Examining one's own beliefs
person
Don't believe everything you thinkThe liminal space Veteran
I think an important part of living a spiritual life is examining and challenging one's own beliefs. In order to live more consciously we need to uproot many ingrained assumptions we have about the world. Also much of the information available today comes more in the form of a lawyer arguing one side of the case rather than a scientist taking an unbiased look at the whole picture to understand what is really going on, so its easy to draw conclusions and form beliefs based on only partial information.
Recently whenever I find myself on the lookout for bias in reporting and often when I find myself agreeing with an article I'll make a conscious choice to find something that argues the opposite. My mind isn't usually changed but sometimes there are good points made that should be taken into consideration or at least I'll have a better understanding of other people.
I'll be lots of you have heard the phrase "97% of climate scientists agree that global warming is occurring and is largely man made". Well I decided to challenge my assumption and found out that that number is cherry picked and inaccurate. That's not to say that there isn't scientific consensus, but I won't be using that number as it could undermine any point I try to make.
Also as a straight, white, male my privilege wasn't obvious to me, it was just the way the world worked. So seeing that the world didn't work the same for everyone takes self reflection and a willingness to challenge basic assumptions.
What beliefs have you overturned and what do you do to continue to overturn the apple cart?
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So so many. I could write a book. I grew up in a town with 3,000 people that is 99% white. 1% Native American. I didn't meet or talk to a black or Asian person until I was in 8th grade when a family moved to town from Minneapolis. Beliefs about people of different races, different sexualities, people from other countries, beliefs about war, beliefs about environmental concerns in our local area, beliefs about religions. I learned how to think about these issues in college more than anything. I moved to a bigger city and lived there for quite a few years, and worked there. Work added another dimension, where I met obese people, people from Palestine who helped me challenge the strong US view of unwavering support for Israel, immigrants from other areas, people with chronic medical issues like MS, people who were cancer survivors. So many things, lol. I learned how to watch what I say. I learned that when something grabs me and irritates me, that it's an opportunity to bridge a gap and find common ground.
I still challenge my views constantly, and much the same as you, when I find myself clinging to and defending my views, I look at the other side. But I admit I get frustrated that so few people do the same. Edit to add I get especially frustrated at people who completely shut down when their beliefs/views are challenged. Their fear becomes so palpable and I wish they could see that challenging their views would actually alleviate that fear.
Ah apple cart overturning, seems like a fun hobby.
Yes certainly look at why Trump is good for Russia The Americas and China. Or why Hinayana is not the same as Theravada etc.
I practiced extreme alternative thinking, when I found out that 30% of Americans believed the moon landing was faked. Ay caramba! Could I make a case that the Eiffel Tower did not exist. To do such a task in such an extreme example, you have to 'suspend your disbelief'? Crazy stuff. Not recommended ...
I do not think it is necessary to challenge or do battle with beliefs. Intellectually, it may be fun and seem to make sense, but beliefs of any sort are limited and betoken nothing so much as doubt. This conclusion presents itself during meditation practice. Belief ... is ... doubt.
And it's OK -- OK to believe; OK to doubt, OK not to make too much out of it all.
The direction of Buddhism, if it has one, is limitlessness. A single word or thought or belief and poof! -- what is limitless becomes limited and we're back on track for a new round of unsatisfactoriness/suffering/dukkha.
To get into a Jell-O-wrestling match with beliefs does little more than encourage them. It's like poison ivy -- scratch it and the itch gets worse.
And so it is probably better to sit down someplace quiet and clean and be still ... and see what happens. Beliefs, like cars, run out of gas. Just watch and see what actually happens and after a while the need to challenge or contradict or dislodge loses its savor.
I trust you will not believe me.
I'm currently challenging my spirituality and why I feel I need to justify who I am to people rather than letting them deal with their issues.
Over the years I have had a rather meandering path spiritually. But it always has led me back to Buddhism. I have held onto the belief of a "higher being" but have challenged that over the last 2 years or so. I'm at the stage where I question why I still hold onto it. Is it because of my upbringing (Jewish mother/Catholic father = Queen of the Self Guilt Trips), because it's still the "norm" (even though atheism, agnosticism, non theism are on the rise) or something entirely different.
