Welcome home! Please contact lincoln@icrontic.com if you have any difficulty logging in or using the site. New registrations must be manually approved which may take several days. Can't log in? Try clearing your browser's cookies.
I've found Pema Chödrön's advice extremely helpful on this:
"When we come to that place where we say, “Thinking” - we can just say it with an unbiased attitude and with tremendous gentleness. Regard the thoughts as bubbles and the labeling like touching them with a feather. There’s just this light touch - “Thinking” - and they dissolve back into space..."
M-1: you're on the right track, just come back to the breath when you realize you've strayed from it.
Breathing technique: some advocate following the natural breath. On the other hand, many instructors teach taking very slow, deep breaths, pushing the breath down into the abdomen, engaging the diaphragm, then letting the air back up very slowly. With this technique, you should be able to slow the breath to two breaths per minute. What this does is switch the nervous system from active to quiet, it engages the calming, parasympathetic nervous system, and therefore helps quiet the mind. This has been proven clinically, doctors and nurses recommend it. It decreases stress hormones in the system, calming the mind and supporting health. However, for some people it's easier and less distracting to simply maintain natural breathing and to follow that. You could experiment and see what works best for you.
I've found Pema Chödrön's advice extremely helpful on this:
"When we come to that place where we say, “Thinking” - we can just say it with an unbiased attitude and with tremendous gentleness. Regard the thoughts as bubbles and the labeling like touching them with a feather. There’s just this light touch - “Thinking” - and they dissolve back into space..."
that is a really beautiful analogy, thanks.
On the other hand, many instructors teach taking very slow, deep breaths, pushing the breath down into the abdomen, engaging the diaphragm, then letting the air back up very slowly.
@dakini I do this... before and sometimes during meditation and when I need to relax quickly in life, RE: had to give a public talk the other day. It really works, and if you can master it you can purposefully cause your body to relax at will. it's really a wonderful & useful skill to have.
"[1] Breathing in long, he discerns, 'I am breathing in long'; or breathing out long, he discerns, 'I am breathing out long.' [2] Or breathing in short, he discerns, 'I am breathing in short'; or breathing out short, he discerns, 'I am breathing out short.'
I've also heard certain teachers comment that this may have been what the Buddha meant in the Anapanasati Sutta. Many very well respected teachers teach starting meditation with long breathing. Usually when I start meditation with long breathing it naturally settles down into a shorter breath more natural breath. It makes sense in light of the above Sutta.
One good thing to realize is that ultimately you will know what is comfortable for you physically (breathing) and mentally (thoughts). If you keep practicing you will come to a point in which you are comfortable. Just keep that comfort with you throughout your practice. It progresses over time and eventually we will have very little questions because the answer lies in the practice itself.
Meditation isn't to achieve states. That is only using dharma, but it will not liberate a person from thirst. Buddha only taught one thing and that is liberation from suffering via the eightfold path. The means to see the layers of thirst: ideation, sensory, identity, and existence.
Unless we are Buddha, it's normal experiencing chatting of mind, and the degrees vary. It's simply your dualic mind assessing and controlling thoughts arise from the manner in your meditation. Never should you desire for an objective in meditation. As you are in breathing meditation, just focus on breath and not on focus, just the breath, nothing but the breath. The purpose is to achieve one pointedness of mind first, so as to stop all the "rough" chatting mind. :thumbsup:
Hi All, Thanks for your replies. your suggestions are all nice.
Currently i am finding myself running into another problem during meditation. What is happening is this: i am trying to focus on my natural breath - what happens is i am not feeling the physical sensation of my breath, it is difficult to explain, i am aware about my breath, i know i am breathing, but that sensation of air coming inside the nose sometimes i am not able to feel - then i try to focus on feeling the sensation of breath, but when i am not feeling the air in my breath, my mind goes into worry-whether my focus on breathing is proper or not-this is not to say that i am literally saying this thing in my mind that now i have to give more focus on my breath, but i am feeling a worry that my focus is not proper - Then when i am feeling the sensation sometimes, then a worry comes up regarding if my posture is ok-same like breath feeling-saying nothing in mind but a thought comes and i observe the body has moved slightly - then i try to make my head straight again over my neck - then worries come where is the concentration in my meditation.
the things are i am focussing on natural breath, so dont want to do cautious breathing - thoughts come and i am not forcing the thoughts out of my mind - this leads to my concentration getting shattered almost always - So how to improve my concentration in my meditation?
