and it barely makes the news. A hurricane hits the Gulf Coast with enough force to flood New Orleans and it shocks the nation.
So in an increasingly crowded and disenfranchised world, perhaps random acts of mass murder will become the norm. The NRA seems to want this to happen. School full of children gunned down? That's the price you pay for your sacred gun rights. Buy more guns and go about your business.
So this post wandered a bit. Just something that's been on my mind lately.
The interesting thing is, when everything is taken as a whole, the world is actually more safe than it was a number of years ago. It's just that the current "War On" topic is terrorism instead of AIDS or drugs or poverty. On average most people in the world are less likely to be killed by random violence than they were a few years ago. But it sure doesn't feel that way.
I think whenever we are talking about situations, we (even if unintentionally) bring about more division. We rarely think of problems as community problems, but as a problem THEY are creating that WE have to solve. Whether we are talking about BLM or random mass shootings or lone wolf terror attacks or even larger scale organized attacks one of the main themes when you start looking at the roots is desperation. And the western world coalitions, led usually by the US, the UK and France are heavily responsible for creating desperation in the Middle East, in Israel and Palestine etc. Desperate people have nothing to lose and want to strike out against the people they perceive are responsible for that desperation (and sometimes that means society as a whole). We call them sickos, but in reality, we created that state in a lot of people by our global policies and war. We turn people to desperate situations and then we are shocked when they strike back.
I really like this. I think it means too that if we are shocked and outraged at something it isn't necessarily a sign that the world is getting worse. It could be that its getting better because maybe something that was considered normal before now shocks us.
Case in point @karasti ....yet another shooting of police officers this time in Baton Rouge
Yes, it most certainly carries over in all the ways that we create a us vs them distinction. The continued war between cops and non-whites is just going to continue to escalate. Every incident creates a stronger foothold in us, and in them. And it means both sides are ever more tense in dealing with each other, which raises the chances of something bad happening with every interaction. And then more retaliation in anger. And round and round we go. The same with extremist Muslims and our dealings with them.
It should shock us. However ... if we dwell on the carnage in Nice, Syria or Trumps potential wake, we will end up dukkhad
I am a great believer in dharma shock troops, special forces Sanghas, descending on areas of potential suffering (starting with our own being) and normalising the ups, downs and sideways ...
Have Dharma, will Practice for Well Being
That actually isn't such a bad idea... Parachute in Buddhist monks instead of the US Army when trouble flares up in a given place.
The difficulty comes when the resident men with guns forget their respect for the monks and nuns and priests who run whatever local institutions there are.