Re the justification issue - I think it has a lot to do with my mother's background. As a child it never occurred to me that I was different, a potential target for harrassment etc and life was pretty good. For the last ten years or so, since I have publicly acknowledged my Jewishness, I have been subject to harrassment or anti Semitism at least once daily. Seriously. I went through periods of hiding it or denying it, but that felt so wrong and horrible. So then when the usual abuse started "You live off the blood of Palestinians", "Jews are responsible for xyz", "Jews control all the money in the world through the banks" (I WISH) or, my personal favourite "What a shame Hitler didn't finish the job before he died" (Actually he killed himself because he was a gutless turd, but I digress) I would always feel like I had to apologise for being Jewish, white,female and educated. In the end, I got fed up. So I sat down and had a good hard think about it and, after crying a few bucketloads of tears, realised I could NEVER satisfy everyone with my answers about ANY subject, not just my background. So I decided I wouldn't do it anymore. It's been really hard to keep my mouth shut and at times, I give the following reply - There are three groups of Jews in this world. Jews by birth (blood), which I am. There are Jews by faith including conversion, which I have been/might still be, and then there are Jews born in Israel. Now you need to decide if it's ALL Jews that you despise or only one group, And if it is the Israelis then you need to consider that not all Israelis are Jews. There are Israeli Christians and Muslims who are referred to as Israeli Arabs. And they ALL live, work and worship their faith in Israel. I am not an Israeli, have never set foot in Israel and have never raised a finger to a Palestinian. So tell me again how the conflict in Gaza is all my fault?
I admit, it's not a particularly Buddhist approach to the situation and while I feel vindicated saying it, I still feel crappy afterwards and wish I never had to say it again. Again, I can't make people change their views on Israel, Jews, Gaza or Palestine so I am aiming at being able to let that go and not own anyone else's drama. In theory it's a great plan, in practise................
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As the son of a philosophy major I was always taught to listen to all sides in an argument and gather up the resulting pearls. That led me to spend my 20s drifting across the states and their subcultures actively trying to see life through each new pair of shoes. I learned many things that I would hear again being taught here on the Buddhist path.
Things like even when someone does a horrible thing, at the time they were doing it they honestly felt that it was a good idea. Very few people people decide that "I am going to commit a reprehensible act". Or that no matter how disliked someone is by some people there are people who care for and love the same person very deeply.
My experiences in addition to the teachings of the Buddha have allowed me a cherished insight into the dharma by seeing through the illusion "them and me",
I've always been quite an accepting, accommodating being with a long streak of diplomacy in my nature. When my dad separated from my mom when I was eight I stayed with him, and didn't blame him very much. When my dad went off to the Osho communes when I was nine I just came along and accepted the differences.
So when I had to take an enforced career break aged 39, I ended up re-examining many things, including Osho's place in my life and the layers of scientific materialism that a career in engineering had built up in me. I went back, listened to many of Osho lectures. I reconnected to him and my heritage, but in the end concluded that his path for me was incomplete, that in order to seek further I would have to look elsewhere.
That eventually led me to Buddhism. It was a question of looking beyond Osho's lectures on Buddhism, a quest to find the original source. It has been very enriching... But I am keeping ownership of the path. It has only recently been clear to me how by accepting my father's path I had thrown a way some of my own expression, some of my own choices.
But that is what you do as a child, you follow along, in a kind of bliss. I just forgot to rebel, which most people do in their teenage years. Until the last few years, where I have slowly been gaining awareness of all kinds of things to do with my past, and overthrowing them.
Generally the sense that a lot of these questions are very complex, and I usually don't have enough information to have an informed view. So "Oi dunno!" is often a more sensible response.
And the realisation that opinions are just opinions, and they don't always have be taken too seriously.
"Vaccha, the position that 'the cosmos is eternal' is a thicket of views, a wilderness of views, a contortion of views, a writhing of views, a fetter of views. It is accompanied by suffering, distress, despair, & fever, and it does not lead to disenchantment, dispassion, cessation; to calm, direct knowledge, full Awakening, Unbinding."
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/mn/mn.072.than.html
I don't know why percentages are still used in studies like that. Even if they're bang on, all it takes is a few fresh faces and a few retirees to change it.
I like to say I have no beliefs but it may be more accurate to say I have no faith in my beliefs. If proof comes about which nullifies a belief, it's good to be able to let that belief go.