Moreover, the question is am i moving in round circles and coming back to where i started or am i progressing in some manner? Moreover my general behaviour does not seem to change much, even though i wish to change. Just to let you all know, i become angry very easily and i am a very egoistic person as i want things to be done as my way - i want to change these things in me by trying to make my mind calm - but my meditation does not seem to change my attitude.
if you lose the physical sensation of the breath that's fine. i currently cant feel ANYTHING in my nose at all because of allergies. it's not necessary to use the physical sensation, it's just usually easiest in my experience. Ajahn Brahm teaches not to use that at all:
"I have found through experience that it does not matter where you watch the breath. In fact, it is best not to locate the breath anywhere! If you locate the breath at the tip of your nose, then it becomes nose awareness, not breath awareness; and if you locate it at your abdomen, then it becomes abdomen awareness. Just ask yourself the question right now "Am I breathing in or am I breathing out?" How do you know? There! That experience which tells you what the breath is doing, that is what you focus on in breath meditation. Let go of concern about where this experience is located; just focus on the experience itself. "
daily practice is vital. your concentration will improve the more you RELAX and LET GO, and learn to note those worries and thoughts and let them pass. you will eventually get to the point where the breath takes up the 'center' of the mind and the thoughts flow on the outside. they are much less invasive and its much easier to note them and let them go. you are going to find the more you meditate the more very volatile and charged emotions and feelings may come up. the key is to note & let go... NOT to become engaged in them and start chatting with yourself about if you're doing it right. you ARE doing it right, just trust the method and relax.
it takes time. you've only been meditating for a month or so, you cant expect any serious results in your waking life just yet. you really should try not to focus on results, i promise this will not lead you anywhere positive. results make themselves apparent.
you cant just meditate anger away on the cushion. a mind calmed by regular practice isnt devoid of defilement... it just gives you the ability to see the defilements clearly! once you can see and comprehend them clearly, you will be better able to deal with them. not that you need to WAIT until your mind is calm to start trying to deal with them... you need to learn skillful means to deal with those emotions when they arise by applying the 8fold path. Bhante Gunaratana's book called '8 mindful steps to happiness' is a simple, practicle guide to the 8 fold path and has some really beatiful and effective ways to deal with things like anger. i suggest you read it.
The worries are ok to have. Please don't think your meditation experience is the wrong one and you have to get the right one.
Its the nature of the mind to wake up. In that small moment when you 'come back' you have a chance to observe the nature of mind to come back. However most often we are heavy with ourselves and say 'I made a mistake I drifted from the breath'. Its a process of gentleness and stability.
Abandon thoughts of fruition. Just be. You don't have to do anything or get anything. You won't get anything because you are learning to let go.
0
personDon't believe everything you thinkThe liminal spaceVeteran
We don't get rewarded for doing everything 'right' in meditation. Medititation is like exercise for our mind. You don't go to a gym and get the technique perfect and suddenly you get 6 pack abs and 24 inch biceps. Of course in exercise there are methods that work to get the results you want better than others so its good to want to meditate properly. But you keep at it and slowly you can lift more and run farther than before. There's no switch that you flip and suddenly you change, what you're trying to do is slowly develop a different way to relate to your thoughts and emotions, it just takes time. You are asking the right questions and you sound determined so keep it up and as you look back after weeks, months and years you'll notice a difference.
The solution is to simply relax - allow your body to float in the water and for the waves to pass through you - you will rise and fall naturally and no energy will be expended.
That is a really beautiful and skilful analogy. Thanks
All the beauty and skill is in the great natural perfection - thank you for the smile I'm wearing
these days during my meditation what is happening is this - through out my meditation, i think i am aware of what is coming to my mind(i am not saying these things in my mind) like i am breathing, i am just sitting in between 2 breaths, some thought comes to my mind and after few seconds i realize i have to meditate on breath and then sometimes i do cautious breathing and then start natural breathing. But the concentration seems to be completely missing till now. So what to do to increase my concentration?
Moreover, somehow i am doubting that whether i am forcefully making my mind to concentrate on my breath or i am mindfully switching to my natural breath - how to decide this thing?
Whenever i hear some noises, my mind and brain makes out what is this sound about, then i have to tell my mind to let go of it as it is in reality just a sound wave hitting my ears - But again this i am doing manually in my mind - when will my mind understand to realize this thing automatically?
these days during my meditation what is happening is this - through out my meditation, i think i am aware of what is coming to my mind(i am not saying these things in my mind) like i am breathing, i am just sitting in between 2 breaths, some thought comes to my mind and after few seconds i realize i have to meditate on breath and then sometimes i do cautious breathing and then start natural breathing. But the concentration seems to be completely missing till now. So what to do to increase my concentration?
keep doing what you are doing. when you realize you were lost in thoughts, you simply go back to the breath.
Moreover, somehow i am doubting that whether i am forcefully making my mind to concentrate on my breath or i am mindfully switching to my natural breath - how to decide this thing?
just keep going back to the breath, this kind of subtle nuances will become clearer with time.
Whenever i hear some noises, my mind and brain makes out what is this sound about, then i have to tell my mind to let go of it as it is in reality just a sound wave hitting my ears - But again this i am doing manually in my mind - when will my mind understand to realize this thing automatically? Please suggest. Thanks in advance.
when your concentration have increased, it will be much easier to not get distracted by noises and thoughts. Thoughts will be less abundant and less distracting.
you seem to be doing very well, i think you should just keep doing it and you will discover the answers to your questions yourself
i am feeling very disappointed these days for my meditation. it is not that i am expecting something to happen in my meditation. but somehow i am not able to concentrate on my natural breath - sometimes external noises come in my ears and my mind starts visualizing those things as my wife is saying this thing and my child is crying or making noise - sometimes if there is no external noise, then some thought comes and i get engaged in it, same as what was happening in beginning - then i try to force myself on to my natural breath and then a thought arises if my mind is making a mental formation here by trying to forcefully still it in the silence between two breaths, then i realize that this is a thought and i have to let go of it and come back to natural breath, then some external noise comes and everything goes to pieces.
Seems like i am never going to get any sort of concentration in my meditation. But still trying to sit everyday for sometime. Any suggestions please on how can i improve my meditation now. Please suggest.
Hi All, any more suggestions, please. it seems these days, somehow i get more entangled in thoughts in comparing to previous days - so am i moving in round circles and going back to previous stages instead of moving forward, or at least staying at a better position previously achieved? please suggest.
Pema Chodron says, "the nature of mind is to think. So the purpose of meditation is not to get rid of thoughts. If you try to get rid of thoughts you may get very frustrated. [pause] You may even try to commit suicide [laughs]."
It sounds like you worry alot... do you think that would sum up your personality? Perhaps life has put you in a position where responsibility weighs heavy on you - if that is the case, you may feel more relaxed if you face those challenges and the stress they cause you.
The reason I say this is that despite having an active family (with the joy of screaming kids running about!) you are still trying to meditate - also despite the frustrations you have felt you continue to try and rather than giving up you post something here for help - you are clearly committed to your cause despite the frustration you are experiencing.
Be encouraged that you are a good practitioner and that what you consider to be faults may not be faults at all.
Perhaps try changing the time that you meditate - maybe early or late when there arent as many distractions - also try to change the length of time that you meditate - one way would be to have more frequent shorter periods - for example, a friend of mine observes muslim prayer time but uses it more as an opportunity to meditate for a short while rather than to formally pray.
@zero: thanks for your reply. actually i have already applied this suggestion for the last 3 to 4 days and it is slightly helping me.
in early morning, when my child gets up and cries for milk as she is feeling hungry and then she is given milk and then she sleeps for sometime, my wife also sleeps for sometime, i get up at that time only - brush my teeth, have a cup of tea to freshen me up and then sit for meditation on natural breath. i get a margin of half hour till they get awake and the disturbing noise starts. So it is somewhat silent during the initial 30 mins - keeping in mind the external noises of road vehicles, outside people etc which we have to bear.
Hi All, Now a days, because of above - my observations are - i do not try to do cautious breathing, just try to wait and observe my natural breath - my natural breathing is very disruptive i have found - there is a long in breath but very short or virtually no out breath, which is again followed by long in breath - so is this breathing pattern indicating something?
Moreover, i have observed some tingling in my hands in the later part of my meditation - so is it because of numbness or any other factor? it can be numbness but since my hands are on my legs, so nothing is pressing my hands, so i think numbness is not the reason for it or is it numbness only?
you may be beginning to see the vibration quality of the sensations. which mean beginning to break the sensations into their different parts.
my advice would be to stay on them, try to see every single little vibrations that make up the tingling.
once you did this long enough, the vibration quality of all of the sensations will become much clearer for you (some kind of shift happen where you can see the vibrations effortlessly and very clearly). Then it is very easy to directly observe impermanence. (feeling, sensation, pain whatever isn't even here for a second, it is here and then its gone and then another one is here... many times every seconds.)