I'm not sure if you're kidding on the square here or just making a joke. If I take it seriously though its a good point. There are so many things we believe about the world that one, we don't have time to look at them all and two, many of them are so easily shown to be true that there isn't much point spending time diving into conspiracy theories.
On the other hand though we've seen regularly throughout history that widely held beliefs have been overturned. Even something like time, the Newtonian view still holds true for everyday life but if we take a broader perspective we can see that it isn't something so set in stone.
Where is the line between ridiculous and hard to see truth?
I'll make a distinction between explicit beliefs like "I believe that aliens are visiting Earth" or "I believe in helping old ladies across the street" and implicit beliefs like "the world is the same for everyone else as it is for me a straight, white, man" or "people can't be trusted"
Also the epistemological (philosophy of knowledge) definition of knowledge is a "justified, true, belief" (with a few extra caveats). So I can believe I am younger than you, but it doesn't become actual knowledge until I have justification (l can see your picture and you look older). At present I can't verify the truth of that belief though so it isn't knowledge. So I'm just saying that all knowledge falls into the category of belief and thus gaining new information (ie. that's not your actual face) changes my beliefs.
That is a good question.
Making ourselves ameniable and receptive to the truth, may mean taking on ridiculous but effective measures. For example the rituals and blind folds of Tantra, Freemasonry and alchemy are to protect the innocent, unsuitable and mad crusties.
The yidam tradition is ludicrous. Praying to and becoming many armed Hindu Hoodoos. However ...
it works
Excuse me whilst I turn red, drink some blood and stomp on a few demons (just one of my hobbies)
OM MANI PADME SLURP ...
and now back to the unbelievers ...
http://opcoa.st/0pfpW
I think we probably run into a bit of a problem using the word "belief" at all because it can have such different connotations depending what it's meant in our lives to this point. @genkaku I agree with what you said, I think. But I think investigating them and realizing things about other beliefs is how we begin to arrive at the point that we don't need to be so attached to them, and that that very act of figuring it all out, contributes to the whole mess. But to arrive there is a journey, even if we understand it logically I think most of us have to go through the process to get there.
I am much more ok with saying "I see both sides" when a big disagreement comes up. And it's true, I can see things from both sides. But I still tend to lean one direction and often the disagreement involves making a decision, like electing a president or expressing desires for or against local projects. It seems like, in order to arrive at a place that I can make a decision and take an appropriate action, that holding onto beliefs about that issue is kind of required? It is definitely a lot of mental masturbation but I'm also not sure how to live in and make decisions in this world without it. I think Buddha wouldn't have to think. He would just know the right course to take. I'm not quite there yet, lol.
But, seeing things from both (or multiple) sides/directions an lead to a lot of inner conflict, so I haven't resolved that, either. Often having an opinion on something seems really important because "everyone" is talking about it. Yet the world would go on, and decisions would be made, without my input. But no one wants to feel responsible for poor decisions being made when they don't make an effort to influence things in what they think is the right direction. And we all vary so much on what we think that is.
To the extent that I am guilty of setting off a pissing match about belief, I apologize. That was not my intent. I am not somehow against belief. But I do favor what actually works. Experience shows that over time, belief doesn't work, which is to say that it will not accord with what is demonstrably true. Belief is wonderful as an encouragement. But in practice, there comes a day and time when belief simply enters its own shadow -- which is to say, disbelief. Belief is limited and in practice, limited stuff is what we've got to work with. So... belief is OK. Not good or bad or better or worse ... it's just (from a practice point of view) not terribly relevant. It's like the kid who is dying to learn to ride a bike. He believes he can do it because all his good friends are zooming up and down the street. If they can do it, so can he. So he practices, is grateful for mom's application of Band-Aids and kissing-it-better. He practices and falls and gets up and falls and still he believes ... right up to the moment when he knows how to ride. Woo-hoo! But what happens to belief when what is believed in is simply true? Who needs to bother believing s/he can ride a bike when, in fact, s/he already can?
No pissing match here, I find it all quite interesting. I understand your point and I totally agree. But when I am talking about beliefs, I am talking more about, let's say, people who hold views that don't involve action, necessarily. So someone who believes all Muslims are terrorists, for example. For them to shift that harmful view, it is going to require them to investigate it. How does that fit into what you said? I'm just curious what you think about it in that respect. Most of us, at some point in life, hold beliefs that we are taught by parents etc. Until we experience otherwise, which at that point we no longer need the belief because experience takes its place. But we also hold beliefs about things we might never experience, and it is then (I think) that we need to investigate them in our minds and make some choices about continuing to carry those beliefs.