Yesterday i posted that i am able to get initial 30 min in somewhat silence, and today it all crashed - my daughter(whose age is 8 months) did not slept the whole night yesterday just crying and then we made her sleep, then she slept for 15 min again woke up and cried and this continued till today morning - so as a result, we did not had proper sleep yesterday night.
My meditation is in morning for 45min to 1 hour - just sitting and meditating on natural breath by just observing it.
Since my office is also there, so i just got up today and after tea, sat down for meditation - as expected, my head was falling down, even though i tried to sit properly but all in vain.
As far as observing the sensation is concerned, what i noticed is - sometimes i feel itching or some numbness in my legs, then i try not to itch it or move my legs, even i say in my mind feeling pain and since no i is there, so just feeling pain and not i am feeling pain - strangely enough after few seconds, when i keep on feeling how is it going, then suddenly the sensation is gone and there is no sensation meaning it is back to normal as if nothing occurred. Moreover, i observed few days back, i was about to sneeze during my meditation - just when that feeling came in my nose, i tried to see what is it and also if i could control me not to sneeze, then after few seconds that feeling also went and i did not sneezed - may be it was the starting sensation for sneeze, so not much powerful, because of which i did not sneezed.
i am observing a bright radiance sometimes, but that can be because of external light changing and then falling on my closed eyes. since my eyes are closed in my meditation, so cannot clearly say what is actually happening there.
Moreover, sometimes i feel a very slight vibration in my face(near the area of my eyes, nose etc), when i am in the process of observing my natural breath - i think i am somewhat aware of my heartbeats in those moments.
But still the concentration is totally absent in my meditation.
Meditation is keeping everything meditative. If chatter starts, just watch it. Watch it like how we would watch a baby. When it cries, we tend to it, so it knows we are here to look after it. So it knows that everything is ok.
A student went to his meditation teacher and said, "My meditation is horrible! I feel so distracted, or my legs ache, or I'm constantly falling asleep. It's just horrible!" "It will pass," the teacher said matter-of-factly.
A week later, the student came back to his teacher. "My meditation is wonderful! I feel so aware, so peaceful, so alive! It's just wonderful!'
"It will pass," the teacher replied matter-of-factly.
Pema Chodron in one of her books wrote to think of our wandering thoughts as having a lap full of puppies. When they escape, just gently pull them back in without thinking that they are "bad". Thought it was a nice way to look at it.
I found that I got great benefit from "Guided Meditation" in actual "class" with my Teacher, but fumbled around badly when I tried to do it on my own. On Spotify (no plugs, just what I use), I found many guided mediation recordings (may be on iTunes too) that I used when I am alone and my "sessions" now go much better as the recording guides me through it, anywhere from 6 to 20 minutes. They are not all even Buddhist, but they are all helpful. Most are breathing or other visualization techniques, but any port in a storm!
Meditate in short spurts. Meditate then get up to do something. Keep the same relaxed, mindful attention whatever you are doing. Then go back to meditation. Make normal experience and meditation experience the same. Develop mindfulness throughout the day. Just be with your tiredness. If all else fails then take a nap or splash water. Or just sit through it.
I agree...it's better to practice many short meditation practices or being mindful than one long one. It's okay to practice after you have had a cup of coffee or take s shower
Somehow i am feeling to be able to achieve Enlightenment (or the ending of effects of past/present karma and to end this cycle of birth and death), the only option is to renounce this world. Even though both Lord Krishna and Buddha suggested that by living in this world, this is achievable - but my view is on practical ground reality if we lead a family life, work at a challenging industry etc this does not seem feasible - reason being to end this cycle of life and birth, we have to end becoming, for which we have to end all our desires. we can somehow try to make a determined effort of not having any desire and whatever comes to us is ok to us, but the problem is we cant ask our wife and child to not have any desire of their own - they even if told about this dependent co-arising and inherent emptiness, will not try to apply on themselves, so they will have desires and we being running the house, so it becomes our duty to fulfill their desires, so we have to live in this world and desire some things like some money, some clothes, some food etc if not for us but for them - moreover, the time spent in activities like shopping for them is actually a waste of our time and attention, but we cannot make them understand this and if we negate this shopping to them, they complain that we are becoming incompassionate and inconsiderate towards them. Since all these things i am practically feeling, so i believe to end this cycle of birth and death, the only option seems is to renounce this world - go to a forest or a hill or a monastry and keep on doing meditation.
We can also look at "chatter" as a form of mind excrement. Similar to how our body must produce various waste to continue its process, so does our mind. From looking at it this way, we can see that some of our mental processes are subject to nature, and not within our control.
Since all these things i am practically feeling, so i believe to end this cycle of birth and death, the only option seems is to renounce this world - go to a forest or a hill or a monastry and keep on doing meditation.
In the meantime you can practice mindfulness while shopping and doing the chores.
i am observing a new thing these days: when i am not meditating and doing some work, or going somewhere, then when i just try to focus on my natural breath, then after few seconds a strange feeling comes on my face - it is very difficult to describe - but let me try to explain it and all these things are occurring simultaneously - in front of my open eyes, a slight greying shading starts (means the intensity of the outer light gets reduced) - i feel a very light tingling in the cheek muscles of my face and somehow i start feeling happy with my lips getting into a position which comes when i try to smile.
Has someone any experience about this thing and can suggest what is this thing? i am experiencing this physically, so i think it is not just a mental thought of my mind. Please suggest.
Very informative thread. Like @Sile, I try to follow Pema Chodron's advice to label thoughts "thinking" and not chastise myself for having them while meditating. I then immediately bring my focus back to the breath.
I'm fairly new to meditation myself, but I know long-time practitioners who face these problems. We're always faced with so much in our daily lives; it's only natural that these thoughts would arise and be part of our monkey mind. I think the best practice is to acknowledge that these are thoughts and that they, like everything else, can pass away - the one consistent thing is the breath.
Being mindful of having thoughts and then being mindful of how easily you can let them go in favor of focusing back on the breath. There is a time for thinking and acting on thoughts, but there is a time for stillness, too.
then after few seconds a strange feeling comes on my face - it is very difficult to describe - but let me try to explain it and all these things are occurring simultaneously - in front of my open eyes, a slight greying shading starts (means the intensity of the outer light gets reduced) - i feel a very light tingling in the cheek muscles of my face and somehow i start feeling happy with my lips getting into a position which comes when i try to smile.
Has someone any experience about this thing and can suggest what is this thing? i am experiencing this physically, so i think it is not just a mental thought of my mind. Please suggest.
about the tingling part,
i get that many times everyday, i wouldn't worry about it. You are probably just starting to become more sensitive and noticing subtle things that you couldn't notice before. Just keep noticing them and enjoy them if they are pleasant. Try to notice what is happening exactly, what you are doing before this start to happen...
about the "a slight greying shading starts (means the intensity of the outer light gets reduced)"
did you ever try kasina meditation?
this is a very common thing that happen when you meditate with your eyes open. These things can be a little distracting specially with kasina objects but just remember that this is a great sing, means your attention is stabilizing. Access concentration is right around the corner. (here is a great thread about kasina meditation) http://www.dharmaoverground.org/web/guest/discussion/-/message_boards/message/10206
Comments
"When we come to that place where we say, “Thinking” - we can just say it with an unbiased attitude and with tremendous gentleness. Regard the thoughts as bubbles and the labeling like touching them with a feather. There’s just this light touch - “Thinking” - and they dissolve back into space..."
Breathing technique: some advocate following the natural breath. On the other hand, many instructors teach taking very slow, deep breaths, pushing the breath down into the abdomen, engaging the diaphragm, then letting the air back up very slowly. With this technique, you should be able to slow the breath to two breaths per minute. What this does is switch the nervous system from active to quiet, it engages the calming, parasympathetic nervous system, and therefore helps quiet the mind. This has been proven clinically, doctors and nurses recommend it. It decreases stress hormones in the system, calming the mind and supporting health. However, for some people it's easier and less distracting to simply maintain natural breathing and to follow that. You could experiment and see what works best for you.
that is a really beautiful analogy, thanks.
@dakini I do this... before and sometimes during meditation and when I need to relax quickly in life, RE: had to give a public talk the other day. It really works, and if you can master it you can purposefully cause your body to relax at will. it's really a wonderful & useful skill to have.
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/mn/mn.118.than.html
"[1] Breathing in long, he discerns, 'I am breathing in long'; or breathing out long, he discerns, 'I am breathing out long.'
[2] Or breathing in short, he discerns, 'I am breathing in short'; or breathing out short, he discerns, 'I am breathing out short.'
I've also heard certain teachers comment that this may have been what the Buddha meant in the Anapanasati Sutta. Many very well respected teachers teach starting meditation with long breathing. Usually when I start meditation with long breathing it naturally settles down into a shorter breath more natural breath. It makes sense in light of the above Sutta.