I understand what you are saying, I just am unsure how to apply it to things like opinions, view, attitudes, etc. I feel like I am in 9th grade algebra staring at the problems and not quite getting it. It'll click eventually, LOL.
@genkaku
I hear what you're saying and I mostly agree. Like @karasti says though not all beliefs fit into an easily provable category. Also in my view, which may be just a semantical difference, even after the kid has learned to ride a bike he still believes he can ride a bike, the difference is in his level of confidence and not a whole different category of experience.
It's interesting because belief, or perhaps rather our belief about belief, actually has a very strong impact on us. A few studies now are showing that even what we eat, how we feel and believe about the food (good food or bad food) impacts how our body deals with it. That's why, I think, it's so common for us to use phrases like "believe in yourself!' because it does have some sort of impact on our ability to follow through and break through those mental walls that so often hold us back. It's quite an interesting thing. Of course, a lot goes into defining belief at all, but the power of our mind is just really interesting.
In the example of the bike, if they have a strong belief that they can't ride the bike, it very well may make them unable to ride the bike. Time and time again you see that with people who are "bad at math" because their belief they are bad at math has actually helped ensure they are bad at math. Getting rid of the belief will clear the way. But that process in the head still has to be cleared before it translates into the body's actions, as I understand it due to the relationship of the hypothalamus and the autonomic nervous system. Your feelings about something as simple as a bowl of ice cream can impact how it is digested. that's pretty fascinating stuff to me. And puts "placebo" in a whole new light.
So i guess having read some of those studies, I'm not so sure that simply excusing belief as unimportant or that it doesn't matter, works. When it comes to specifically religious beliefs and Buddhism, definitely, that can be a different things. But for example TNH covers this a lot in his mindfulness trainings. Living in the present moment, when you are consistently thoughtful and life from a place of gratitude, then it's easy to extend that and see why it has so many benefits to our health overall. It changes the chemistry in our body.
@karasti
You bring up a good point about placebo's. We used to think of it as being something imaginary in your head. More recent research shows that there are actual physical responses that occur. For example believing you have taken pain medication while only taking a sugar pill actually, physically releases endorphins that dull pain. The same effects have been shown with other things too even things like parkinsons. So if a treatment works only as well as a placebo that means it actually has a noticeable positive effect not that it has no effect.
I will believe anything, whether true or not, is of little consequence ...
... wait, I think I have gone wrong again ...
Very good points guys.
Belief as:
I think, therefore I am a Yam as one of the French almost believed
Maybe I need to examine the assumptions behind my assumptions? Where to start?
If I just believe I can ride a bike I could question that and be thrown off keel.
If I know I can ride a bike I ride a bike and that's that.
Before I could ride a bike I knew I would either learn or I wouldn't.
I'm not really sure why the definition of knowledge and belief sticks in my craw so much.
Maybe I'm a philosophical pedant or I'm hopelessly skeptical and lack confidence in the certainty of truth. Philosophically belief is a necessary component of knowledge and not something completely different.
I guess I'd just recommend watching a short intro video to the philosophy of knowledge.
I'm pretty sure we don't "know" half as much as we think we do.
Ah, ya don't know nothin' yet!
Each age marvels at the ignorance of the prior ages and again at how much they knew.
Naturally, all knowledge is learned and subject to change.
What say we all go down to Spiney's Temple of the Vanilla Dharma and imbibe in a few scoops (or several).
Peace to all
I now believe in the impermanent nature of my beliefs....and I don't believe this belief will change any time soon.........if ever....Reflection/Challenge/Meditation....
I'm a bit dumb. Can you rephrase this question please?
How do you challenge your assumptions and knowledge about the world?
Exactly. Not only impermanence but the acceptance of fluidity and letting go of attachments ...
For example do we believe a cat can be alive and dead? Far fetched unless a quantum puss. How far do we believe the transcendence of limitations extend? Are we living in a multiverse - how can we possibly fully comprehend? Is paranirvana even a possibility for dead Buddhas? So beliefs can be questioned indefinitely or just allowed to arise and dissipate ...
Reflection/Understanding/Meditation ... and back to Reflection ...