Thanks for your replies. your suggestions are all nice.
Currently i am finding myself running into another problem during meditation. What is happening is this: i am trying to focus on my natural breath - what happens is i am not feeling the physical sensation of my breath, it is difficult to explain, i am aware about my breath, i know i am breathing, but that sensation of air coming inside the nose sometimes i am not able to feel - then i try to focus on feeling the sensation of breath, but when i am not feeling the air in my breath, my mind goes into worry-whether my focus on breathing is proper or not-this is not to say that i am literally saying this thing in my mind that now i have to give more focus on my breath, but i am feeling a worry that my focus is not proper - Then when i am feeling the sensation sometimes, then a worry comes up regarding if my posture is ok-same like breath feeling-saying nothing in mind but a thought comes and i observe the body has moved slightly - then i try to make my head straight again over my neck - then worries come where is the concentration in my meditation.
the things are i am focussing on natural breath, so dont want to do cautious breathing - thoughts come and i am not forcing the thoughts out of my mind - this leads to my concentration getting shattered almost always - So how to improve my concentration in my meditation?
Moreover, the question is am i moving in round circles and coming back to where i started or am i progressing in some manner? Moreover my general behaviour does not seem to change much, even though i wish to change. Just to let you all know, i become angry very easily and i am a very egoistic person as i want things to be done as my way - i want to change these things in me by trying to make my mind calm - but my meditation does not seem to change my attitude.
Please suggest.
daily practice is vital. your concentration will improve the more you RELAX and LET GO, and learn to note those worries and thoughts and let them pass. you will eventually get to the point where the breath takes up the 'center' of the mind and the thoughts flow on the outside. they are much less invasive and its much easier to note them and let them go. you are going to find the more you meditate the more very volatile and charged emotions and feelings may come up. the key is to note & let go... NOT to become engaged in them and start chatting with yourself about if you're doing it right. you ARE doing it right, just trust the method and relax.
it takes time. you've only been meditating for a month or so, you cant expect any serious results in your waking life just yet. you really should try not to focus on results, i promise this will not lead you anywhere positive. results make themselves apparent.
you cant just meditate anger away on the cushion. a mind calmed by regular practice isnt devoid of defilement... it just gives you the ability to see the defilements clearly! once you can see and comprehend them clearly, you will be better able to deal with them. not that you need to WAIT until your mind is calm to start trying to deal with them... you need to learn skillful means to deal with those emotions when they arise by applying the 8fold path. Bhante Gunaratana's book called '8 mindful steps to happiness' is a simple, practicle guide to the 8 fold path and has some really beatiful and effective ways to deal with things like anger. i suggest you read it.
Its the nature of the mind to wake up. In that small moment when you 'come back' you have a chance to observe the nature of mind to come back. However most often we are heavy with ourselves and say 'I made a mistake I drifted from the breath'. Its a process of gentleness and stability.
Abandon thoughts of fruition. Just be. You don't have to do anything or get anything. You won't get anything because you are learning to let go.
@all: thanks for your suggestions.
All the beauty and skill is in the great natural perfection - thank you for the smile I'm wearing
these days during my meditation what is happening is this - through out my meditation, i think i am aware of what is coming to my mind(i am not saying these things in my mind) like i am breathing, i am just sitting in between 2 breaths, some thought comes to my mind and after few seconds i realize i have to meditate on breath and then sometimes i do cautious breathing and then start natural breathing. But the concentration seems to be completely missing till now. So what to do to increase my concentration?
Moreover, somehow i am doubting that whether i am forcefully making my mind to concentrate on my breath or i am mindfully switching to my natural breath - how to decide this thing?
Whenever i hear some noises, my mind and brain makes out what is this sound about, then i have to tell my mind to let go of it as it is in reality just a sound wave hitting my ears - But again this i am doing manually in my mind - when will my mind understand to realize this thing automatically?
Please suggest. Thanks in advance.
when you realize you were lost in thoughts, you simply go back to the breath. just keep going back to the breath, this kind of subtle nuances will become clearer with time. when your concentration have increased, it will be much easier to not get distracted by noises and thoughts. Thoughts will be less abundant and less distracting.
you seem to be doing very well, i think you should just keep doing it and you will discover the answers to your questions yourself
i am feeling very disappointed these days for my meditation. it is not that i am expecting something to happen in my meditation. but somehow i am not able to concentrate on my natural breath - sometimes external noises come in my ears and my mind starts visualizing those things as my wife is saying this thing and my child is crying or making noise - sometimes if there is no external noise, then some thought comes and i get engaged in it, same as what was happening in beginning - then i try to force myself on to my natural breath and then a thought arises if my mind is making a mental formation here by trying to forcefully still it in the silence between two breaths, then i realize that this is a thought and i have to let go of it and come back to natural breath, then some external noise comes and everything goes to pieces.
Seems like i am never going to get any sort of concentration in my meditation. But still trying to sit everyday for sometime. Any suggestions please on how can i improve my meditation now. Please suggest.
Hi All,
any more suggestions, please. it seems these days, somehow i get more entangled in thoughts in comparing to previous days - so am i moving in round circles and going back to previous stages instead of moving forward, or at least staying at a better position previously achieved? please suggest.
Just the tape I am listening to just now
The reason I say this is that despite having an active family (with the joy of screaming kids running about!) you are still trying to meditate - also despite the frustrations you have felt you continue to try and rather than giving up you post something here for help - you are clearly committed to your cause despite the frustration you are experiencing.
Be encouraged that you are a good practitioner and that what you consider to be faults may not be faults at all.
Perhaps try changing the time that you meditate - maybe early or late when there arent as many distractions - also try to change the length of time that you meditate - one way would be to have more frequent shorter periods - for example, a friend of mine observes muslim prayer time but uses it more as an opportunity to meditate for a short while rather than to formally pray.
in early morning, when my child gets up and cries for milk as she is feeling hungry and then she is given milk and then she sleeps for sometime, my wife also sleeps for sometime, i get up at that time only - brush my teeth, have a cup of tea to freshen me up and then sit for meditation on natural breath. i get a margin of half hour till they get awake and the disturbing noise starts. So it is somewhat silent during the initial 30 mins - keeping in mind the external noises of road vehicles, outside people etc which we have to bear.
Hi All,
Now a days, because of above - my observations are - i do not try to do cautious breathing, just try to wait and observe my natural breath - my natural breathing is very disruptive i have found - there is a long in breath but very short or virtually no out breath, which is again followed by long in breath - so is this breathing pattern indicating something?
Moreover, i have observed some tingling in my hands in the later part of my meditation - so is it because of numbness or any other factor? it can be numbness but since my hands are on my legs, so nothing is pressing my hands, so i think numbness is not the reason for it or is it numbness only?
Any suggestions please.
bliss is an easy sell to the mind thus it should automatically propel you to new levels of concentration.
then with a clear mind start to examine phenomena.
i'm not sure what your meditation routine is, but really inquiring and examining reality is most important.
concentration, relaxation, mantra, etc are all setting up the conditions so that you can see clearly into reality and mind.
regardless of weather it is pleasant or not tho.
you may be beginning to see the vibration quality of the sensations.
which mean beginning to break the sensations into their different parts.
my advice would be to stay on them, try to see every single little vibrations that make up the tingling.
once you did this long enough, the vibration quality of all of the sensations will become much clearer for you (some kind of shift happen where you can see the vibrations effortlessly and very clearly).
Then it is very easy to directly observe impermanence. (feeling, sensation, pain whatever isn't even here for a second, it is here and then its gone and then another one is here... many times every seconds.)
i watched a video or listened to a talk by shinzen young.
he talked about how chakras, chi, holy spirit, and impermanence. all meant the same thing when it came to the tactile.
just thought it was interesting. because those vibrations you speak about are the face of impermanence in buddhism. cute stuff.
Yesterday i posted that i am able to get initial 30 min in somewhat silence, and today it all crashed - my daughter(whose age is 8 months) did not slept the whole night yesterday just crying and then we made her sleep, then she slept for 15 min again woke up and cried and this continued till today morning - so as a result, we did not had proper sleep yesterday night.
My meditation is in morning for 45min to 1 hour - just sitting and meditating on natural breath by just observing it.
Since my office is also there, so i just got up today and after tea, sat down for meditation - as expected, my head was falling down, even though i tried to sit properly but all in vain.
As far as observing the sensation is concerned, what i noticed is - sometimes i feel itching or some numbness in my legs, then i try not to itch it or move my legs, even i say in my mind feeling pain and since no i is there, so just feeling pain and not i am feeling pain - strangely enough after few seconds, when i keep on feeling how is it going, then suddenly the sensation is gone and there is no sensation meaning it is back to normal as if nothing occurred. Moreover, i observed few days back, i was about to sneeze during my meditation - just when that feeling came in my nose, i tried to see what is it and also if i could control me not to sneeze, then after few seconds that feeling also went and i did not sneezed - may be it was the starting sensation for sneeze, so not much powerful, because of which i did not sneezed.
i am observing a bright radiance sometimes, but that can be because of external light changing and then falling on my closed eyes. since my eyes are closed in my meditation, so cannot clearly say what is actually happening there.
Moreover, sometimes i feel a very slight vibration in my face(near the area of my eyes, nose etc), when i am in the process of observing my natural breath - i think i am somewhat aware of my heartbeats in those moments.
But still the concentration is totally absent in my meditation.
Any suggestions, please.
"It will pass," the teacher said matter-of-factly.
A week later, the student came back to his teacher. "My meditation is wonderful! I feel so aware, so peaceful, so alive! It's just wonderful!'
"It will pass," the teacher replied matter-of-factly.
Thanks for your replies.
Can some please suggest to my queries, which i have raised in the above post.
http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2010/06/magical-illusion-of-self.html
Read this about ten times. Each time you read it meditate on it.
Hope this helps.
The goal of meditation is not to get rid of thinking
Thanks for your replies.
Somehow i am feeling to be able to achieve Enlightenment (or the ending of effects of past/present karma and to end this cycle of birth and death), the only option is to renounce this world. Even though both Lord Krishna and Buddha suggested that by living in this world, this is achievable - but my view is on practical ground reality if we lead a family life, work at a challenging industry etc this does not seem feasible - reason being to end this cycle of life and birth, we have to end becoming, for which we have to end all our desires. we can somehow try to make a determined effort of not having any desire and whatever comes to us is ok to us, but the problem is we cant ask our wife and child to not have any desire of their own - they even if told about this dependent co-arising and inherent emptiness, will not try to apply on themselves, so they will have desires and we being running the house, so it becomes our duty to fulfill their desires, so we have to live in this world and desire some things like some money, some clothes, some food etc if not for us but for them - moreover, the time spent in activities like shopping for them is actually a waste of our time and attention, but we cannot make them understand this and if we negate this shopping to them, they complain that we are becoming incompassionate and inconsiderate towards them. Since all these things i am practically feeling, so i believe to end this cycle of birth and death, the only option seems is to renounce this world - go to a forest or a hill or a monastry and keep on doing meditation.
Please share your views on the above thing.
Working on oneself is done to save all beings. Until one realizes there is no thing to work on.
Renouncing is about dedicating all actions of body, speech and mind for the sake of all sentient beings.
Intimacy with all things just as they are.
Work less. Or learn to be a buddha in the workplace.
Hi All,
Please share your views on my above post.
Spiny
In the meantime you can practice mindfulness while shopping and doing the chores.
Spiny
i am observing a new thing these days: when i am not meditating and doing some work, or going somewhere, then when i just try to focus on my natural breath, then after few seconds a strange feeling comes on my face - it is very difficult to describe - but let me try to explain it and all these things are occurring simultaneously - in front of my open eyes, a slight greying shading starts (means the intensity of the outer light gets reduced) - i feel a very light tingling in the cheek muscles of my face and somehow i start feeling happy with my lips getting into a position which comes when i try to smile.
Has someone any experience about this thing and can suggest what is this thing? i am experiencing this physically, so i think it is not just a mental thought of my mind. Please suggest.
I'm fairly new to meditation myself, but I know long-time practitioners who face these problems. We're always faced with so much in our daily lives; it's only natural that these thoughts would arise and be part of our monkey mind. I think the best practice is to acknowledge that these are thoughts and that they, like everything else, can pass away - the one consistent thing is the breath.
Being mindful of having thoughts and then being mindful of how easily you can let them go in favor of focusing back on the breath. There is a time for thinking and acting on thoughts, but there is a time for stillness, too.
i get that many times everyday, i wouldn't worry about it.
You are probably just starting to become more sensitive and noticing subtle things that you couldn't notice before.
Just keep noticing them and enjoy them if they are pleasant.
Try to notice what is happening exactly, what you are doing before this start to happen...
about the
"a slight greying shading starts (means the intensity of the outer light gets reduced)"
did you ever try kasina meditation?
this is a very common thing that happen when you meditate with your eyes open.
These things can be a little distracting specially with kasina objects but just remember that this is a great sing, means your attention is stabilizing.
Access concentration is right around the corner.
(here is a great thread about kasina meditation)
http://www.dharmaoverground.org/web/guest/discussion/-/message_boards/message/10206